I've also noticed the expansions of these late years Goldsmith scores getting 'above and beyond' praise. I think it does have a lot to do with the state of current scores, causing a re-evaluation of these Goldsmith scores that were, at the time, considered dull and repetitive by many fans, in comparison to his stellar work of the 60's, 70's and early/mid 80's. I've almost fallen into the trap of thinking 'wow, sounds amazing, must get it', but having been unable to sit through the expanded Nemesis and seeing the comment above about this score reminding a listener of U.S Marshals in a good way (!!), I will remember which era Goldsmith I enjoy and act accordingly.
I've also noticed the expansions of these late years Goldsmith scores getting 'above and beyond' praise. I think it does have a lot to do with the state of current scores, causing a re-evaluation of these Goldsmith scores that were, at the time, considered dull and repetitive by many fans, in comparison to his stellar work of the 60's, 70's and early/mid 80's. I've almost fallen into the trap of thinking 'wow, sounds amazing, must get it', but having been unable to sit through the expanded Nemesis and seeing the comment above about this score reminding a listener of U.S Marshals in a good way (!!), I will remember which era Goldsmith I enjoy and act accordingly.
Agree! Just like how the movie The Sum Of All Fears plays way better than it did a decade ago, the score sounds better because of how poor Hollywood has gotten in most every capacity.
Affleck's Jack Ryan was all right until he started running. I could actually see him making a much better Jack Ryan NOW, oddly enough.
I've also noticed the expansions of these late years Goldsmith scores getting 'above and beyond' praise. I think it does have a lot to do with the state of current scores, causing a re-evaluation of these Goldsmith scores that were, at the time, considered dull and repetitive by many fans, in comparison to his stellar work of the 60's, 70's and early/mid 80's. I've almost fallen into the trap of thinking 'wow, sounds amazing, must get it', but having been unable to sit through the expanded Nemesis and seeing the comment above about this score reminding a listener of U.S Marshals in a good way (!!), I will remember which era Goldsmith I enjoy and act accordingly.
I disagree. I believe the reception of a lot of late Goldsmith suffered from a) overexposure of his sound and b) bad representation on the released albums. People were either fed up with his sound or could not see the big picture.
The expanded versions prove that Goldsmith was still at the top of his game when a director appreciated him. I was not a particular fan of his score to "The Sum of All Fears" before - but now I love it because the new CD offers a much better understanding of the score´s ideas.
Of course, taste is subjective - this is not an attack on anyone.
"People were either fed up with his sound or could not see the big picture... Of course, taste is subjective - this is not an attack on anyone" --------------------------- No attack taken. It's all about good discussion and debate around here I never grew fed up of any Goldsmith sound. It's evident he streamlined his way of working to anyone who listened to his music over the decades. I missed the incredible counterpoint and inventiveness that got replaced by his more programmed writing and 30 or 40 minutes of that style was not as interesting to me than the 30 or 40 minutes I heard of his older scores. Sure, expansions can highlight a bigger picture, but it's still a sound against sound thing, so I don't think it's about not seeing some perceived newer, bigger picture. I've heard classic Goldsmith expansions that still don't sound greater than some amazing original album edits. But yeah, it's all taste and subjectivity.
Goldsmith's overall style definitely changed over the last decade of his life. I like many of his scores written in this new style, but I feel that he had a far greater number written on autopilot, so to speak, than in his earlier career.
I think, for example, that The Mummy, Star Trek:Insurrection and Timeline are stellar scores written in this style. Sum of All Fears and Star Trek: Nemesis, to cite two recent re-releases, just don't do it for me. They both have a couple of outstanding tracks (The Mission, Shinzon's Theme in the Nemesis Credits), but the bulk of the rest of those scores are just so grating and droning that I can't stand to listen to the full scores.
Sum of All Fears may well be a four star score ranked against today's typical blockbuster scores, but there's not way it's any better than 2.5 stars when ranked against the rest of Goldsmith's discography. Just my two cents!
Goldsmith's overall style definitely changed over the last decade of his life. I like many of his scores written in this new style, but I feel that he had a far greater number written on autopilot, so to speak, than in his earlier career.
