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Of course, nobody said that John Wilson is the first and only, but I'm always happy to see the late Mr. McGlinn receive recognition for his great work. But since Conrad Salinger is your hero, (one of mine, too), I'll put in a good word here for Christopher Palmer and Elmer Bernstein who, unless I'm mistaken -- always a possibility, alas -- were the first ones to devote an entire album to Salinger's glory days at MGM.
As usual, all I can say about a Manderley post is thank you and amen.
An album, I'm sorry to say, I find unlistenable. Lackluster vocals and all-over-the-place orchestral performances.
John Wilson makes it all much, MUCH better.
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Posted: |
Sep 5, 2014 - 5:20 PM
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By: |
manderley
(Member)
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Regie said.....
.....This seems to have strayed away from the OP, but can anyone tell me about the Conrad Salinger Orchestra? They must have been around when "Connie" was alive because this U-Tube link says their "That's Entertainment" was recorded in 1958 and "Connie" died in 1961......
and WILLIAMMCCRUM said.....
.....There never was any actual 'Conrad Salinger Orchestra'. It was a studio group, almost certainly the MGM SO. It's just the '...and his orchestra' phenomenon again for recording and broadcasting purposes......
This late 1950s Verve recording of Conrad Salinger's music, A LOVELY AFTERNOON, was conducted by Buddy Bregman.
We had an extensive discussion about this album quite some years ago here on the FSM Board. Like William McCrum, I had also surmised that the "Conrad Salinger Orchestra" was a re-branded MGM Studio Orchestra, recorded at MGM for their MGM Records subsidiary Verve label.
I was wrong.
A poster, whose name I don't recall, but who knew Bregman personally, indicated that Bregman had put together the orchestra for this session, which was actually recorded at Capitol Records. I believe he indicated that Salinger was present at the sessions, and that he had assisted in putting together the arrangements/orchestrations for the other several other melodies not associated with the MGM films that appear in the album. The choice of "The Conrad Salinger Orchestra" name was, as I recall, a simple honorary tribute to Salinger.
I've always loved this album, particularly in stereo, and am always amazed at how well it duplicated the MGM sound.
(As an additional thought, I was always shocked that the 1970s producers at MGM saw fit to hire Nelson Riddle and Henry Mancini to do the surrounding scores for the THAT'S ENTERTAINMENT documentary features, rather than hire true MGM people like Alexander Courage or Andre Previn or someone with an MGM sensibility like Bregman. Mancini and Riddle, while fine artists, just didn't get the old MGM sound and style, even though they had worked there previously on occasion.)
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Posted: |
Sep 5, 2014 - 5:46 PM
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By: |
manderley
(Member)
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.....Has anybody else noticed that in the film, when Wynn and Whitmore (sounds like a Vaudeville team -- most appropriate) are brushing up their Shakespeare, when they get to the line, "If she says your behavior is heinous, kick her right in the Coriolanus," the editor cuts away to a reaction shot of Howard Keel? I'll bet good money that Hermes Pan's choreography had one of the gangsters kicking the other one in the butt, to emphasize Porter's pun, but the studio, fearing the censors, eliminated that move by employing the cutaway shot......
With apologies to Mr. Preston.....I'd like to suggest another possibility:
KISS ME KATE was photographed in 3-D.
What a fabulous idea it would be to photograph a kick in the pants in 3-D, particular if you could either make it begin by having the leg of the kicker swoop out over the heads of the audience momentarily and then land on the kickee's butt, or perhaps, a kick directly toward the lens by the kicker, followed by its arrival on the butt of the kickee in the following shot.
But what if, in the end, that gag didn't really work when you looked at it in the dailies a day or so later?
You're going to have to do a retake, or cover the deleted footage with something else. How about a cutaway to Howard Keel watching the proceedings.....
What a selling point it might have been, however.....
"You saw BWANA DEVIL in 3D!
.....The first movie with A LOVER IN YOUR ARMS and A LION IN YOUR LAP.....
and now, MGM presents KISS ME KATE,
the first 3D movie with new sights, new sounds, new screen, and.....
A KICK IN THE PANTS!".....
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Posted: |
Sep 5, 2014 - 6:22 PM
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By: |
manderley
(Member)
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PNJ said.....
.....Of course, nobody said that John Wilson is the first and only, but I'm always happy to see the late Mr. McGlinn receive recognition for his great work. But since Conrad Salinger is your hero, (one of mine, too), I'll put in a good word here for Christopher Palmer and Elmer Bernstein who, unless I'm mistaken -- always a possibility, alas -- were the first ones to devote an entire album to Salinger's glory days at MGM......
and Ron P said.....
.....An album, I'm sorry to say, I find unlistenable. Lackluster vocals and all-over-the-place orchestral performances.....
While I don't find Bernstein's MEMORABLE MUSIC FROM THE MGM MUSICALS unlistenable, I'd say that I pretty much agree with Mr. Pulliam on his assessment.
I have to express this negativity despite the fact that I've always felt I was perhaps accidentally responsible for suggesting the idea and having it wallow around in Bernstein's mind for a few years!:
Back in the 1970s, when the THAT'S ENTERTAINMENT movies were making the rounds, and when Astaire and Kelly and several other MGM old-timers were recording new stereo vocal albums in London, it struck me that it would be nice to have new stereo recordings of some of the MGM vocal and orchestral musical stuff, based on the original orchestrations, utilizing some of the stars who'd recorded the material originally (while they still could sing).
Somewhere I had heard or read that Elmer Bernstein was a fan of Salinger's work and during this 70s period, Bernstein was beginning his Film Music Collection series of albums. I had occasion to write Bernstein several times thanking him for one or another of his albums, and during one of those letters I ventured this idea to him. He actually wrote back, thanking me for my compliments, and indicated that he might consider the MGM/Salinger idea in the future.
I believe it was quite a few years later, probably the '80s in fact, that the LP (with the CD issue in 1992) came out. I was thrilled that he had accomplished this, but in listening to it I was alternately elated and then disappointed. There was, as I recall, a lot of reverb to it, and I thought the singers, while professional, were very badly chosen for their vocal inflections and sound. I was also upset by Palmer's "iffy" re-constructions and personal additions to the material. Some things I liked, but others were big disappointments.
Still.....until the days of the Turner/Rhino CD series, where the original soundtracks were assembled, dusted off, sometimes re-worked from their multi-track push-pull elements into stereo versions.....Bernstein's take on Salinger was just about all we had and I accepted the deficiencies just to have it at all. This was a gutsy recording for Chandos to undertake in that era and I appreciated that willingness of them to take a chance in the marketplace with this kind of old material.
But now, John Wilson has finally come closest to what the originals were, and I'm thrilled to have these come our way. I hope the ideas and the recordings will continue.
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Hi, Manderley, Hi,gang --
Interesting theory about "Shakespeare," obviously one I never considered before. Well, ain't that a kick in the head!
***
My dream for Mr. Wilson is anther Astaire production number besides "Hat/Haiti," but to me much richer in mood and musicality: "Limehouse Blues" from ZIEGFELD FOLLIES. Including the parts that weren't used in the picture but which can be heard on the Rhino OST, and any other unheard stuff from that sequence's score.
Come to think of it, they filmed part of that on leftover DORIAN GRAY sets... Why not record some of Herbert Stothart's haunting Chopin variations from that Oscar Wilde film? Wilson does such a great job with the musical comedy stuff, wouldn't it be wonderful if he occasionally branched out into underscore? I can dream, can't I?
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SNAFU
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SNAFU II
(Did I ever tell you I hate computers?)
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