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 Posted:   Mar 29, 2014 - 5:51 PM   
 By:   Maleficio   (Member)

What happened to the cd, amazon has pre-release orders for of Amazing Spider-Nan 2 and Guardians of the Galaxy. For this Score mislabeled maybe deliberately cap so can't find on captain America search. America and says unavailable. Yet is on itunes. what gives? And how are people commenting in full score?

A CD release is coming from Intrada.

 
 Posted:   Mar 29, 2014 - 8:02 PM   
 By:   yonythemoony   (Member)

Saw the film and really enjoyed it. After reading all the vitrol and whinery of the score, I was expecting to hear all drones and noise. Far from it. Jackman keeps the Captain America theme, but he makes a score on his own.

It suffers from temp tracks during the first half (you can tell that Inception's Mombasa was used heavily), but in the second half it goes into X-Men: First Class's territory (including the use of choir for dramatic effects). The orchestra is at the forefront for 90% of the score and it sounds inspired by Silvestri's Marvel scores (including WOODWINDS for the lighter cues).

It's no longer the old fashioned Captain America, but a modernized one, and the film plays more with the conspiracy, modern thriller vibes than your typical superhero score.

 
 Posted:   Mar 29, 2014 - 8:02 PM   
 By:   yonythemoony   (Member)


How often do composers use other composer's themes? It seems to me that the only time it happens is if the music is so identified with a property (Star Wars, James Bond, Pink Panther, Harry Potter). I don't see Captain America being in that list. (Or Iron Man or Thor or The Avengers.)



Maybe the reason we see less of that nowadays for films like Iron Man, Thor, Avengers is, let's be honest, their themes are nowhere near as iconic or indelible as, say, Williams' score for Superman. So there's less of a desire to re-use the theme for the sequels.


That's because iconic themes aren't iconic when they come out. It takes years. Silvestri tried to make the Captain America theme to be really iconic, and he partly had sucess. Because it was the most referenced theme of the MCU. But regular people recognized Captain America and Iron Man's themes when they we're played on the last Academy Awards. Iconic things are iconic by individual people on these days. People here thinks that score fandoms are the world, but it's just a small island of this world.

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 1, 2014 - 1:44 AM   
 By:   Mike West   (Member)

Maybe I was not expecting much because of the bad reviews and because the samples don't really blow you away, and because of the often complained about inconsistency in terms of themes, but the score has grown on me.
When I first heard it, I did not know what to feel about it. I liked it a bit, then a bit more.
But when I saw the film I have to say, it is very effective and I like it now pretty much.

The CD is not really representative for the score, there is a strong orchestral thematic passage from the first quarter of the movie missing, and in the end of the end credits, there is a strong longer straight-forward orchestral arrangement of cap's theme which is essential for the thematic conceptions of the score, this is also not on the cd. Instead, there is this electronic suite of the theme which is something else entirely.

I think if Jackman had included those two portions, there would be much more thematic strength and a good arc for the overall score.
obviously he himself prefered that electronic approach before the silvestri-toned march.

I really hope that we get a complete score, at least those two passages I was refering to, they will improve the listening experience of the score on its own tremendously IMO.

And the winter soldier, this is influenced by the jokers or the dark knight music, like some of the music in thor2.
quite influential on the directors what nolan/zimmer did.

so somehow there is more of a consistent style in the scores than the CD presentation suggests.

 
 Posted:   Apr 1, 2014 - 2:42 AM   
 By:   WillGoldNewtonBarryGrusin   (Member)

Maybe I was not expecting much because of the bad reviews and because the samples don't really blow you away, and because of the often complained about inconsistency in terms of themes, but the score has grown on me.
When I first heard it, I did not know what to feel about it. I liked it a bit, then a bit more.
But when I saw the film I have to say, it is very effective and I like it now pretty much.

The CD is not really representative for the score, there is a strong orchestral thematic passage from the first quarter of the movie missing, and in the end of the end credits, there is a strong longer straight-forward orchestral arrangement of cap's theme which is essential for the thematic conceptions of the score, this is also not on the cd. Instead, there is this electronic suite of the theme which is something else entirely.

I think if Jackman had included those two portions, there would be much more thematic strength and a good arc for the overall score.
obviously he himself prefered that electronic approach before the silvestri-toned march.

