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Hi All,
In tribute to James Horner, On the Score re-presents one of our most popular and requested podcasts as the composer waxes unabashedly on the scoring process at the time of All the King's Men.
http://www.filmmusicmag.com/?p=14799
This special show will be up until Monday the 29th as Filmmusicmag.com remembers the words and music of this remarkable artist. Thanks as always for listening
Daniel Schweiger
Host, "on the Score"
Filmmusicmag.com
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Maybe throw in the word "Archived" in there somewhere. Thanks for re-posting this, it was in high demand back then.
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Maybe throw in the word "Archived" in there somewhere. Thanks for re-posting this, it was in high demand back then.
Noted and done. I got a few requests after Horner's passing, and wanted to put it back up there. Best
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Posted: |
Jun 25, 2015 - 5:57 PM
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By: |
McD
(Member)
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Wow, what an interview! I guess he had a few things he needed to get off his chest.
Having seen The New World, and wondered how it ever got greenlit, and thought The Thin Red Line was probably the worst edited film in Hollywood history, I can agree with every word re: the over-rated Tel Mallick.
But I'm still bewildered by the Troy / Yared comments, especially as I think Yared never got over being replaced. Perhaps Horner's judgement was impaired by i) the perceived slight from Wolfgang Petersen in not offering him the gig first (with a bigger budget and profile, the film was a huge trade upwards for WP from his previous Horner film, and he 'upgraded' to Yared, seemingly to Horner's annoyance who thought Yared didn't have his experience), ii) Horner's possible lack of exposure to much of Yared's more epic / action work (although I think this is utterly irrelevant), iii) Horner's acceptance of those test cards claiming the score was terrible. The public's opinion isn't worthless, but I'd have hoped an artist of Horner's talent would have been happy to see beyond them.
Horner claims the test cards against Yared were unanimous, and given what happened next, that seems accurate. Listening between the lines, Petersen didn't ever want to replace Yared but was forced, and Horner got the gig for no other reason than he could do a score in 9 days (as opposed to, say, his previous relationship with Petersen or his talent). Hence Petersen could have been both very thankful and not in need of him ever again.
Yared's (unfinished) score is a tad old fashioned. As is probably the majority of the best and most popular scoring of the last 40 years. And personally, every charge Horner lays against it would apply with bells on to the score he'd earlier given Petersen, A Perfect Storm. Not to mention most of Williams' post Schindler work, especially with Spielberg. If he thought that of Yared's Troy, god only knows what he would have thought of Saving Private Ryan, or War Horse.
Having said all that, was Horner right to be pissed? Yes. He had 9 days to match what someone just as gifted as he was had worked on for a whole year. He didn't stand a chance. And he couldn't have known Yared wasn't locked down and could just chuck out his unfinished but 'vastly superior'* score online for all to hear as Horner's completed work was going to press. Yared was said to have broken protocol by leaking his score - in a move against the filmmakers, but which could only make Horner look bad too - and Horner appears to have used this interview to return the favour. *Per Filmtracks's review, the first I found, who consider the score to have traded down significantly from nothing less than a five star classic.
Anyway, enough of the Malick and Yared references... the biggest surprise is him saying 'being English...' in reference to a detachment from American culture. I thought he was an American with an oddly English accent. But he considered himself English! Not mentioned anywhere in the coverage over here. They missed a trick there.
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Given that the interview features major bashing of The New World (a film I adore) and Gabriel Yared's Troy score, I'll elect to put off hearing the interview for now. At the moment, I'm staying focused on my positive feelings for Mr. Horner (of which there are many).
As far as Yared's score for Troy being "old-fashioned", I hardly think it's any more so than, say, Shore's "Lord of the Rings". I shudder to think what may have happened if there had been test screenings done for the Rings films.
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Given that the interview features major bashing of The New World (a film I adore) and Gabriel Yared's Troy score, I'll elect to put off hearing the interview for now. At the moment, I'm staying focused on my positive feelings for Mr. Horner (of which there are many).
