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 Posted:   Sep 19, 2014 - 6:32 PM   
 By:   OnyaBirri   (Member)

…I almost always prefer a re-recording over the original tracks. Scores with jazz/pop elements are too problematic, so that leaves out Italy and France. But I do almost always want the re-recording of orchestral scores, if someone bothers to re-record them.

What sayest thou?

 
 Posted:   Sep 19, 2014 - 7:21 PM   
 By:   Sirusjr   (Member)

I tend to split pretty evenly. It is pretty common for older scores that there is a special feel from the original tapes that I don't get with a re-recording. Something about the way that scores were performed and recorded back then just isn't present in modern recordings.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 19, 2014 - 7:37 PM   
 By:   KonstantinosZ   (Member)

i always prefer the original recordings.

 
 Posted:   Sep 20, 2014 - 3:46 AM   
 By:   Josh "Swashbuckler" Gizelt   (Member)

I can't make a blanket call one way or the other. It depends too much on the performance for me.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 20, 2014 - 4:17 AM   
 By:   Tall Guy   (Member)

It's nice to have modern sound rather than archival, but I suppose much comes down to how well I know the music from watching the film. It can be a bit jarring when you expect one thing and get another.

On the other hand, if you know a re-recording very well and THEN see the film, the latter might come up short.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 20, 2014 - 5:10 AM   
 By:   Thor   (Member)

When it comes to older scores marred by sound problems (by today's standards), I almost always prefer re-recordings. For newer scores, it depends more.

By the way, you might be interested in this MAMMOTH thread on the same topic that we did years ago. Some really good exchanges here (especially between estgrey and myself), if you have the time and stamina to read through it:

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=11030&forumID=1&archive=1

 
 Posted:   Sep 20, 2014 - 5:54 AM   
 By:   Nicolai P. Zwar   (Member)

It depends, but frequently I find it interesting to listen to a score I already know well anew when a new recording becomes available. If I listen to a particular orchestral score often, it is great to have several options. It is not always a matter of "better" or "lesser" but of "different". Usually, those scores that do get re-recorded are the ones that are worth listening to in several recordings, too.

For example, I do have the Tadlow recording of Conan the Barbarian as well as the Intada 3-CD release. At this point in time, I listen to the Tadlow while the Intrada is still sitting sealed in the shelf*. Why? Because I am more familiar with the original tracks (had them for years), and so I prefer the newer, fresher recording Nic Raine conducted. But the time will come when I feel like exploring the original tracks again, and then I will be able to explore them in full on the sonically updated Intrada. I enjoy having options.




* I usuallly have a few CDs sitting sealed on my shelf, simply because I don't have the time to listen to everything right away, but I love the idea of sitting there in the evening, deciding what to listen to, and on occasion opening up a sealed CD, reading the booklet and listening to a score I haven't heard.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 20, 2014 - 5:55 AM   
 By:   jenkwombat   (Member)

I almost always prefer the original recording...

...unless of course, the tapes have deteriorated to the point of being unlistenable, in which case, a re-recording will obviously have to suffice.


ADDED: Although, Nicolai makes a great point in his first paragraph above too. It's nice to hear different "takes" on a score.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 20, 2014 - 8:46 AM   
 By:   Graham Watt   (Member)

I basically agree with some things that Onya himself said at the end of that lengthy thread which Thor linked to, but I'm a tiny bit more nuanced. In general I'll always prefer the ORIGINAL tracks, provided they are in a good enough condition. But I have heard some re-recordings which equal or surpass the originals for me - the Broughton-conducted Rózsas, for example. In fact there are plenty. But IN GENERAL I'll have the original please. I'm talking orchestral scores here.

Where I'm less flexible is in jazz or rock-based scores, because the performance of the individual musicians is often fundamental, and impossible to recreate. I don't think I'd like to hear a re-recording of THE GAUNTLET for instance. Those Art Pepper and Jon Faddis solos are integral to Fielding's intentions.

That doesn't mean to say that if I heard a jazz group tackle THE GAUNTLET at a live concert I wouldn't be thrilled, but it would still be a "re-imagining", a different animal, and that's fine too, as long as you know what (not) to expect.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 20, 2014 - 9:13 AM   
 By:   OnyaBirri   (Member)

I tend to split pretty evenly. It is pretty common for older scores that there is a special feel from the original tapes that I don't get with a re-recording. Something about the way that scores were performed and recorded back then just isn't present in modern recordings.

Those sound of the "older" recordings can be attributed more to recording techniques, such as mic placement, compression and limiting, than to playing styles. Granted, those old Hollywood orchestras were comprised of top-shelf players.

Many have attributed the sound of the original "Psycho" recordings to conducting or playing techniques, when what they are really hearing is the recording techniques. It is interesting that this can warp our perceptions of the music, playing, and conducting.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 20, 2014 - 10:24 AM   
 By:   Thor   (Member)

For me, the 'original' has never really been that important, since the film is not my point-of-departure for enjoying soundtracks. It's only the music that counts, and I really couldn't care less about the fidelity to any original. I guess that explains why I veer more towards rerecordings than most others here.

But it's different with electronic scores for me. Not because of the film's original tracks, necessarily, but because the electronic sounds are more uniquely crafted (it's not just the technology being used, but also how it's tweaked and combined). For example, only Vangelis can do proper Vangelis. It doesn't help how good the rerecording artist is in approximating his sound.

