FSM HOME MESSAGE BOARD FSM CDs FSM ONLINE RESOURCES FUN STUFF ABOUT US  SEARCH FSM

LOG IN Forgot Login? Register General Discussion • Trading Post • Non-Film Score Discussion  Profile • Preferences • Community Rules • Help/Contact • Search Board Search Terms:  Search Within:  topics posts since 2019 2018 posts 2017 posts 2016 posts 2015 posts 2014 posts 2013 posts 2012 posts 2011 posts 2010 posts 2009 posts 2008 posts 2007 posts 2006 posts 2005 posts 2004 posts 2003 posts 2002 posts 2001 posts 2000 posts users  search tips  You must log in or register to post.   Go to page:  1 2 3      General Discussion: Is UMG audibly watermarking downloads?    FIRST   PRIOR   1 2 3       Last Post   Posted:   May 12, 2013 - 7:12 PM     By:   Mike_H   (Member) Jon's right-- it's in sustained tones in symphonic music where it's the most audible for me. Lexedo, is there a program like that for mac? Here are two short examples where the noise is very apparent: The New World (downloaded from iTunes) https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/22574835/03%20A%20Flame%20Within.wav Snow White and the Huntsman (downloaded from Amazon) https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/22574835/01%20-%20Snow%20White.wav    Posted:   May 13, 2013 - 4:07 PM     By:   lexedo   (Member) I ran the 4c12bit.exe on the Mike H posted wav files. (As an FYI, those samples were a bit short amigo. In this regard, we look for watermarks at 0, 0:15, 0:30, 0:45, etc.) Anyway, here is the output from the utility. The "Title1 - Chapter 01" track is from my unmentionable Casino Royale DVD-A, which I used bc I know there are no watermarks. Figured this was cool w everyone bc of BB's birthday the other day. So, in summary, based on the very short samples posted by MH, no watermarking in those files. ========================= file: "e:\w24\01 - Snow White.wav" number_of_channels: 2, samples_per_second: 44100, bits_per_sample: 16 4C 12 Bit: 'X' - not watermarked, '0' - clear, '1' - set Initialize at 00:00:00.000 time channel 1 channel 2 ------------ ------------ ------------ 00:00:00.000 XXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXX Stop at 00:00:07.664 file: "e:\w24\03 A Flame Within.wav" number_of_channels: 2, samples_per_second: 44100, bits_per_sample: 16 4C 12 Bit: 'X' - not watermarked, '0' - clear, '1' - set Initialize at 00:00:00.000 time channel 1 channel 2 ------------ ------------ ------------ 00:00:00.000 XXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXX Stop at 00:00:12.625 file: "e:\w24\Title1 - Chapter 01.wav" number_of_channels: 2, samples_per_second: 192000, bits_per_sample: 24 4C 12 Bit: 'X' - not watermarked, '0' - clear, '1' - set Initialize at 00:00:00.000 time channel 1 channel 2 ------------ ------------ ------------ 00:00:00.000 XXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXX Initialize at 00:00:15.000 time channel 1 channel 2 ------------ ------------ ------------ 00:00:00.000 XXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXX Initialize at 00:00:30.000 time channel 1 channel 2 ------------ ------------ ------------ 00:00:00.000 XXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXX Initialize at 00:00:45.000 time channel 1 channel 2 ------------ ------------ ------------ 00:00:00.000 XXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXX Initialize at 00:01:00.000 time channel 1 channel 2 ------------ ------------ ------------ 00:00:00.000 XXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXX Initialize at 00:01:15.000 time channel 1 channel 2 ------------ ------------ ------------ 00:00:00.000 XXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXX Initialize at 00:01:30.000 time channel 1 channel 2 ------------ ------------ ------------ 00:00:00.000 XXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXX Initialize at 00:01:45.000 time channel 1 channel 2 ------------ ------------ ------------ 00:00:00.000 XXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXX Initialize at 00:02:00.000 time channel 1 channel 2 ------------ ------------ ------------ 00:00:00.000 XXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXX Initialize at 00:02:15.000 time channel 1 channel 2 ------------ ------------ ------------ 00:00:00.000 XXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXX Initialize at 00:02:30.000 time channel 1 channel 2 ------------ ------------ ------------ 00:00:00.000 XXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXX Stop at 00:02:38.997    Posted:   May 13, 2013 - 4:15 PM     By:   Mike_H   (Member) Thanks Lex. I wonder if it's just plain old compression artifacts after all. The joys of downloads.    