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This is a comments thread about FSM CD: Star Trek: The Next Generation: The Ron Jones Project
 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 11:42 AM   
 By:   CrazyQuark   (Member)

(that's me as "Blue_Kirby2", by the way)

...and me as FPI, I would say. big grin Hello there!

 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 11:51 AM   
 By:   BasilFSM   (Member)

(that's me as "Blue_Kirby2", by the way)

...and me as FPI, I would say. big grin Hello there!


Dude!

Have I ever seen you here before? I don't think I have. Welcome aboard, nonetheless. smile

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 12:29 PM   
 By:   captain_avis   (Member)

First of all,
Props to Lukas and FSM for getting this off the ground. Lukas struck the nail on the head in his notes where he describes how important Star Trek was to him growing up. I still vividly remember chancing upon The Best of Both Worlds while channel surfing one night when I must have been about 7 or 8. This was my first exposure to Trek after having watched the Star Wars movies dozens of times and I was instantly hooked. Later that year, I'd pick up my first soundtrack album, the wonderful Star Trek - The Astral Symphony. I know this box set won't appeal to everyone on the board but to those growing up with TNG this is manna from heaven.

I am surprised by one thing in reading through the notes and that is how candid they are, especially with regards to Jones' dismissal from TNG and the background politics. Lukas, did you encounter any resistance or direction from the studio with regards to what could or couldn't be in the liner notes? At any rate, this project looks like a labour of love and I can't wait to listen to it, especially given how good FSMs releases of Horner's Trek scores are!

 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 12:58 PM   
 By:   Accidental Genius   (Member)

It's great you guys are doing the autographed copies for the same price.

Looking forward to this release

Ordered !


I'm confused - I don't see anywhere on the SAE page that Jones will be autographing. Anyone know how many copies and if there are still signed copies to be had?

 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 1:06 PM   
 By:   LeHah   (Member)

If I were Dennis McCarthy, I'd be thinking right now, "Damn, I wish I'd stuck to my guns like Ron did so that I could deserve a deluxe 14 disc set of my music being released."

Lets not go in this direction. Dennis is a really nice guy and wrote some great music for a number of TV shows. Just because Mr Jones got his deserved spotlight doesn't mean we should be pissing all over other people for it.

 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 1:08 PM   
 By:   Senojanaidni   (Member)



I'm confused - I don't see anywhere on the SAE page that Jones will be autographing. Anyone know how many copies and if there are still signed copies to be had?


100

 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 1:12 PM   
 By:   Josh   (Member)

I'm confused - I don't see anywhere on the SAE page that Jones will be autographing. Anyone know how many copies and if there are still signed copies to be had?

There were 100 autographed copies available, but they're sold out. There was a separate order link at SAE for the autographed copies while they were still available, but it's since been removed.

 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 1:15 PM   
 By:   LeHah   (Member)

I'm confused - I don't see anywhere on the SAE page that Jones will be autographing. Anyone know how many copies and if there are still signed copies to be had?

You can still get a signed copy through Dark Delicacies.

http://darkdel.com/c52.htm

On Sunday, September 19th at 2 p.m., composer Ron Jones signing the new box set, Star Trek: The Next Generation. Sales Price: $ 149.95

 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 1:49 PM   
 By:   Lukas Kendall   (Member)


Because the liner notes are published on our website they don't need studio approval. So they were published with our standards as if we were doing a magazine article, not liner notes that needed to be approved by the studio.

Lukas

 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 1:50 PM   
 By:   Yavar Moradi   (Member)


Lets not go in this direction. Dennis is a really nice guy and wrote some great music for a number of TV shows. Just because Mr Jones got his deserved spotlight doesn't mean we should be pissing all over other people for it.


I know he's a nice guy and he has written some very good music, even some for Star Trek! The simple fact however is that he compromised and bowed down to Rick Berman's unreasonable wishes. It kept him his job as a Trek composer for decades but in terms of the music itself it rendered it less than art. Ron Jones, on the other hand, considered TV composing art and his music shows it.

I would jump for joy if his underrated score to Star Trek: Generations was released complete and remastered; I think a lot of people would reassess the fact that he IS an extremely talented composer when he is given free rein. I might even buy a box set of highlight cues from his long Trek TV tenure...

Yavar

 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 2:00 PM   
 By:   SchiffyM   (Member)

The simple fact however is that he compromised and bowed down to Rick Berman's unreasonable wishes.

Which, I should point out, was his job. As a television producer myself, I have to say that if a composer consistently does what I ask him not to do (and I'm not saying this was what Jones did, by the way), I will have no choice but to fire that composer. He might not agree with my creative instincts. I would regret that, but it's ultimately not relevant. I am the one who is responsible for all aspects of the show. I am the one who has to defend it to the studio and the network which is paying for it. Can you imagine a scenario where the studio complains about the music and I say "Yeah, I agree, but the composer has too much personal integrity to do what we're paying him to do, so sorry"?

If you hire somebody to paint your house yellow, and he decides to paint it red because he's a painter and he knows better, what would you do?

