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 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 11:59 AM   
 By:   toposs   (Member)

Today I received an e-mail from Luc van de Ven of Prometheus Records.

I had congratulate Luc (and James) with their latest achievement : The Fall Of The Roman Empire and I had wished them both that the whole project was profitable.

Also I had asked him for some projects in the future and the possibility perhaps of some
Victor Young.

Luc's answer was a little bit bitter.Profits, what do you think with a 123 orchestra,choir,conductor,translater etc ....

Victor Young in the pipeline ? and I quote him -"forget it, the young record buyers don't even know scores like The Alamo and not to speak of he older composer of the Golden Age " and
I predict that in ten years producing older scores are over.

 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 12:05 PM   
 By:   Erik Woods   (Member)

I'm pretty sure that producers of such projects KNOW they are going to loose money on any re-recording they do.

-Erik-

 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 12:17 PM   
 By:   'Lenny Bruce' Marshall   (Member)

I'm pretty sure that producers of such projects KNOW they are going to loose money on any re-recording they do.

-Erik-


"It's madness, madness!"
- William Holden "The Bridge on the River Kwai"

wink

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 1:52 PM   
 By:   MMM   (Member)

I think Luc is being MUCH too optimistic. Not only is the market shrinking as the population ages, but the percentage of people who download music for free is expanding. Seems we have replaced more honest middle-aged people with younger crooks who think they have a right to get anything they want without paying for it.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 1:52 PM   
 By:   MMM   (Member)

double-post double-post

 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 1:55 PM   
 By:   SchiffyM   (Member)

I predict that in ten years producing older scores are over.

Define "older." When Charles Gerhardt recorded his first "Classic Film Scores" album ("The Sea Hawk"), "The Sea Hawk" was 32 years old. That's as old as "The Empire Strikes Back" is now. When Prometheus released "The Alamo" last year, that film was fifty years old.

Some composers will likely still see older scores rerecorded, but most will inevitably be left behind. It's a shame, yes, but time is finite, and while it would be lovely to preserve all art forever, I can't see how that's possible. I would love my kids to love everything I love, but there are new movies and shows and music made every day, and they should have their own stuff, too. Almost invariably, the true greats endure. Some solid "goods" fall by the wayside. Such is life.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 2:36 PM   
 By:   Jon Lewis   (Member)

I think Luc is being MUCH too optimistic. Not only is the market shrinking as the population ages, but the percentage of people who download music for free is expanding. Seems we have replaced more honest middle-aged people with younger crooks who think they have a right to get anything they want without paying for it.

What about the percentage of people who pay to download, which is also going up? If I could buy Tadlow and Tribute releases through iTunes or Amazon MP3 or eMusic, I'd buy everything they release. As it is, I can afford about 1 Tadlow and 1 Tribute a year.

(Note that I am NOT advocating the extinction of the CD. Just speaking for those of us who are happy with high-bitrate lossy quality).

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 2:41 PM   
 By:   cody1949   (Member)

Someone just re-record DUEL IN THE SUN before the curtain comes down on what we call golden age scores. If it were to be re-recorded tomorrow, the next day all future re-recordings of golden age scores could be halted. I would still be very,very happy.

 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 2:48 PM   
 By:   Tester   (Member)

Seems we have replaced more honest middle-aged people with younger crooks who think they have a right to get anything they want without paying for it.

That sounds like what a wealthy man from one or two centuries ago would say. One thing is for sure, any record company whose future plans are limited to belittle their potential buyers and call them crooks it's doomed.

 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 2:56 PM   
 By:   Stephen Woolston   (Member)

I think it is a great, great shame.

Nevertheless, I think it's just reality the sales potential of the film scores of one generation does diminish as the generations move on. Certain titles will endure, of course. But the bar moves.

We can argue with reality but reality will win.

Sorry to hear this.

Cheers

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 3:13 PM   
 By:   MMM   (Member)

"That sounds like what a wealthy man from one or two centuries ago would say. One thing is for sure, any record company whose future plans are limited to belittle their potential buyers and call them crooks it's doomed."

There are two flaws with your statement:

1) I am not wealthy. Nobody who does film music re-recordings is wealthy due to exactly the reasons I mentioned earlier.

2) You seem to have missed the entire point of my post. The only people I'm belittling are the crooks. Buyers are not crooks, and buyers are the only audience that labels re-record music for. I did not belittle a single buyer or potential buyer. Who cares about belittling crooks who take music for free?

Every single label, regardless of whether they belittle crooks or not, are being negatively affected by the crooks just like our label is. Whether one speaks out against pirates or not does not matter one iota whether an honest customer will support your label.