 
 Posted:   Sep 20, 2014 - 10:25 AM   
 By:   Solium   (Member)

Aren't most album presentations rerecordings? I find that I like most rerecordings done by the original composers. Though they are usually very faithful to their soundtrack counterparts.

Sometimes I really dislike new artistic interpretations even by the same composer, like "The Asteroid Field" from "Pops In Space". I usually don't like others doing rerecordings unless they are extremely faithful to the sound and tempo of the original. I generally enjoyed Erich Kunzel's interpretations. Most others not so much.

I support rerecording mono or tinty sounding soundtracks. But over all I favor the Recording Sessions as it's pretty much what I fell in love with when I watch a film.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 20, 2014 - 10:28 AM   
 By:   OnyaBirri   (Member)

For me, the 'original' has never really been that important, since the film is not my point-of-departure for enjoying soundtracks. It's only the music that counts, and I really couldn't care less about the fidelity to any original. I guess that explains why I veer more towards rerecordings than most others here.

But it's different with electronic scores for me. Not because of the film's original tracks, necessarily, but because the electronic sounds are more uniquely crafted (it's not just the technology being used, but also how it's tweaked and combined). For example, only Vangelis can do proper Vangelis. It doesn't help how good the rerecording artist is in approximating his sound.


Agree, and this is how I feel about most scores with jazz or pop elements. Too much can go wrong with regard to style, gear, and/or production values.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 20, 2014 - 10:31 AM   
 By:   Thor   (Member)

Well, for jazz it depends more for me. It's closer to orchestral music than electronic music in this particular circumstance, for sure.

For example, I enjoy the rerecording of MANNIX more than the original. Something about the smoother sound which makes each track more of a standalone piece, IMO.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 20, 2014 - 10:39 AM   
 By:   Morricone   (Member)

Originals. Of course I am not only going against the grain of fans but the composers themselves. Bernard Herrmann, John Williams, Ennio Morricone, Jerry Goldsmith, Alfred Newman and many more did and do not like their music for film presented as-is. They insisted for concerts and re-recordings it be changed, sometimes dramatically. I almost always hear how it waters down the impact. David Newman told me he tends not to want to do his father's music in concert or recordings because there are little things that Alfred got out of the orchestra (particularly the strings) that are way too hard to recreate. So unless someone has made it a science to emulate exactly the nuances of a composer (William Stromberg/John Morgan on Bernard Herrmann and Max Steiner) I go for original recordings every time. Particularly with the new technology that makes them sound better and better. The purity of their intention when they had no restrictions and the way they formed the orchestra to bend to the demands of the scene is what makes film music FILM MUSIC for me. The rest are cover versions.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 20, 2014 - 10:39 AM   
 By:   OnyaBirri   (Member)

Well, for jazz it depends more for me. It's closer to orchestral music than electronic music in this particular circumstance, for sure.

For example, I enjoy the rerecording of MANNIX more than the original. Something about the smoother sound which makes each track more of a standalone piece, IMO.


I think we've discussed this before, but I think the Mannix remake is awful. The production, heavy-handed playing, and in some cases, instrumentation are at odds with the compositional style.

 
 Posted:   Sep 20, 2014 - 10:42 AM   
 By:   Mr. Jack   (Member)

Unless the original tracks have REALLY archival sound quality, I almost always prefer them to a re-recording. Recording directly to film always means a more dynamic performance than performing to the whim of a conductor who will often take the music at a more leisurely pace to allow it to "breathe".

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 20, 2014 - 10:42 AM   
 By:   Thor   (Member)

I think we've discussed this before, but I think the Mannix remake is awful. The production, heavy-handed playing, and in some cases, instrumentation are at odds with the compositional style.

Yeah, we've discussed it a few times before. In fact, I see that the last few posts of the long thread linked to above was about that.

But we'll have to agree to disagree in our assessments. I just think it flows so well -- smooth transitions between instruments, crystal clear sound, perfected tempo changes etc. It's more 'lush' and less 'grit', which is something I love.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 20, 2014 - 10:46 AM   
 By:   Thor   (Member)

Particularly with the new technology that makes them sound better and better. The purity of their intention when they had no restrictions and the way they formed the orchestra to bend to the demands of the scene is what makes film music FILM MUSIC for me. The rest are cover versions.

I think you're maybe glorifying the intial situation there, Morricone. There were often plenty of restrictions in the original recordings, not the least of which is orchestra size. I'm fairly confident Max Steiner would have preferred the larger orchestra and more fullbodied sound of Morgan & Stromberg's KING KONG than his own -- IMO -- rather skimpy original (both in terms of performance and sound).

 
 Posted:   Sep 20, 2014 - 10:03 PM   
 By:   Sirusjr   (Member)

I tend to split pretty evenly. It is pretty common for older scores that there is a special feel from the original tapes that I don't get with a re-recording. Something about the way that scores were performed and recorded back then just isn't present in modern recordings.

Those sound of the "older" recordings can be attributed more to recording techniques, such as mic placement, compression and limiting, than to playing styles. Granted, those old Hollywood orchestras were comprised of top-shelf players.

Many have attributed the sound of the original "Psycho" recordings to conducting or playing techniques, when what they are really hearing is the recording techniques. It is interesting that this can warp our perceptions of the music, playing, and conducting.


Yeah well whatever it is, there is a huge difference between the different options. I would like to see a modern recording studio try to replicate the old style sound of an orchestra though they would also have to have a decent score to work with.

 
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