I really hope that we get a complete score, at least those two passages I was refering to, they will improve the listening experience of the score on its own tremendously IMO.

And the winter soldier, this is influenced by the jokers or the dark knight music, like some of the music in thor2.
quite influential on the directors what nolan/zimmer did.

so somehow there is more of a consistent style in the scores than the CD presentation suggests.


YES! Agreed completely. The end title alone would help the CD presentation enormously. Hopefully, Intrada will offer that!

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 1, 2014 - 1:48 PM   
 By:   moviescore1   (Member)

Maybe I was not expecting much because of the bad reviews and because the samples don't really blow you away, and because of the often complained about inconsistency in terms of themes, but the score has grown on me.
When I first heard it, I did not know what to feel about it. I liked it a bit, then a bit more.
But when I saw the film I have to say, it is very effective and I like it now pretty much.

The CD is not really representative for the score, there is a strong orchestral thematic passage from the first quarter of the movie missing, and in the end of the end credits, there is a strong longer straight-forward orchestral arrangement of cap's theme which is essential for the thematic conceptions of the score, this is also not on the cd. Instead, there is this electronic suite of the theme which is something else entirely.

I think if Jackman had included those two portions, there would be much more thematic strength and a good arc for the overall score.
obviously he himself prefered that electronic approach before the silvestri-toned march.

I really hope that we get a complete score, at least those two passages I was refering to, they will improve the listening experience of the score on its own tremendously IMO.

And the winter soldier, this is influenced by the jokers or the dark knight music, like some of the music in thor2.
quite influential on the directors what nolan/zimmer did.

so somehow there is more of a consistent style in the scores than the CD presentation suggests.


YES! Agreed completely. The end title alone would help the CD presentation enormously. Hopefully, Intrada will offer that!


I may be wrong, but I think the Intrada version will be the same as the current download. At least it was that way for the Lone Ranger and some of the other Disney titles, which is a bummer because I would have liked to hear the end title.

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 1, 2014 - 6:59 PM   
 By:   Mike West   (Member)

Most of the end title is tracked, "taking a stand" ,
"Project insight" , "the smithsonian", music from the finale with that motif for Falcon (which appears once in the first act of the movie very calmly).
and the arrangement of the main theme for cap and nick fury, in the beginning also associated with shield
which is great with woodwind scales and fanfaric full renditions (though not as extensive as silvestri's march)

Btw, silvestri's B-theme is also interpolated in the underscore in the last third once, under dialogue

 
 Posted:   Apr 1, 2014 - 7:56 PM   
 By:   Josh "Swashbuckler" Gizelt   (Member)

I may be wrong, but I think the Intrada version will be the same as the current download. At least it was that way for the Lone Ranger and some of the other Disney titles, which is a bummer because I would have liked to hear the end title.

There is precedent; The Avengers had an extra cue on the CD.

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 2, 2014 - 11:15 AM   
 By:   bagby   (Member)

Nice interview with Jackman about the score and some other projects.

http://collider.com/henry-jackman-captain-america-winter-soldier-interview/#more-323290

I haven't seen it yet, but I did download the iTunes version and have made it through once. I'm sure much of it works well in the film, but as a listening experience alone, the album is a bit of a slog. The six minute long 'Winter Soldier' track won't get played much by this listener. There are some nice pieces--the 'Smithsonian' cue is fabulous--but this is what film music is, and does.

BTW, I completely agree with his reasoning as expressed in the interview.

I am hopeful the Intrada disc will offer some extra cues. I think the other side of all this is the iTunes version of 'The First Avenger' offered a track not on the disc; but Intrada's 'Avengers' disc had an extra track not in iTunes. So, go figure.

I am seeing the film tomorrow night. Looking forward to it.

 
 Posted:   Apr 2, 2014 - 11:32 AM   
 By:   johnmullin   (Member)

There is precedent; The Avengers had an extra cue on the CD.

Actually, I think that the Intrada release of THE AVENGERS expanded several tracks as well… wasn't it, like, 10 minutes longer than the digital version over all?

