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 Posted:   Jul 26, 2014 - 1:26 PM   
 By:   sound_of_harris   (Member)

I wonder if Trevor Jones will ever allow a proper full score release from the original session tapes that I understand he has? The limited edition was OK but obviously just a rip of the DVD isolated score track which is full of dodgy edits. Please Trevor fabulous score!!!

 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2014 - 2:09 PM   
 By:   Justin Boggan   (Member)

Well, I've seen two or three lables talk about Jones not being interested in doing releases. I think the last was MV, but I don't recall what he said. However, Roger said in 2013:

A few of us have been trying to show Trevor the love, but he hasn't been particularly interested in it.

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2014 - 2:25 PM   
 By:   sherrill50   (Member)

And aren't we really and finally due for an official, legitimate release of Jones' "Excalibur"? Yes, much of this is temp-tracked (largely from Wagner and Orff), but Jones still made substantial and beautiful contributions to the score. Such a release could also include Jones' unused themes for the film, which, to date, have only been avaliable on grey-market/boot releases.

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2014 - 2:25 PM   
 By:   sound_of_harris   (Member)

Just don't understand it. He's done so many scores to be proud of, why wouldn't someone want to see them in their ultimate form, if not for himself then at least for the fans? He must have been involved in the Cliffhanger Intrada release. Shame really.

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2014 - 2:36 PM   
 By:   jenkwombat   (Member)

Just don't understand it. He's done so many scores to be proud of, why wouldn't someone want to see them in their ultimate form, if not for himself then at least for the fans? He must have been involved in the Cliffhanger Intrada release. Shame really.

Can you say "Vangelis - 'Blade Runner'"?

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2014 - 3:45 PM   
 By:   Ford A. Thaxton   (Member)

Just don't understand it. He's done so many scores to be proud of, why wouldn't someone want to see them in their ultimate form, if not for himself then at least for the fans? He must have been involved in the Cliffhanger Intrada release. Shame really.

FYI, the production company had the master tapes for CLIFFHANGER, not Trevor Jones.

Now I don't know how close he worked with INTRADA on that one.

But he doesn't seem very interested in releasing his old score too much unless it's on his label.

Ford A. Thaxton

 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2014 - 4:03 PM   
 By:   solium   (Member)

I thought composers are "for hire" when they write music for films, and the production companies own the copyrights? Of course if the composer has the only elements you probably don't want to tick them off by going around their back (to the production company) and say hand over the masters.

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2014 - 4:05 PM   
 By:   Ford A. Thaxton   (Member)

I thought composers are "for hire" when they write music for films, and the production companies own the copyrights? Of course if the composer has the only elements you probably don't want to tick them off by going around their back (to the production company) and say hand over the masters.

You mean the MASTER TAPES THEY PAID FOR?

God forbid the owners would ask for them tapes back after paying for them

:-)

Ford A. Thaxton

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2014 - 4:49 PM   
 By:   bobbengan   (Member)

This score holds a special place in my heart and will always be a favorite; It's the earliest score I have a memory of loving and noticing in a film's context - Wow, probably stemming from age 3 or 4 - and I happily popped $70 of my first-ever paycheck at age 14 or so to own the 2-Disc Special Edition.

While there are a few terrific cues omitted from the original LP assembly (one such moment that comes to mind being Jen's discovery of the dark crystal itsels near the finale, which has a brief but fantastically dramatic rendition of the main theme), this one is a case where I think the re-construction for album listening purposes (I'm talking the LP assembly / La La Land Records release) was nailed pretty perfectly.

The "Overture" alone is worth the price of admission, and beyond that, the concert arrangement of the "Love Theme" is a spectacular achievement that ranks or me as perhaps Jones' most passionate theme ever; It's just magnificent and eclipses any rendition of the theme heard in the film in the same way the concert arrangement of "Princess Leia's Theme" was a brilliant and pivotal piece of writing that wouldn't have existed were it not for that wonderful album arrangement, to give one other such example.

The sound quality on that album assembly is also pretty freaking fantastic to boot and thankfully, a lot of the synthesizer bits that comprise some of the less-interesting underscore in the film are largely absent, allowing themes and set pieces to reign supreme over a well-paced 40 minutes. NATES AND HAYES' album assembly is similarly incomplete but excellent and well-balanced.

Still... Being that I love this score dearly... If a complete expanded version with better sound quality than the DVD-ripped 2nd disc of the Numenorean Music release was made available, I would definitely get it. I'd be interested to hear if there's any unused or alternate pieces as well.

This score, along with Jones' NATE AND HAYES and THE SENDER, are favorites of mine from this composer. Just love all three, and they all sound like they exist in the same "sound world" the same way early Horner sci-fi/fantasy scores (Krull/Battle Beyond the Stars/Trek II/Brainstorm) and early David Arnold works (Independence Day/Last of the Dogmen/Stargate) sound like they also exist within those respective composers' special little "musical universe" they discovered as their careers were beginning, if that makes sense.

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 27, 2014 - 2:26 AM   
 By:   sound_of_harris   (Member)

Nice to hear this score is as special to others as well as myself. The finale music is simply spine tingling. I tend to listen to fantasy scores as I work in my studio and this one really helps the imagination to run riot! Shame the sequel got put on hold as it would have given Trevor a chance to expand on the first score....assuming he was interested of course!

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 2, 2014 - 8:37 PM   
 By:   dan the man   (Member)

This was one of my favorite scores of all time.Enjoyable throughout and A LOVELY LOVE THEME.

 
 Posted:   Aug 2, 2014 - 8:45 PM   
 By:   The Projectionist   (Member)

In the last interview I heard with Trevor Jones he said he didn't have the master tapes and they were in hands of the Jim Henson company.