The equivalent of seeing a top-form Charlton Heston in Ben-Hur, El Cid and Planet of the Apes, and then watching him later, going through the motions in The Last Hard Men or Airport 75.
I was not a particular fan of his score to "The Sum of All Fears" before - but now I love it because the new CD offers a much better understanding of the score´s ideas.
I think that of expanded releases like GREMLINS, INNERSPACE or STAR TREK V.
but I'd like to know which are those great new cues that turn this average-to-good Goldsmith late score into something completely new and incredible... a revelation???!!
The Sum Of All Fears was the last Goldsmith score that managed to truly surprise me. I had been listening to Jerry Goldsmith's music for years, and of course I had become familiar with his various styles... there was the avant-garde Goldsmith, the Americana Goldsmith, the Stravinsky-symphonic Goldsmith, etc... and of course, I knew the type of thriller sound he favored in the late 1990s...
When the Tom Clancy inspired terrorist thriller The Sum of all Fears opened with that glorious operatic and elegiac soprano/choral cue, well, that really made me sit up in my seat and I thought: "holy smoke, I did not see that one coming."
I skipped the soundtrack back then because of its obvious shortcomings (particularly running time), but the LaLaLand release put it back on the map for me. I finally listened to this fine release yesterday. (Still have to find some time to read the booklet notes.)
Did anyone catch onto this? On the track "That Went Well" on the LLL release uses an electronic choir, but on the original album real choir is used.
Haven't caught this choir issue yet, but there are several other infuriating editorial decisions - the first being the previously mentioned segueing of "Clear The Stadium" (and the dropping of the crucial last note) - the other being the nonsense bolting of "Shoot Him" to "Changes". If anything, "Shoot Him" should have been bolted to the end of "Deserted Lab" since it completes that musical/dramatic sequence. "Changes" is a stand-alone cue with a unique musical/dramatic statement to make.
Keeping "Changes" and "Clear The Stadium" as stand-alone cues *should* have been a no-brainer.
A real shame because the content/sound is otherwise first rate. At least it's not needlessly split over 2 disks like Patriot Games.
Unlike the Star Trek re-issues I'm finding I can't lose ANY of the original Jack Ryan CDs!
Did anyone catch onto this? On the track "That Went Well" on the LLL release uses an electronic choir, but on the original album real choir is used.
When I listened to it for the first time I indeed thought there was something off about the choir in that track. But I just compared the two releases with headphones and the sound the same though
It definitely sounds fake in the LLL version, but it could also be that the album mix (rightly) buried the male choir in a way that conceals its fakery better than the LLL mix. If that makes any sense. But it's definitely way too pronounced on the LLL version.
Did anyone catch onto this? On the track "That Went Well" on the LLL release uses an electronic choir, but on the original album real choir is used.
Mmm.....I've listened to this track ,Thanks a Lot/That Went Well, a few times now. At 1.30 It sounds like a real choir to me. If that's what your referring to. Though I do hear the synth choir trailing off at around 1.56. Haven't compared the two tracks yet though.
Okay, I’ve been listening to this CD a lot over the last few weeks. The content is wonderful, an under-appreciated gem, and the sound quality is excellent.
But the sequencing/editing is significantly flawed in places. Some of the "segued" cues don't fit together at all well. Musical statements are drowned.
The sequence below would present the music far more effectively IMHO. Overlaps should be disposed of altogether, and cues with unique musical statements should stand alone:
01 The Mission 02 Do It! / I’ll Go / The Bomb 03 14 Months 04 The Deal 05 Thanks A Lot / That Went Well (with a breather between cues, not an overlap!) 06 The Shipment / Moscow Time 07 Nice Going / The Docks 08 Mr Spassky / The Lab 09 The Reservoir / Night Landing / Deserted Lab / Shoot Him 10 Changes 11 Clear The Stadium (Film Version) 12 Not The Russians / Man Your Aircraft 13 Further Aggression / State Of War 14 Supplies 15 To The Docks 16 Real Time 17 Cabot Is Dead / His Name Is Olsen 18 Snap Count 19 Maximum Readiness / Get A Doctor 20 How Close? 21 The Same Air
Titles in BOLD are re-sequenced.
It’s too late now, I guess. But if LLL (or another label) ever re-issues this, I highly recommend the above re-sequencing.