 
 Posted:   Apr 2, 2014 - 2:23 PM   
 By:   spielboy   (Member)

the movie's end titles credit CAPTAIN AMERICA "score" by Silvestri, not just his theme. So maybe more of it was used.

about the score for this sequel, in film sounds very functional, I expected a disaster after reading James Southall's review. But I couldnt hear Silvestri's theme.... just some touches here and there... or maybe I dont remember it too much (Silvestri's last ten years output has not real interest to me).

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 2, 2014 - 2:45 PM   
 By:   bagby   (Member)

There is precedent; The Avengers had an extra cue on the CD.

Actually, I think that the Intrada release of THE AVENGERS expanded several tracks as well… wasn't it, like, 10 minutes longer than the digital version over all?


You're right. The iTunes release is a bit over 62 minutes and the Intrada album is a bit over 77 minutes.

Including the two source tracks (I assume they're source of a '40s big band standard and a Motown classic), the iTunes release is a shade over 75 minutes long for CA:TWS. Not optimistic based on that of an expanded release--unless the two source cues are dropped--together they're over seven minutes long. Well, guess we'll see.

But Jackman's score is clearly not a disaster. It might not meet some peoples' expectations, but then, what does?

Funny thing, I was listening to Goldsmith's 'Planet of the Apes' the other day. I wonder how we would have responded to that on first listen before we saw it with the film--mixing bowls? Drums looped into an echoplex? Orchestra grunts? Horns blown without mouthpieces? Some weird sounds in there and not eminently listenable.

Now it's recognized as a classic in scoring.

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 3, 2014 - 2:01 AM   
 By:   Kev McGann   (Member)

Saw this last night.
Just like during the last two LOTR film (with my Jackson/LOTR fatigue), I started to feel Marvel fatigue as it went on and on and on.
It's way too long and it's all starting to feel just more of the same old song.
Also, the action/fight scenes are edited so quickly (it felt about a million frames per second) that they are rendered pointless, confusing and headache inducing. Everything is shot in what I would term 'blurred motion'.
The story tries to be a bit different, with a dark/trust no one conspiracy vibe throughout, but it's all becoming a big bore to me, despite it's top notch tech credits.
The score was okay, shining in the softer/nostalgic moments and doing the usual stuff we hear nowadays, veering from modern beats and dirty guitar to big orchestral RC/Tyler moments under and over the action. Certainly no worse than anything else we get these days and hardly a car crash of a score, though how it plays on CD I'll never know wink

 
 Posted:   Apr 3, 2014 - 5:40 AM   
 By:   WillGoldNewtonBarryGrusin   (Member)

Saw this last night.
Just like during the last two LOTR film (with my Jackson/LOTR fatigue), I started to feel Marvel fatigue as it went on and on and on.
It's way too long and it's all starting to feel just more of the same old song.
Also, the action/fight scenes are edited so quickly (it felt about a million frames per second) that they are rendered pointless, confusing and headache inducing. Everything is shot in what I would term 'blurred motion'.
The story tries to be a bit different, with a dark/trust no one conspiracy vibe throughout, but it's all becoming a big bore to me, despite it's top notch tech credits.
The score was okay, shining in the softer/nostalgic moments and doing the usual stuff we hear nowadays, veering from modern beats and dirty guitar to big orchestral RC/Tyler moments under and over the action. Certainly no worse than anything else we get these days and hardly a car crash of a score, though how it plays on CD I'll never know wink


Interesting! For me, it was the complete opposite. I loved the editing because it was fast but still absolutely coherent. Something many actions pic strive for but do not achieve.

But you´re talking about "Marvel fatigue". That may be spot on. For me, it was "Hobbit fatigue" - but I know that it´s mostly about my expectations or mood which took away my interest in the Jackson-films.

 
 Posted:   Apr 3, 2014 - 4:28 PM   
 By:   The REAL BJBien   (Member)

just saw it myself and thought it was solid. that action isn't as incoherent as say a Bourne film but it does cut quickly so that the violence doesn't linger enough for it to have an impact which i'm sure was done on purpose because this is one violent film.

i thought it was decent/good but the reveal made me wonder about a few things.

one thing I know they CAN'T do but that sticks out is this:

the film references Tony Stark and The Hulk and the finale of this film has a MASSIVE scale and you have to wonder, where the hell are Stark and Banner?

