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Posted: |
Aug 15, 2014 - 5:55 AM
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By: |
Tall Guy
(Member)
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By a tapestry, I mean a score that accompanies a story of perhaps epic proportions, where an extra bit of care seems to have been taken by the composer, without any (or too much) influence from temp tracking. A score of a particularly substantial nature that might define the composer in decades to come where the rest of their works may have been forgotten by all but the enthusiast.
There's much debate to be had on this topic (I hope!) but I'll start the ball rolling with a few thoughts...
Howard Shore
An easy one to start with, because I can't see anything beyond The Lord of the Rings trilogy. He's composed some fine scores, but many of my favourites are bijoux - such as The Departed - or not quite in the same league, such as The Aviator.
Miklos Rozsa
Another sitter, for me at least - it has to be Ben-Hur. The length and thematic variety speaks for itself, and of course that film! I played the two volumes of LP to death, which also makes it a personal choice.
John Williams
Much harder. Logic dictates that it should be Indiana Jones, Star Wars or Harry Potter, but after a lot of consideration I'd go for AI. I listened to the promo again the other day, and for me it has an existence on another plane from all the rest of his scores. The colours inherent to the long tracks are wonderfully impressionistic, and it also contains one of his greatest melodies (I don't have the vocalised version from the standard CD on my playlist).
Jerry Goldsmith
Another tough one, because you may be aware of my ambivialence for a lot of his music. That said, I've heard what I believe to be a majority of it, and my choice is QB VII. I've only got the original short version, but he clearly put heart and soul into it. and while Star Trek looms large, I believe the TV score might also have been his choice.
Ennio Morricone
The hardest of them all, due to the enormous choice and consistently high quality. The Red Tent, Once...West and Once...America all vied for my attention, as well as the superb TV scores for Moses, Nostromo and others, and in truth I'm not yet sure that I've decided 100% on one. But I'm choosing Novocento especially if there's a fully scored 48 hour (or whatever  ) version out there somewhere.
John Barry
Also difficult, but in this case it's because I see JB as more of a chamber composer than a grand symphonic one. Sweeping scores aren't hard to find, though, and Zulu, Out of Africa and Raise the Titanic were knocking, as well as OHMSS and Thunderball, both of which have epic tapestry-type feels to them in places. However, my choice, wavering a little, is Dances With Wolves, even though it's actually way down my list of favourite scores.
Would you agree with these choices, or do you have others that you might feel are more appropriate and might try to change my mind over? What about other composers? Not like there aren't many to choose from! And for those who want to mention Michael Giacchino (which only time prevents me from doing) I'd say that video games can count, as well.
TG
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Posted: |
Aug 15, 2014 - 2:12 PM
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By: |
joan hue
(Member)
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This is a great topic, Tall Guy. It takes some reading and thought. (That may eliminate certain posters.)
I also admit that one man’s “epic” may not be another person’s epic, so I hope you’ll allow some leeway in your criteria. (Of course, you’ll allow some leeway as there is no point is arguing with a woman.)
I certainly agree with you about Shore’s LOTR scores. Epic and grand! Those scores may be his defining scores.
I agree with you about Rozsa’s Ben Hur. Fits your criteria. Another epic movie that he scored even though it was not critically well-received was King Of Kings. I actually like that major themes in this score even better even than in Ben Hur, but Ben Hur is probably his defining accomplishment.
I can’t say I’ve ever really studied A.I. by John Williams. Given your criteria, I’d probably pick the original Star Wars Trilogy as his magnum opus. He composed so many iconic themes for this series. It certainly introduced many people into the grandeur of film scores.
I don’t know Novocento by Morricone. His “Dollar” series certainly introduced people to his unique western sounds. I’d probably pick two movies. Once Upon A Time In The West provides an epic narrative as well as amazing themes, but above that one, I’d pick The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly. People still recognize his major themes, and I believe he composed the finest cue ever written for films score when he composed Ecstasy of Gold. He has composed so many larger-than-life scores that it is hard to pick one.
I think Dances With Wolves was a perfect choice for Barry.
If I were to pick an epic animated film or films, I’d pick Powell’s How To Train Your Dragon 1 & 2. He did a magnificent job in “1” and extended his themes as well as creating new themes in “2.” I don’t know if this will be his defining score, but it will come close.
Is it all right to combine several movies? I think Goldsmith’s magnum opus (opuses) can be heard in his Star Trek scores. Star Trek TMP wasn’t an epic movie; it was rather dull movie, but the music was amazing and defining. Then he went on to score more Star Trek movies using original themes and adding new major themes to each film. It is this COMBINATION of work that I find stunning.
Even though it is in black and white and less than three hours long, I think To Kill A Mockingbird is an epic movie. Bernstein said he struggled at first with this scoring until he thought about how a child narrated the story. Seeing all the adult issues through the eyes of a child inspired him to compose with a new music voice that is dramatic, sublime, scary, child-like and always perfect. (I would probably add The Magnificent Seven to your criteria at some point.)
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for maurice jarre i choose Orrans.
for ennio - for the depth and variety and power, the pinnacle of all his ideas from the previous two films and bursting with innovation - i choose Gbu. a sprawling score which if you look up tapestry score in the dictionary theres a picture of eli wallach running around graves to a wordless aria.
for alex north Spartacus. not for nothing is it such a highly regarded score, one which could even handle a box set on its own.
agree rozsa Ben Hur.