Posted:   May 13, 2013 - 4:21 PM     By:   Jon Lewis   (Member) Lex, are you saying that the samples need to be at least 15 - 30 seconds to be able to confirm or deny the presence of watermarks via this method?    Posted:   May 13, 2013 - 4:22 PM     By:   Mike_H   (Member) Hm. I'll post a longer one from The New World. Gimme a sec..    Posted:   May 13, 2013 - 4:29 PM     By:   lexedo   (Member) Lex, are you saying that the samples need to be at least 15 - 30 seconds to be able to confirm or deny the presence of watermarks via this method? I figure something at least a minute should cover all the bases gents.    Posted:   May 13, 2013 - 4:31 PM     By:   Mike_H   (Member) I'll put a minute up.    Posted:   May 13, 2013 - 4:40 PM     By:   Mike_H   (Member) https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/22574835/03%20A%20Flame%20Within%20pt.2.wav (ps. David if there's any issue with posting a minute of music please delete or let me know. Thanks)    Posted:   May 13, 2013 - 5:11 PM     By:   lexedo   (Member) Below is the output from the newly posted file. Seems clean. You should ping member Marlene Dietrich to gain additional theoretical insights. I will try to do some research on this over the next few weeks bc I haven't looked at this stuff since DVD-A's were the rage. file: "e:\w24\03 A Flame Within pt.2.wav" number_of_channels: 2, samples_per_second: 44100, bits_per_sample: 16 4C 12 Bit: 'X' - not watermarked, '0' - clear, '1' - set Initialize at 00:00:00.000 time channel 1 channel 2 ------------ ------------ ------------ 00:00:00.000 XXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXX Initialize at 00:00:15.002 time channel 1 channel 2 ------------ ------------ ------------ 00:00:00.000 XXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXX Initialize at 00:00:30.004 time channel 1 channel 2 ------------ ------------ ------------ 00:00:00.000 XXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXX Initialize at 00:00:45.006 time channel 1 channel 2 ------------ ------------ ------------ 00:00:00.000 XXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXX Initialize at 00:01:00.009 time channel 1 channel 2 ------------ ------------ ------------ 00:00:00.000 XXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXX Stop at 00:01:04.009    Posted:   May 13, 2013 - 6:54 PM     By:   Jon Lewis   (Member) Interesting! So what is this damn ghost haunting the crash cymbals, choirs and pianos of UMG?    Posted:   May 13, 2013 - 6:54 PM     By:   Jon Lewis   (Member) Interesting! So what is this damn ghost haunting the crash cymbals, choirs and pianos of UMG?    Posted:   May 14, 2013 - 5:13 AM     By:   lexedo   (Member) Hey fellas, don't get too hung-up on the info I posted. There are likely other ways to run that program (e.g., options for sampling interval, etc.). Also, the tool I used was for specifically checking DVD-As that were watermarked, and I believe the DVD-A standard had a hook for watermarking. None of which would preclude a company from developing a proprietary watermarking method that couldn't be detected using the DVD-A watermarking standard as the reference. Technically, this requires further analysis, but I just don't have time right now. In between things I'll try to refine my understanding of the watermarking process in general, and post result back here as appropriate. (PS: Don't be afraid to post something close to the "exact times" where you feel you are hearing non-musical things.)    Posted:   May 14, 2013 - 9:47 AM     By:   Jon Lewis   (Member) Some online research implies the watermark tool used by UMG is (was?) called eFolio; however Matt Montag believes it is a tool developed by a Korean company called MarkAny.    Posted:   May 14, 2013 - 10:15 AM     By:   Jon Lewis   (Member) Also: I have been wanting to create a Spotify playlist showing off some of the more blatant tracks, and I still want to, but I haven't found the time yet. I just noticed that Matt Montag already did the same thing. I have not listened to it and assessed it yet myself. And I'll still do one of my own when I have some down time. But here's his link: http://open.spotify.com/user/ivionday/playlist/3ZbRKMGb8nqXqZziwtC5ZY     General Discussion: Is UMG audibly watermarking downloads?    << < 1 2 3  >   Go to page:  1 2 3   First Post    General Discussion • Trading Post • Non-Film Score Discussion  Profile • Preferences • Community Rules • Help/Contact • Search Board You must log in or register to post.   Go to page:  1 2 3

© 2024 Film Score Monthly. All Rights Reserved. Website maintained and powered by Veraprise and Matrimont.