 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 3:13 PM   
 By:   SchiffyM   (Member)

Seems we have replaced more honest middle-aged people with younger crooks who think they have a right to get anything they want without paying for it.

That sounds like what a wealthy man from one or two centuries ago would say. One thing is for sure, any record company whose future plans are limited to belittle their potential buyers and call them crooks it's doomed.


I'm not following. He didn't call buyers or potential buyers "crooks." He called crooks "crooks."

EDIT: I see MMM beat me to the same point.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 3:17 PM   
 By:   MMM   (Member)

Schiffy -- I don't know if people react before they read or if they have their own agendas and react the same way regardless of what they read, but thanks for reading and reacting logically!

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 4:55 PM   
 By:   OnyaBirri   (Member)

There's a lot of competition out there. If I have a choice between buying, say, an RVG remaster of a Blue Note album for $5.99 or a re-record of a score I'm only marginally interested in for $19.99, I'll go for the former every time. Art's job is to keep human beings alive, not the other way around. If there's no market for re-records, c'est la vie. As for downloads, that is simply the reality of the world we live in, like it or not.

 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 7:26 PM   
 By:   George Komar   (Member)

I predict that in ten years producing older scores are over.

In the 1970s we oldies thought that the Golden Age of film scores was dead. Then out of the blue came Charles Gerhardt's Classic Film Scores series and Elmer Bernstein's Filmmusic Collection... and a whole new generation of listeners who knew little of of Erich Wolfgang Korngold, Max Steiner, Alfred Newman, Franz Waxman, et al. discovered a brand new world of old film music.

Have hope!

 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 7:34 PM   
 By:   Gary S.   (Member)

I predict that in ten years producing older scores are over.

In the 1970s we oldies thought that the Golden Age of film scores was dead. Then out of the blue came Charles Gerhardt's Classic Film Scores series and Elmer Bernstein's Filmmusic Collection... and a whole new generation of listeners who knew little of of Erich Wolfgang Korngold, Max Steiner, Alfred Newman, Franz Waxman, et al. discovered a brand new world of old film music.

Have hope!


I bought several of those RCA LPs when I was a college/law school student. Completely corrupted me. Never been the same.....smile

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 7:45 PM   
 By:   MMM   (Member)

Back then those Gerhardt recordings had classical crossover, and especially the Korngold sold truckloads. Nowadays there isn't even a classical market to cross over to. And people weren't bootlegging the Gerhardt's. And Elmer didn't make a profit on his venture. We'll need an entirely new paradigm in order to make re-recordings profitable in the future. And with the sinking of popular culture to new lows all the time, I don't see that happening any time soon. When's the last time you heard any of your friends talking about a wonderful new play they've seen, or an opera they went to, or even a classical concert they raved about? Or what a magnificent time they had at the art museum? Sorry, but the days of culture like that seem to be in the past and not a very large part of the future. As for those "rich benefactors" saving the industry, Ha! I've never had one person offer us one dollar to record one tenth of one second of music.

 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 7:49 PM   
 By:   robertmro   (Member)

My understanding is that classical music recording isn't profitable either but still survive somehow.
These high quality golden age re-recordings would probably find a place in the classical music niche if it was possible.

I predict that sometime in the future they will be rediscovered when the music cane be separated from the film they were created for.

Just don't throw anything away like many studios did in the 1950s and 1960s.

It will come back.

 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 7:50 PM   
 By:   Advise & Consent   (Member)

I predict that in ten years producing older scores are over.

In the 1970s we oldies thought that the Golden Age of film scores was dead. Then out of the blue came Charles Gerhardt's Classic Film Scores series and Elmer Bernstein's Filmmusic Collection... and a whole new generation of listeners who knew little of of Erich Wolfgang Korngold, Max Steiner, Alfred Newman, Franz Waxman, et al. discovered a brand new world of old film music.

Have hope!


I bought several of those RCA LPs when I was a college/law school student. Completely corrupted me. Never been the same.....smile


Those LPs were the be all and end of all of the art back in the day and in a way they still are benchmarks.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 20, 2011 - 7:54 PM   
 By:   .   (Member)

Not only is the market shrinking as the population ages, but the percentage of people who download music for free is expanding. Seems we have replaced more honest middle-aged people with younger crooks who think they have a right to get anything they want without paying for it.


One minute you tell us the market for re-recordings of old scores is tiny and dwindling because the only people interested in them are old and being pensioned off or dying off.

The next minute, you're telling us that the younger generation who supposedly have little or no interest in old scores are falling over themselves in the rush to illegally download them.

Anyway, you should understand the problem kids have buying CDs at $20 a time. After all, in another thread here, you say you're having trouble affording just the staples for the booklets.

 
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