 
 Posted:   Aug 2, 2014 - 9:31 PM   
 By:   cwtlead   (Member)

Still... Being that I love this score dearly... If a complete expanded version with better sound quality than the DVD-ripped 2nd disc of the Numenorean Music release was made available, I would definitely get it. I'd be interested to hear if there's any unused or alternate pieces as well.

I'm confused... Is the first disc of the Numenorean 2-disc set equal to the LLL single disc? Understanding the second disc is a DVD rip.... Between the first one and LLL's, which has the better sound quality and presentation as mentioned with the love theme and overture? Are they equal?....

Thanks for helping clear this up.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 2, 2014 - 10:22 PM   
 By:   jwb   (Member)

There is an interview out there where Jones said that he would love for his music to be released. But then we get people like La La and Intrada saying he doesn't. Perhaps its financial and Jones wants a cut. But I wouldn't have thought Jones would have any right over say of who can release his scores, unless he has contracts saying otherwise, but I find that doubtful as normally the studio has that. I do know the labels like to involve the composer, so perhaps that is it. Either way, its all confusing.

 
 Posted:   Aug 2, 2014 - 10:26 PM   
 By:   MKRUltra   (Member)


I'm confused... Is the first disc of the Numenorean 2-disc set equal to the LLL single disc? Understanding the second disc is a DVD rip.... Between the first one and LLL's, which has the better sound quality and presentation as mentioned with the love theme and overture? Are they equal?....

Thanks for helping clear this up.


The first disc of the Numenorean set and the LLL disc are identical in terms of presentation -- they both reproduce the original soundtrack album. Having not heard the LLL disc I can't comment on if it sounds better or not.

And Disc 2 of the Numenorean was not simply a straight port of the film edit isolated score that you hear on the DVD, there was editing done to clean it up a bit and make it more listenable, fixing broken cues and dodgy edits present on the film track. It still wasn't the complete score from the original masters, but it was a fine presentation given what they had to work with.

 
 Posted:   Aug 2, 2014 - 10:57 PM   
 By:   cwtlead   (Member)


I'm confused... Is the first disc of the Numenorean 2-disc set equal to the LLL single disc? Understanding the second disc is a DVD rip.... Between the first one and LLL's, which has the better sound quality and presentation as mentioned with the love theme and overture? Are they equal?....

Thanks for helping clear this up.


The first disc of the Numenorean set and the LLL disc are identical in terms of presentation -- they both reproduce the original soundtrack album. Having not heard the LLL disc I can't comment on if it sounds better or not.

And Disc 2 of the Numenorean was not simply a straight port of the film edit isolated score that you hear on the DVD, there was editing done to clean it up a bit and make it more listenable, fixing broken cues and dodgy edits present on the film track. It still wasn't the complete score from the original masters, but it was a fine presentation given what they had to work with.


Thank you for the information.

Anyone have sound comparison from the Numenorean and LLL album version of this score?

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 2, 2014 - 11:19 PM   
 By:   Ford A. Thaxton   (Member)

There is an interview out there where Jones said that he would love for his music to be released. But then we get people like La La and Intrada saying he doesn't. Perhaps its financial and Jones wants a cut. But I wouldn't have thought Jones would have any right over say of who can release his scores, unless he has contracts saying otherwise, but I find that doubtful as normally the studio has that. I do know the labels like to involve the composer, so perhaps that is it. Either way, its all confusing.

He has REFUSED to give the tapes back to the Henson Company.

He'll only do it, if he's granted the rights on his terms.

Otherwise he's not letting anyone else do it despite the fact he doesn't own them.

That's the bottom-line.

Ford A. Thaxton


 
 Posted:   Aug 3, 2014 - 7:44 AM   
 By:   edwzoomom   (Member)

There is an interview out there where Jones said that he would love for his music to be released. But then we get people like La La and Intrada saying he doesn't. Perhaps its financial and Jones wants a cut. But I wouldn't have thought Jones would have any right over say of who can release his scores, unless he has contracts saying otherwise, but I find that doubtful as normally the studio has that. I do know the labels like to involve the composer, so perhaps that is it. Either way, its all confusing.

He has REFUSED to give the tapes back to the Henson Company.

He'll only do it, if he's granted the rights on his terms.

Otherwise he's not letting anyone else do it despite the fact he doesn't own them.

That's the bottom-line.

Ford A. Thaxton


This is so sad and so frustrating to hear. This is one score my children have asked me to share with them. I introduced them to this film and Return to Oz when they were young. They fell in love with Dark Crystal but not the latter. They listened to my La-La Land release but I am sure would love an expanded version. Sounds like he is holding them hostage with no ransom deal in sight.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 3, 2014 - 8:22 AM   
 By:   Kevin Costigan   (Member)

He has REFUSED to give the tapes back to the Henson Company.

He'll only do it, if he's granted the rights on his terms.

Otherwise he's not letting anyone else do it despite the fact he doesn't own them.

That's the bottom-line.

Ford A. Thaxton


Doesn't Disney own all the Henson Stuff now? (or maybe just the Muppets?) Wouldnt Jones's holding the tapes be harboring stolen property? I'm surprised Disney, in all its infinate power doesnt send their Men In Black and pluck it out of his hands. Even with no intention to use it? Just to show him who is god.

Anyone see the South Park episide where Mickey Mouse kicks the shit out of the Jonas Brothers because they refused to wear the purity rings. LOL

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 3, 2014 - 8:26 AM   
 By:   Kevin Costigan   (Member)



FYI, the production company had the master tapes for CLIFFHANGER, not Trevor Jones.

Ford A. Thaxton


Thank goodness for that. The Intrada album put to rest a top grail of mine. To think if Jones had that, we'd still be waiting.

 
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