Lost Issue: Mason Daring Interview Part 2/3

Continued from last week's Lost Issue...

MD: I was referred to them. There were one or two pieces from Osa that got me a lot of work. They were really nice cues that I put on my roll for years. And people would say, "I want something like that." Once I had a couple of those under my belt I thought, "Well, you know, it's not as if I couldn't do this." The question is only, as usual, how good can I do it in the time I have? I mean, it's always a race. And you just understand you're not going to sleep much. The last movie I did...

LD: She Lives to Ride?

MD: No, it was after that. A USA cable movie called Letter to My Killer.

LD: How was that scored?

MD: Electronic orchestra and guitar. That was the most amount of music in the shortest amount of time. You're always pushing the envelope.

LD: How long did you have for that?

MD: 15 days for...I think 50 minutes of music. They wanted a nice, big...it got me a great review. The Hollywood Reporter said that my score was "simply superb." And you don't get those. I mean, I don't get them. Now, it wasn't by the way.

LD: It wasn't superb?

MD: It wasn't simply superb. I mean, c'mon. Get real. Who are we kidding? But you know, if you get a mention like that, you're very grateful for it. It's a wonderful thing. I mean, I thought I did a good job, don't get me wrong, I wasn't ashamed of it or anything, it's just that...how superb can you be in two weeks? That's not a lot of time for 50 minutes of music.

LD: How did you get that job?

MD: My agent was involved. It was for producers I'd worked for before.

LD: These producers had a sense of the quality you could deliver? And at what speed?

MD: In this case. I really got it because the director really wanted me. I didn't know her, I'd never met her, but she really wanted me. The producers were more than happy to okay it because I'd worked for them before. We had a very good relationship. Sometimes the director said, "Just do what you can." Other times, "I'm really worried about this or that." And it turned out they were willing to delay the mix because they wanted to hear cues. Who could blame them? The problem is simply they don't give you the time to do that. Because, first of all, you have to lose a day to get all these tapes together. Meanwhile, you're supposed to be moving on to do the rest of the picture and you simply have to tell them, "I'm sorry. If that's what you want, you'll have to put off your mix." I'm happy to go by without seeing my family, and without sleeping. I mean, I will push to the max. I'm used to it; in some ways, I like it. I'm pressure-oriented. But, what are you going to do? Short of pulling your name off it, which I should have done once or twice...Once I had a director pull a number of pieces of music at the last minute. He'd given me no indication he didn't like themóhe just pulled them and substituted needle-drops. It was horrible. People asked me, "What happened to you on that movie?" and I'd say, "Nothing! It wasn't me!" [laughs] But my name's out there, you know? It's a real problem. You worry about where you're going to defend your work. By the same token, this is a can-do industry. Nobody got anywhere by saying no. Not in Hollywood. It's your job to say yes. To provide. To do the best music. To make the film as good as it can be, and not at the film's expense. Sometimes you do things, you think they're great, and the director doesn't like them.

LD: When do you find that out?

MD: Hopefully not at the last minute. But how much time is there? When the accountants took over the studios a few years ago, they correctly figured that they could save a lot of money by compressing the post-production period. Instead of giving the composer three months, suppose they gave him three weeks? The audio people -- the same guy doesn't have to do footsteps as does door closings. About the only person who suffers is the composer. And our answer to that is...work harder, utilize more tools, and get help. You hire a lot of people. Like the movies where the composer credited was really the scoutmaster, the den mother. He just went out and hired a million people and shepherded them. And anyone who thinks that person is wrong is a fool. That person was just trying to do the best he or she could do under the circumstances, to provide the best score.
John's first studio film was called Baby, It's You. I didn't work on it. That was for Paramount. That was a pretty big studio film.

LD: Was there any original underscoring in that?

MD: No, it was all pop songs. I think there was one cue...somebody...a synthesizer... literally one cue. But I had nothing to do with that. It was all rock and roll. Eight Men Out, I had a lot in front of the camera stuff, mostly jazz. My score wasn't big for Eight Men Out. John's not a fan of big music. He didn't want The Natural. It had already been done.

LD: In Eight Men Out, you have this core dixieland kind of jazz band thrown together. Some of the cues sound very scored, but most of them sound very improvisational. And they sound very improvisational but when you look at them against the action --

MD: They're not.

LD: That's really impressive because obviously you have chord changes that necessitate a certain pacing of the music and a rise and fall of the musical tension, but he didn't cut to music, you were scoring to picture.

MD: That's right.

LD: So, how do you guide the musicians, who seem to be improvising, over these differences of texture and depth?

MD: I pick people very carefully. I talk about it with them. One of the reasons I like owning a studio is that I really don't care how long it takes me, except I have to pay players more. It was 24-track for that. It was a small studio then. I've been through three studios since. I have a lot more gear. So, you know, I owned it. I just didn't have to worry about anything. I made sure I had enough player budget.

LD: Did they ever watch the film while they were playing?

MD: Not them, no. We used click tracks.

LD: But not all of those notes were scored...

MD: That's right. How could you in jazz?

LD: Does the score say, "Play busier here, play less busy here," etc.?

