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Has anybody got any crackers?
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I don't think Yor's the only one on this front. I almost never listen to the promo because even when I make my own playlist, it's impossible to separate the cues I actually want to hear from the crashing dissonance that's been stapled to each track. Intrada is free to release it however they see fit, but I've never understood this mentality of, "If you don't like it start your own label!" (which, in fairness, Intrada's never been guilty of). It's like Ritz releasing a new brand of crackers, and then responding to customer complaints with, "Look, you people are lucky to get any crackers at all, and if you don't like it, you can make your own damned crackers!"
Yes, some people are just odd.
Maybe they are that kind of people that, when their bosses says "I will cut your salary in half", they think: "He is right. I will not complain. If I am not happy I should open my own company".
Well, some people LIKE to live on the Matrix, you know...
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If Yor is so good at picking the choice meats, opening a music label should be no great feat.
"Ignorance is a bliss..."
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Posted: |
May 25, 2013 - 8:16 AM
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By: |
Thor
(Member)
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I don't think Yor's the only one on this front. I almost never listen to the promo because even when I make my own playlist, it's impossible to separate the cues I actually want to hear from the crashing dissonance that's been stapled to each track. Intrada is free to release it however they see fit, but I've never understood this mentality of, "If you don't like it start your own label!" (which, in fairness, Intrada's never been guilty of). It's like Ritz releasing a new brand of crackers, and then responding to customer complaints with, "Look, you people are lucky to get any crackers at all, and if you don't like it, you can make your own damned crackers!"
He, he....well put!
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Tohr posted something above, surely saying that he would be happy with a 12 minute presentation of YSH, but YOR put him on his ignore list.
Thanks Zod!
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This post and the one about Ritz crackers made me laugh a lot!
General Kael laughing?
That's scary stuff!
FÓ-RÓ-RÓ-RÓMMMMMMM!!!
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Tin tin tin!
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Actually, they are. All of the examples you listed in the first post were written to flow continuously as they do on film and album. Go back and watch it. You can argue that you don't like the effect on album, but they're not just slapped together for shits and giggles or to piss you off.
So, you are saying that Bruce Broughton sit on his chair and wrote "I Never Want To Be Alone-Stained Glass Knightmare-Solving The Crime" at once? And them recorded all that music at once?
Nonsense.
The cues should flow together because they were composed for scenes that were close to each other, but they are all diferent animals!
One cannot defend that "Stained Glass Knightmare" and "Solving The Crime" should be glued togheter into one big track just because the scenes they belong are close to each other in the movie! This is just ludicrous!
Is like saying that "The Battle in the Snow", "Luke's First Crash" and "The Rebels Escape Again" from ESB should be glued togheter just because they flow into each other! They may flow, but each of these tracks are quite different from each other!
Oh, but THEY GLUED them togheter on that 2CD album from Arista! Is there anyone that actually LIKE that huge track with ALL the music for the battle in the snow sequence edited togheter? YOR doubts...
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Posted: |
May 25, 2013 - 5:00 PM
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By: |
Musicman416
(Member)
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So, you are saying that Bruce Broughton sit on his chair and wrote "I Never Want To Be Alone-Stained Glass Knightmare-Solving The Crime" at once? And them recorded all that music at once?
Nonsense.
I don't think he wrote all of that in one sitting (that would be an insane bit of work!), but he wrote that music to play out in one continuous stretch. They were recorded separately--as are most long cues/sequences in films--for practical reasons: it's easier to get good takes with shorter stretches of music than longer stretches. This happens in recordings of concert music as well: whole movements will be recorded in shorter chunks, made to be fit together by an editor so that you get a "perfect" recording. I don't see what any of this has to do with the intentions of the composer or the presentation on album (which is the real point of debate here).
The cues should flow together because they were composed for scenes that were close to each other, but they are all diferent animals!
