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 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 10:53 AM   
 By:   Jim Cleveland   (Member)

What was the last film to use matte paintings? Are they even still used?

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 11:14 AM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

As a physical painting, hmm probably been a while, they are all digital matte objects now.
I am taking a guess here, the last significant use was perhaps the fantastic visions in Dick Tracy 1990, some really amazing cityscape paintings by Harrison Ellenshaw

 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 11:19 AM   
 By:   Solium   (Member)

What was the last film to use matte paintings? Are they even still used?

I assume you mean paintings on glass, and composited onto film? Technically they still use matte paintings. It just they are either 3D renders or photographic compositions.

Going as far back as Return of the Jedi used digital matte paintings. Made with a 3D render and Photoshop.

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 11:28 AM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

What was the last film to use matte paintings? Are they even still used?

I assume you mean paintings on glass, and composited onto film? Technically they still use matte paintings. It just they are either 3D renders or photographic compositions.

Going as far back as Return of the Jedi used digital matte paintings. Made with a 3D render and Photoshop.


But what about hand painted, non software rendered?
I think that stopped a long while back right? Ellenshaw and Yuricich era.

 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 12:30 PM   
 By:   Metryq   (Member)

As others above have noted, "scene extension" has gone digital. There are paint programs that emulate the feel of traditional media. The difference is that the "paintings" may take the form of "camera projection" (a 3D technique with limited parallax), or elements that are 3D, even though the full scene may not exist in 3D.

If you're feeling nostalgic, don't be. One doesn't have to use high-tech or digital tools just because they exist. Many James Cameron films used rear projection and other traditional techniques, even when newer techniques were available. In my opinion, he (and his VFX artists) pulled it off well. I'm not sure how many traditionalists are still around. Cinefex is a great magazine, but it got boring after everything seemed to be going digital. So I haven't kept up. (Cinefex itself has gone digital, if you're amenable to ebooks.)

There is nothing wrong with using traditional paints on glass, or some other medium. But the advantage of digital is control—the same as with bluescreening, or any other compositing. Color balance, black levels, generation loss, "jigsawing" and countless other artifacts go away with digital tools. If there is a compelling reason (economic, aesthetic, or otherwise), a filmmaker might choose some older technique.

The Digital Artists Master Class books show that stunning art is still the goal:
http://www.amazon.com/dartiste-Matte-Painting-Digital-Artists/dp/1921002166/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 12:35 PM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

I have mentioned it before but I try whenever I can to bring attention to the site this guy maintains on the traditional matte artists.

It is a fantastic site.

http://nzpetesmatteshot.blogspot.com/2010/10/matts-mattes-photo-tribute-to-career-of.html

 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 12:37 PM   
 By:   Solium   (Member)

Likewise many storyboard artists draw digitally with a pen and tablet. Being software based some of these programs even offer animatics, which wasn't originally a storyboards artists responsibility.
But the tools exist and they must stay current with technology or find themselves out of work.

 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 12:42 PM   
 By:   Solium   (Member)

I have mentioned it before but I try whenever I can to bring attention to the site this guy maintains on the traditional matte artists.

It is a fantastic site.

http://nzpetesmatteshot.blogspot.com/2010/10/matts-mattes-photo-tribute-to-career-of.html


Cool webpage, thxs! You know, I thought some of those matte paintings were miniatures. eek

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 12:47 PM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

I have mentioned it before but I try whenever I can to bring attention to the site this guy maintains on the traditional matte artists.

It is a fantastic site.

http://nzpetesmatteshot.blogspot.com/2010/10/matts-mattes-photo-tribute-to-career-of.html


Cool webpage, thxs! You know, I thought some of those matte paintings were miniatures. eek


You are welcome.Yeah, those paintings are amazingly good.
Those are all brilliant artists, the Rembrandt's etc of our time.

use this link, that other one pointed to an old bookmark.
This is the most recent

http://nzpetesmatteshot.blogspot.com/

 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 1:22 PM   
 By:   Col. Flagg   (Member)

Going as far back as Return of the Jedi used digital matte paintings. Made with a 3D render and Photoshop.

Please cite the shots you're referring to.

 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 1:46 PM   
 By:   Solium   (Member)

Going as far back as Return of the Jedi used digital matte paintings. Made with a 3D render and Photoshop.

Please cite the shots you're referring to.


One I recall was inside the Death Star 2 hanger bay where the Imperial Shuttle landed. It was a reverse shot from back of hanger bay looking out. On the back wall Tie Fighter's hung on racks. I distinctly remember the artist saying he made the star field in Photoshop. I believe it's in one of my digital art magazines. I may be able to scan the page.