As far as Yared's score for Troy being "old-fashioned", I hardly think it's any more so than, say, Shore's "Lord of the Rings". I shudder to think what may have happened if there had been test screenings done for the Rings films.
Yeah, I'm happy this interview is available again, but if you want to remember him in the best light, I wouldn't listen to it right now. I won't speak ill of the recently departed, but I had a hard time seeing Horner the same way after hearing this interview.
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Posted: |
Jun 26, 2015 - 2:47 AM
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By: |
McD
(Member)
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As far as Yared's score for Troy being "old-fashioned", I hardly think it's any more so than, say, Shore's "Lord of the Rings". I shudder to think what may have happened if there had been test screenings done for the Rings films.
Ultimately, although I agree about the type of score, Shore's would have floated on by as the film was good. Yared had no such luck. And I can only imagine Spielberg films either aren't tested or are opinion-proof, otherwise the test cards may have blamed at least half a dozen post '93 Spielbergs as being ruined by the composer. When in fact, they were (IMHO) just awful, awful films that Williams scored like they were still in Spielberg's heyday. [I know that might not be the opinion of everyone, so I won't derail this Horner thread by mentioning it again here]
Although his comments about the Yared score - which sound like they are probably the most negative words one composer has ever said about a contemporary's work - are so off the mark it isn't even funny, I think what he really wanted to say was this: 'Yared doesn't know the art of scoring terrible cinema, I do'. But Horner's interview persona is of someone who only does good projects he believes in, so that wasn't much of an option.
Listen, the comments don't sound great, but as I said above, Yared broke ranks first in rather spectacular, completely unheard of fashion, so we can assume that lead to the decision on Horner's part to bite back. And come on, we'd all love it if every composer gave an interview like this at least once. If you're going to hold off on a listen, at least download it now before it disappears again.
In the meantime, Horner's sweet side is there in all the other interviews. He has such a lovely face and soft voice. He really doesn't look or sound remotely like the kind of guy who would go to battle with James Cameron for a living. Had I been able to ask him anything, it would have been 'Was it harder to take shit from producers and directors - your bosses - after the success of Titanic, when you all knew that you had enough in the bank to buy and sell them now?'
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Daniel, this version runs 69 minutes while the version from 2006 ran 131 minutes. What are the differences? Only cut-out music due to rights problems?
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Daniel, this version runs 69 minutes while the version from 2006 ran 131 minutes. What are the differences? Only cut-out music due to rights problems?
Correct.
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Thanks! 
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Posted: |
Jun 26, 2015 - 3:50 PM
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By: |
McD
(Member)
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I also think he missed the point about Yared, Bach and The English Patient. Yared was asked to reflect Bach in his score as a reference to the story, and merely had the theme (and, I think, another cue) played vaguely in the style of Bach's Goldberg Variations. You don't have to have any special knowledge to spot it as Horner suggests (let me be Exhibit A) and... you're also supposed to! The score does, however, lean heavily on the John Barry sound, as many pointed out at the time. For all of 13 seconds, albeit a musically very memorable 13 seconds.
Yared was the only composer who I'd have put infront of Horner at the time of Troy as Petersen appears to have done. I never understood why Yared wasn't more revered even on this message board back then, as, as far as I was concerned, at the turn of the century he was knocking them out of the park at a frightening rate that made him as clear #1 as John Williams had been 20 years earlier.
But Troy appears to have finished him off. If his next score and last masterpiece, L'Avion, had been written earlier (and I've convinced myself over the last decade it probably was), then Yared went from pretty much 20 five star classic scores out of his last 25, to never composing another classic score again. And he started co-composing a lot of stuff. I still buy his new work movie unseen, but I'm finally starting to realise that the Yared of 1986 - 2005 probably isn't coming back.
Horner had calmed down a bit on Malick at least by the time of the 2015 Bafta interview (see the interview thread for the link). Although many board members may find his comment in that recent interview about Goldsmith not reaching the heights of Williams to be such outrageous blasphemy it could put all this in the shade.
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