Isn't that the nature of the beast, though? Film music is inherently like that--that's one of the things that intrigues me about it. Composers have to deal with scenes and sequences that don't always fit neatly with how they would conceive of a concert piece. Given time and skill, the best film composers can make it work in a musical way anyway, which makes for some interesting juxtapositions.
One cannot defend that "Stained Glass Knightmare" and "Solving The Crime" should be glued togheter into one big track just because the scenes they belong are close to each other in the movie! This is just ludicrous!
They're not just close, they are directly adjacent, hence Broughton composing them to flow continuously. I don't see what's ludicrous about that. Again, you can make a decision in album production to go ahead and keep "Stained Glass Knightmare" and "Solving the Crime" separate, a decision I totally understand and respect, and might even approve. But you're making an argument there that no one was making. It's not that the scenes are close, it's the way the music was written to go.
Is like saying that "The Battle in the Snow", "Luke's First Crash" and "The Rebels Escape Again" from ESB should be glued togheter just because they flow into each other! They may flow, but each of these tracks are quite different from each other!
Oh, but THEY GLUED them togheter on that 2CD album from Arista! Is there anyone that actually LIKE that huge track with ALL the music for the battle in the snow sequence edited togheter? YOR doubts...
Wow, I couldn't have picked a worse example of this to use against the practice. Those tracks, though different, come together to form a cohesive, effective musico-dramatic sequence. Not only is the music intended to be together, but it actually forms its own amazing self-contained section of the score, also providing the climax to the whole opening act of the film/score. Its internal ups and downs as well as its relation to the music that came before it are very satisfying. It's a remarkable bit of architecture and execution in film scoring, solid in both pure music and drama senses.
I actually understand your examples of "Flaming Hat Rack/Main Title" (eh, sort of) and "Stained Glass Knightmare/Solving the Crime" but the two tracks forming the climax of YSH are similar to this example here: these are actually continuous sequences both musically and dramatically. Why break them up?
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YOR simple does not agree with your opinion on the subject.
The "Battle in the Snow" sequence in ESB is just an example of 4 diferent cues that have almost nothing to do with each other musically glued togheter. How can you say that the original "Battle in the Snow" is even similar to "Luke's First Crash"? They are not.
The same thing goes for all the cues on YSH that were glued togheter artificially just because they segue into each other in the context of the movie.
Like "Waxing Elizabeth-Diversionary Tactics". What these tracks have in common, YOR asks, beside the fact they are close in the film?
This argument just makes no sense.
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Posted: |
May 25, 2013 - 6:38 PM
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By: |
Musicman416
(Member)
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YOR simple does not agree with your opinion on the subject.
The "Battle in the Snow" sequence in ESB is just an example of 4 diferent cues that have almost nothing to do with each other musically glued togheter. How can you say that the original "Battle in the Snow" is even similar to "Luke's First Crash"? They are not.
The same thing goes for all the cues on YSH that were glued togheter artificially just because they segue into each other in the context of the movie.
Like "Waxing Elizabeth-Diversionary Tactics". What these tracks have in common, YOR asks, beside the fact they are close in the film?
This argument just makes no sense.
I'm not sure what you're looking for, or how this makes no sense. In what sense do you want those cues to be similar that they are not? In the case of "Battle in the Snow" and "Luke's First Crash," they are covering different parts of a battle sequence--of course they differ. At the same time, they share an intensity and at times a militaristic feel, while covering the ups and downs of the battle. It seems pretty clear to me.
To be clear, do you prefer Thor's opinion of resequencing the cues for an album experience distinct from the storytelling of the film and the original construction of the score? An assembly like "Waxing Elizabeth/Diversionary Tactics" makes perfect sense in both musical and dramatic terms, but if you wanted to completely divorce yourself from that, it might make more sense to move it around. However, I think it makes sense either way, as you musically have a return of thematic material that builds to the climactic music. It's classical structuring.
And again, these contrasts are inherently there in film music.
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