 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 1:46 PM   
 By:   'Lenny Bruce' Marshall   (Member)

INTERSTELLAR used a form of traditional backgrounds and in-camera.

For the wormhole sequence they used actual projections onto a wall whilst filming!
So, the shots from inside the spaceship, thru the portals, were live vfx
brm

 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 1:47 PM   
 By:   'Lenny Bruce' Marshall   (Member)

Going as far back as Return of the Jedi used digital matte paintings. Made with a 3D render and Photoshop.

Please cite the shots you're referring to.


One I recall was inside the Death Star 2 hanger bay where the Imperial Shuttle landed. It was a reverse shot from back of hanger bay looking out. On the back wall Tie Fighter's hung on racks. I distinctly remember the artist saying he made the star field in Photoshop. I believe it's in one of my digital art magazines. I may be able to scan the page.


No way you could do that circa 1983
although...
what year was TRON made?
brm

 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 1:53 PM   
 By:   Solium   (Member)

Going as far back as Return of the Jedi used digital matte paintings. Made with a 3D render and Photoshop.

Please cite the shots you're referring to.


One I recall was inside the Death Star 2 hanger bay where the Imperial Shuttle landed. It was a reverse shot from back of hanger bay looking out. On the back wall Tie Fighter's hung on racks. I distinctly remember the artist saying he made the star field in Photoshop. I believe it's in one of my digital art magazines. I may be able to scan the page.


No way you could do that circa 1983
although...
what year was TRON made?
brm



Tron was 1982 and you have to remember Photoshop was created by ILM. That and other software was developed and used internally long before it was available for retail purposes.

 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 1:55 PM   
 By:   'Lenny Bruce' Marshall   (Member)

Going as far back as Return of the Jedi used digital matte paintings. Made with a 3D render and Photoshop.

Please cite the shots you're referring to.


One I recall was inside the Death Star 2 hanger bay where the Imperial Shuttle landed. It was a reverse shot from back of hanger bay looking out. On the back wall Tie Fighter's hung on racks. I distinctly remember the artist saying he made the star field in Photoshop. I believe it's in one of my digital art magazines. I may be able to scan the page.


No way you could do that circa 1983
although...
what year was TRON made?
brm



Tron was 1982 and you have to remember Photoshop was created by ILM. That and other software was developed and used internally long before it was available for retail purposes.


Fascinating!!!!

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 1:57 PM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

Just a credit where it is due thing here;

Photoshop was sold to Adobe by brothers Thomas and John Knoll.
They created it.

Both brothers have worked for ILM, but they authored the software independent of ILM.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adobe_Photoshop#Early_history

 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 2:02 PM   
 By:   Solium   (Member)

Just a credit where it is due thing here;

Photoshop was sold to Adobe by brothers Thomas and John Knoll.
They created it.

Both brothers have worked for ILM, but they authored the software independent of ILM.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adobe_Photoshop#Early_history


I stand corrected, I thought it was software developed while working for ILM.

@ Mr. Marshall - Remember the Genesis Demo reel in Wrath of Khan was fully digital animation. Probably done in 1981.

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 2:11 PM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

Just a credit where it is due thing here;

Photoshop was sold to Adobe by brothers Thomas and John Knoll.
They created it.

Both brothers have worked for ILM, but they authored the software independent of ILM.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adobe_Photoshop#Early_history


I stand corrected, I thought it was software developed while working for ILM.

@ Mr. Marshall - Remember the Genesis Demo reel in Wrath of Khan was fully digital animation. Probably done in 1981.


No worries Solium.
The Knoll brothers are terrifically talented guys, they have contributed a lot.

Yes, the Genesis footage was some of the earliest of that kind, a few years later Young Sherlock Holmes pushed the whole thing up a notch with a moving digital animation stained glass knight character - which remains pretty terrific.


 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 2:21 PM   
 By:   Metryq   (Member)

From INDUSTRIAL LIGHT AND MAGIC: INTO THE DIGITAL REALM

Photoshop has helped ILM's CG department function with more freedom in the digital realm. Since its first motion picture use in 1989's THE ABYSS...

THE ART OF THE RETURN OF THE JEDI shows two landing bay paintings, each with a painting credit and a photo credit. (Why would a digital render have a photo credit?) Also, both images are wide enough to show the frame of the glass with scratch spots where the artist tested his mixed colors. Ergo, those landing bay shots in JEDI are olde fashioned matte paintings on glass.

EDIT: The book shows more than two landing bay paintings, including the Rebel hangar. But the two at the beginning of the book are from the opening scene aboard the unfinished, new Deathstar.

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 21, 2016 - 2:30 PM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

Oh yes, ILM certainly used Photoshop, but ILM never owned it, the Knoll brothers did.

 
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