 
 Posted:   Apr 3, 2014 - 4:33 PM   
 By:   The REAL BJBien   (Member)

Also... HOLY SHIT! What did Henry Jackman do to everyone here? I just skimmed through the comments. WOW. So much negativity.

Personally I thought the score was as good as anything in the Marvel films which and loads better then say IRON MAN by Ramin Djwadi. I would rank it as good as Brian Tyler and John Debney's work for Iron Man but not as good as Silverstri's work on THE FIRST AVENGER or Silvestri's work on THE INCREDIBLE HULK.

Just like in THE AVENGERS ASSEMBLE, you have to wait until climatic moment and the end credits to hear the theme.

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 3, 2014 - 5:06 PM   
 By:   samlowry   (Member)

Just saw the movie tonight, which I enjoyed very much.

I was one among those who criticized the score on this post when I heard it prior to seeing the film. Now that I've heard the music in the context it was written for, I like it much better.

It's no masterpiece, but the music functions and I heard some good thematic material in the end credits that wasn't on the soundtrack.

So as far as I'm concerned, Mr. Jackman did his job.

 
 Posted:   Apr 3, 2014 - 5:42 PM   
 By:   On the Score   (Member)

Just saw the movie tonight, which I enjoyed very much.

I was one among those who criticized the score on this post when I heard it prior to seeing the film. Now that I've heard the music in the context it was written for, I like it much better.

It's no masterpiece, but the music functions and I heard some good thematic material in the end credits that wasn't on the soundtrack.

So as far as I'm concerned, Mr. Jackman did his job.


Just like so many other people ragging on the score without seeing how it works exceptionally well in a terrific film. It's got to function in the movie first!

 
 Posted:   Apr 3, 2014 - 5:58 PM   
 By:   David (Giacchino-fan)   (Member)

just saw it myself and thought it was solid. that action isn't as incoherent as say a Bourne film but it does cut quickly so that the violence doesn't linger enough for it to have an impact which i'm sure was done on purpose because this is one violent film.

i thought it was decent/good but the reveal made me wonder about a few things.

one thing I know they CAN'T do but that sticks out is this:

the film references Tony Stark and The Hulk and the finale of this film has a MASSIVE scale and you have to wonder, where the hell are Stark and Banner?


Hey, NO DISCUSSION ABOUT THE FILM PLEASE! It hasn't even come out in the States (minus some midnight premieres). If you want to talk about plot points, please make a thread in the non-film score discussion thread. I have been spoiled on several films by just reading about the soundtracks, and I really don't want that to happen, especially with a large franchise like the MCU.

 
 Posted:   Apr 3, 2014 - 7:55 PM   
 By:   The REAL BJBien   (Member)

just saw it myself and thought it was solid. that action isn't as incoherent as say a Bourne film but it does cut quickly so that the violence doesn't linger enough for it to have an impact which i'm sure was done on purpose because this is one violent film.

i thought it was decent/good but the reveal made me wonder about a few things.

one thing I know they CAN'T do but that sticks out is this:

the film references Tony Stark and The Hulk and the finale of this film has a MASSIVE scale and you have to wonder, where the hell are Stark and Banner?


Hey, NO DISCUSSION ABOUT THE FILM PLEASE! It hasn't even come out in the States (minus some midnight premieres). If you want to talk about plot points, please make a thread in the non-film score discussion thread. I have been spoiled on several films by just reading about the soundtracks, and I really don't want that to happen, especially with a large franchise like the MCU.


I apologize. Trust me I spoiled nothing that is an actual plot point or anything that can't be discussed in regards to the actual film THE WINTER SOLDIER.

What I was referring to was like in the film THOR when the Destroyer shows up, one of the SHIELD agents asks "Is that one of Starks' ?" and obviously the film being Thor's no one expects Tony to show up and even in the finale of THOR - THE DARK WOLRD, no one from The Avengers could in fact show up against villains from Thor's realm but because Marvel has done such a job of incorporating everyone from all the other films together and created a simultaneous universe, I wonder.

Even in IRON MAN 3, Stark had a decent out for not reaching out for SHIELD's help because he didn't like being part of a team although if Banner showed up in the post credits and he's who Tony is essentially telling the whole damn film to, you can almost ask why?

It's a minor nitpick from that stand point.

 
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