MD: Uh huh. Well, actually, I say it after we try it, you know? I had a core group of absolutely fabulous musicians. Obviously, you have to score the orchestra, but except for that, any rock 'n' roll, pop or jazz, you don't score it. You do score some lines and harmonies. It's hard to describe. It's a cue-by-cue comparison really. You go through it, talk about it, do it again, talk about it, and if you're smart, once you get it really down, let it go and come back to it another day. They'll all remember it enough, and it'll sound fresher.

LD: What else do you play besides guitar and keyboard?

MD: Actually, I grew up playing trumpet and then I switched to guitar.

LD: Who made you want to pick up the guitar?

MD: Dylan. Dylan and then the Kingston Trio I think. I was in Scranton, Pennsylvania. I was 12 years old! Who hip could I be? It wasn't long 'til I really got into people like Hoyt Axton, more traditional types. And then I played a lot of rock and roll. A lot of bad rock and roll! [laughs]

LD: Did you ever play classical guitar?

MD: Never. I studied theory on guitar so I was better at that than at piano. Then I switched to keyboards. Now I'm probably a better keyboard player than I am a guitar player.

LD: When did you start playing keyboards?

MD: When I got my first synthesizer. No, that's not true. I started playing keyboard when I was in ninth grade. I played organ more than guitar, but I was horrible. I played rock and roll organ for almost a living when I was in high school. I played a lot of piano through college, but I was still horrible.

LD: What are the main synths in your studio? Do you have everything?

MD: You have no choice. Everything, everything I could think of. Well, I don't have a Fairlight and I don't have a Synclavier, but I have just about one of everything.

LD: What software do you use for sequencing?

MD: Performer. I've strictly been on Performer since it started. I can't believe you saw Osa. That really blew me away.

LD: I also saw The Last Outlaw.

MD: The Last Outlaw? People really liked some of those cues. That was really the first time I ever did pounding orchestral cues. Guys shooting each other on horseback, you know? I was really proud of some of that. My agent said, "I never heard you do that," and I said, "Well, nobody's ever asked me before." Just ask me. I'm happy to do this.

LD: If you look at all your movies, they're gentle stories, they're about human warmth, they're very positive.

MD: I know. That's what people keep coming to me for. And if you'd know me, you'd ask why. [laughs] No, just kidding.

LD: Then you see something like The Last Outlaw which is a complete bloodbath.

MD: It is a complete bloodbath. It's one of those movies that starts with about 40 people on screen and at the end, there's one guy left.

LD: And I was never a big Mickey Rourke fan, but he's excellent in it.

MD: I know. He's way ahead of himself. That director went on...he just did the new Under Siege. Geoff Murphy. I never saw Utu which is supposed to be a great little film he did.

LD: Was there sweetening in The Last Outlaw score? How much acoustic versus synth?

MD: Very little sweetening. Most of that's real orchestra. I recorded that one in Salt Lake City.

LD: How long did you have to write that?

MD: That was very fast. Three and a half weeks. A little more than three weeks for that.

LD: How often has "the final cut" changed on you?

MD: Oh, you're occasionally thrown a curve. For a movie like The Last Outlaw (HBO) where you're dealing with professionals, they give you the final cut, and they might change one scene. Because of something beyond their control. They have a bad test-market screening. Who knows?

LD: How did you get that job?

MD: That was my agent sending out tapes. I went for a meeting. Sometimes it gets down to a short list of two or three people.

LD: Did you see the movie before you had the meeting?

MD: I'd been to the editing room and watched a few scenes. You have to understand. I love that kind of movie, when it's well done. I eat it up. I just wish my music had been a little louder in it. And I don't always wish that.

LD: The gunfire...

MD: The gunfire was very loud. It's very hard to play under guns. Guns make a lot of noise, in life and on the screen. Still, I had a ball doing it. That's the exact opposite of a John Sayles movie, right? Where it has no violence and all heart. Well, fine, but you know, I like 'em all. As long as it's good, it will appeal to me. Did you see Wild Hearts Can't Be Broken?

LD: Yes! Talk about heart...

MD: Isn't that a wonderful film?

LD: The only thing that would make it more wonderful is if I had seen it when I was 13 years old.

MD: Yes, of course. It's a story 13 year-olds die for, and I loved doing it. I loved it. Steve Miner is a great director, Matt Williams...those people were fabulous to work with. I spend the first half of the movie calling the Disney people. The executives were nervous because I'd never done one of theirs before. Frankly they had had a previous movie where two other composers had been fired from it, and they ended up with three composers on a movie. They thought, "Oh god, this is going to happen to us again because we've got this guy and we never heard of him." And then they started liking the tapes and they basically chilled out. You get to a point where you and the people you're working with feel good about what you're doing. One of the best projects I ever did in my life was The Old Curiosity Shop, a four-hour mini-series for Disney. The people...they just had absolute confidence in me. I played them some things over the phone and I sent them a cassette and they just agreed that these three or four things were fine and they said, "Go ahead."

LD: How close do you demos sound to the final version? Do you end up explaining, "You're hearing it on a synthesizer..."

MD: Yeah, you can explain all that, but if they don't like it, they're gonna hate it, no matter what you do later. If they like it, they're gonna love it later. They want to like it probably, because if they do, they can leave you alone and go bother somebody else.

To be concluded in the next Lost Issue...

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