Bernstein well, gotta be the energy he found for Magnificent seven. the heartbeat which drove the film.
more to follow. debating goldsmith and goodwin and williams.
edit. Goodwin has to be Where eagles dare, the pinnacle of his war scores and his own personal favourite.
goldsmith is a tough one. Patton is my favourite score so tapestry score, well, for extra effort and for displaying his theme writing and delivering a big score that improved a film id go for Wind and the lion.
all imo.
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Posted: |
Aug 15, 2014 - 3:34 PM
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By: |
bobbengan
(Member)
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Great topic indeed!
For James Horner, I choose the insanely brilliant KRULL. This score just boggles the mind!
For Elmer Bernstein, I'd choose HEAVY METAL, followed closely by his rejected SCARLET LETTER which is extremely diverse, colorful and powerful of scope.
Agreed with Rozsa's BEN HUR being his most vast and varied, though QUE VADIS isn't far behind in that regard. However, my favorite theme of his will probably always be the title/love theme of EL CID. Just stunning!
For John Scott I'd have to pick ANTONY & CLEOPATRA, an early masterwork of his, though BECOMING COLETTE is a stunning period romance score with perhaps a little more versatility.
For Basil Poledouris, CONAN has got to take the cake. Lots going on in that one.
Trevor Jones' THE DARK CRYSTAL, followed closely by his follow-up score to NATE AND HAYES (a wonderful extension of the 'sound' he established in DC).
For James Newton Howard, WYATT EARP is probably his most sprawling, though KING KONG is no slouch!
For David Arnold, definitely INDEPENDENCE DAY, even though I think LAST OF THE DOGMEN is a more consistent and enjoyable score from a listening-experience POV.
For Lee Holdridge, IN SEARCH OF PEACE just might fit the bill. That one's a real whopper!
I'm going to have to give a special mention to a BRILLIANT score I just discovered: Michiru Oshima's FULLMETAL ALCHEMIST. I don't watch, nor care for, anime by rule of thumb, but I've been told time and again they often contain amazing orchestral scores and if this one is any indication, that appears to be something of an understatement. This one just soars: A brilliant and instantly memorable central march, gorgeous soaring themes, tragic lament, incredibly brassy/Rozsa-esque stomping action motifs, operatic laments and surging, heroic triumph abound. It's freaking awesome!
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Posted: |
Aug 15, 2014 - 5:22 PM
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By: |
Ron Pulliam
(Member)
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Not comprehensive, or complete:
John Williams - I'm hard-pressed to think of one that would capture ALL the facets of his talents. I'm very partial to "The Accidental Tourist" and "Jane Eyre", but "Close Encounters of the Third Kind" is a miraculous score. I love all the SW scores, but "The Empire Strikes Back" is my favorite. The only Indiana Jones score I really love is "Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade". I'm extremely fond of "The Towering Inferno" and his work on "Goodbye, Mr. Chips". Each of these scores offers different facets of his talent while maintaining a firm grasp on his musical voice. If it was just one? Would you believe "The Fury"?
Jerry Goldsmith - If it were just one, it would be "The Sand Pebbles". A close second would be "The Boys from Brazil" just edging out "Star Trek: The Motion Picture". None of those, however, captures the sheer romance and ardor of "Basic Instinct" or the other-worldly textures of "Alien". And then there is "Patton" sitting there in a class totally by itself, IMO, although Goldsmith owned the war genre in the 70s.
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Posted: |
Aug 17, 2014 - 5:42 AM
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By: |
Tall Guy
(Member)
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This is a great topic, Tall Guy. It takes some reading and thought. (That may eliminate certain posters.)
Bwa-ha-ha-ha! Wicked person...
Thanks to all for the thoughts. It occurred to me that, to be a satisfying answer, the score chosen per composer has to be a big canvas in absolute terms. It isn't enough to say "such and such a score is the nearest this composer got". There are plenty of composers who have produced a bunch of wonderful scores without ever having the chance to play in such an arena. For example, I'm struggling to think of one for Lalo Schifrin, a favourite of mine for many years. I really want to say Kelly's Heroes but it just doesn't get over the line for me, much as I love it.
Roy Budd is another composer who I don't believe had the chance, despite such great scores as Fear is the Key and The Wild Geese. One possibility however is his score for Phantom of the Opera, which might afford the chance due to the large scale music required by both the story and the silent nature of the film.
Maurice Jarre is at the other end of the scale; almost every score I can think of might fall into this category. The obvious ones are the Lean films, and I'd agree thatLawrence of Arabia probably just edges out Zhivago. Grand Prix and The Man Who Would be King would qualify, too.
My choice for Delerue would unsurprisingly be La Révolution Française. I've been lucky enough to own this for some time, and I'm delighted that it's been re-issued to a wider audience.
Another toss up concerns Dimitri Tiomkin, where my choice would be The Alamo by a nose over The Guns of Navarone. This is another personal instance, as it was one of the first LPs I was aware of as a young kid in the 1960s. The breadth of the score from the lullaby to the final battle makes it a worthy choice.
A sad missed opportunity is my controversial choice for Gabriel Yared. His score for Troy ticks every box with the pretty significant exception that it was cruelly and (in my opinion) wrongly rejected - even though it was replaced in part by Shostakovich!
Let's have some more of your favourite composers' version of Beethoven's Ninth, Picasso's Guernica, Joyce's Ulysses or Rembrandt's Night Watch...
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