 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 2:47 PM   
 By:   Beachhead   (Member)

Dennis did do some good stuff, but it's unfortunate he was not given the chance to experiment more and let his talent out, my favorite Trek score of his along with Generations, is the Season 4 Enterprise episodes "In A Mirror, Darkly" he really let loose with some great action in those episodes (I wonder if that is because they all knew the show was getting canceled by then) also don't forget he wrote the main title theme for Deep Space Nine, which is a good memorable theme.

 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 2:59 PM   
 By:   Wedge   (Member)

While it would be a challenge coming up with a full 40 McCarthy or Chattaway episode scores I'd want to see presented complete in this fashion, I can definitely think of unreleased standouts from each composer. So I hope more of their work from the later seasons of TNG, DS9 and Voyager is released in time. To throw a few off the top of my head: McCarthy's "In the Hands of the Prophets" (DS9) and "Image in the Sand" (DS9), and Chattaway's "Dark Page" (TNG) and "Scorpion" (VGR). Other "best of Trek" episode scores include David Bell's "Second Skin" (DS9) and "In the Pale Moonlight" (DS9), Paul Baillargeon's "Waltz" (DS9) and "The Seige of AR-558" (DS9), and Mark McKenzie's "Horizon" (ENT). The latter two, in particular, are simply outstanding! Create a 2-3 disc set containing the aforementioned scores, and I'd be a very happy camper indeed!

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 3:48 PM   
 By:   Spymaster   (Member)

I know he's a nice guy and he has written some very good music, even some for Star Trek! The simple fact however is that he compromised and bowed down to Rick Berman's unreasonable wishes. It kept him his job as a Trek composer for decades but in terms of the music itself it rendered it less than art. Ron Jones, on the other hand, considered TV composing art and his music shows it.

Dennis McCarthy is a sensational composer.

And I'm going to be controversial here. When I started watching ST:TNG in 1987 I was hooked on the music. But it was McCarthy's scores in the first season that really stood out for me starting, obviously, with Encounter At Farpoint - one of the very best ST television scores of the second era. Ron Jones' music always struck me as a little too frivolous and synthy.

As time went on Jones got better (culminating with The Best Of Both Worlds) and McCarthy (seemingly) got worse. Years later, of course, I realised that Jones was going off the Berman rails while McCarthy was doing what he was told. Which was a shame.

Ron Jones' body of work for the series was exceptional, but please don't under-estimate McCarthy's work on Trek - or on TV generally - because he's very, very good indeed. If you want proof listen to that first season!

 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 3:53 PM   
 By:   Mathew   (Member)

McCarthy had his moments on TNG. I just watched the first season episode "Arsenal of Freedom". The score was fantastic. I wish Dennis had the opportunity to write something as bold in later seasons. I'd definitely buy more McCarthy stuff. It doesen't have to be a 14 disc set. But some sort of compilation release would be great. Maybe BSX could release something. They seem to have a good relationship with McCarthy.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 3:56 PM   
 By:   Spymaster   (Member)

McCarthy had his moments on TNG. I just watched the first season episode "Arsenal of Freedom". The score was fantastic. I wish Dennis had the opportunity to write something as bold in later seasons. I'd definitely buy more McCarthy stuff. It doesen't have to be a 14 disc set. But some sort of compilation release would be great. Maybe BSX could release something. They seem to have a good relationship with McCarthy.

Totally. And don't forget Conspiracy!

 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 4:04 PM   
 By:   Tom Servo   (Member)

McCarthy did indeed develop a more subtle way to catch and highlight the drama on TNG, but I gotta admit that I still have a fondness for that warm, rich strings & French horns approach he granted to the show in its later seasons.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 6:46 PM   
 By:   rickO   (Member)

Let's not forget Jay Chattaway's brilliant "Inner Light."

 
 Posted:   Sep 1, 2010 - 7:00 PM   
 By:   LeHah   (Member)

The simple fact however is that he compromised and bowed down to Rick Berman's unreasonable wishes.

Thats not exactly an apt statement. John Williams, Jerry Goldsmith, Elmer Bernstein... all of these composers bowed down to the wishes of a director or a producer to finish a project. That isn't to say they're bad composers or that Ron Jones is a bad composer or that there ARE bad composers - but there are some who are more willing to be pliable. Its not a judgement call, simply a point of character. (I personally seperate the music from the composer, if and when possible - which is more often than not. You don't need to abide by that rule but it might help to explain where I come from.)

I've long admired Ron Jones in the same span and breath as Dennis McCarthy - not only for working on TNG but as they brought different things to the Trek series. McCarthy especially started to shine when Enterprise came around and I also enjoy the stuff he did on Sliders.

 
 Posted:   Sep 2, 2010 - 2:09 AM   
 By:   Francis   (Member)

Mccarthy has proven himself with his underrated Generations score and the DS9 theme and there's no point in putting his integrity on trial when you don't know what he was ordered to write or asked not to. The liner notes for this boxset show that there was a continuing struggle between Jones and the producers regarding the role of the music and I do get the feeling that Jones is still bitter about the whole ordeal. Who's to say that isn't the case with the other composers who worked on the show?

 
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