I don't see how an overwhelming list is helpful? Your point Mr Cobweb?
Well, I'm Cobweb in MainTitles - but I'm Prodromides in Talk Classical.
I posted my list from Talk Classical over here because I think Tall Guy never saw it before (I don't think he has ever been a member of Talk Classical).
This doesn't mean Tall Guy needs to listen to 100 composers. Earlier within this thread I mention that Merikanto is my 4th favorite whilst Koechlin is my No.1, so I simply wish to display that I have actually ranked the composers whose music I like. My ranking took me 2 months or so to finalize so I put a lot of thought into it. [plus I also like to needle Tall Guy about his obsession for Shostakovich; here's my Top 100 and Russians are barely on my list let alone DS.]
I truly think that these 5 composers as cited as the 'best' from the 20th century (Stravinsky, Shostakovich, Schoenberg, Britten & Bartok) because most listeners haven't explored the variety out there by so-called 'obscure' composers whose discographies and concert performances are slim.
Once one gets into Roberto Gerhard, Dutilleux, Ohana, etc., the tonal & neo-classical music from the '20s through the '40s no longer satisfies ...
Once one gets into Roberto Gerhard, Dutilleux, Ohana, etc., the tonal & neo-classical music from the '20s through the '40s no longer satisfies ...
That's kind of like saying once one gets into Hans Zimmer, Powell, Jackman, etc., Henri Mancini* no longer satisfies. May be true for some, but it ain't true for others. Me for instance.
I've listened to probably thousands of hours of music from the likes of Messiaen, Gerhard, Dutilleux, Leifs, Tveitt, Jolivet, Petrassi, Kupferman, Dallapiccola, Varese, Holmboe, Searle, Berio, Lutyens, etc., etc. In fact, I know for sure I have listened to 76 of the composers you list (I just counted), and I'm familiar with all but about 12. (And where the hell is Boulez? Charles Wuorinen, Salonen, Ruders? Jeez, what a piker!)
And yet I continue to get enormous pleasure from most of the "top 5" you mention - and Stravinsky and Bartok remain my favorite Classical** composers from the 20th century. (Well, along with Frank Martin, noted above.)
So let's not mistake one explorer's preferences for some kind of inevitable pilgrim's progress.
*Yes, I spelled Henri with an "i" - an homage to Start the Revolution Without Me.
**Yes, let's just call it "Classical" for all periods of concert/serious music composed primarily using the instruments of the Western tradition, along with the human voice. It's good enough a format description for Classical radio, so it's good enough for me.
I adore the music of Harry Partch – iconoclastic American composer and artisan. I discovered his music in high school (two lp releases on Columbia records) and fell in love with his unique approach. Thankfully, there have been more releases of his music over the years. Some of it is still hard to find, though. He is utterly unique – no one sounds remotely like him because he built all of his own musical instruments modeled on nothing but his imagination. The instruments alone are works of art.
Olivier Messiaen’s music moves me in ways that I can’t really explain. I am not a religious person, yet his work takes me to places that are truly inspiring – similar to the effect that Bruckner has on me.
I love the music of Robert Ashley. Especially his opera, “Perfect Lives”, which straddles many genres. Not sure if I could convince anyone else of his worth, though.
Maurice Duruflé’s “Requiem” is one of my touchstone pieces of music – ineffably gorgeous and moving.
I can get lost for hours listening to La Monte Young’s “The Well-Tuned Piano” – but I confess to not investigating his other works. When I’m in the right mood for this piece, it just draws me in – like a cold fire, if that makes sense.
I am a huge fan of romantic piano concertos – so this is more of a vote for a genre rather than a composer. The Hyperion label has released about 50 volumes of these concertos by various composers -- some well known and many obscure. If you adore full blooded music, played with panache and accompanied by gorgeous sonics, this series is amazing and enrapturing.
That's kind of like saying once one gets into Hans Zimmer, Powell, Jackman, etc., Henri Mancini* no longer satisfies.
My perspective is quite different.
Zimmer, Powell, etc do not write spectral or serial music. I'm not saying that which is more recent is better than "old" music. However, with me, serial or spectral music is much more satisfying than Romantic or neo-classical idioms.
Zimmer is no Gerhard, but to me Gerhard is better than pre-WW I compositions. [The period of Stravinsky which I like most contains his late/serial works, by the way]
Zimmer, Powell, etc do not write spectral or serial music.
Maybe not serial music in the strictest sense of the word, but Zimmes does dabble in minimalism and texture-based composition now and then (THIN RED LINE is perhaps one of the greatest examples, as is INTERSTELLAR). And also wild dissonance (THE RING).
Wow, Zimmer doesn't write serial music? What a shocker, Z. How could I have missed that?
You are going a bit overboard in missing (or just ignoring) my point. Which was not about recency, but difference within a spectrum. I used an example that people would recognize who do not necessarily know all these composers we're flinging about like so many monkey.
My main point is that it is indeed possible (I would say desirable, but happy to have differences of opinion) to love both. That one need not take away from another.
Wow, Zimmer doesn't write serial music? What a shocker, Z. How could I have missed that?
You are going a bit overboard in missing (or just ignoring) my point. Which was not about recency, but difference within a spectrum. I used an example that people would recognize who do not necessarily know all these composers we're flinging about like so many monkey.
My main point is that it is indeed possible (I would say desirable, but happy to have differences of opinion) to love both. That one need not take away from another.
Sure, it's possible to 'love all'. I think most people who appreciate dodecaphony also continue to like tonal compositions. But I also rather think the situation is not a 2-way street. Many folks who love Romantic-era music continue to profess having difficulty with concert music created over the past 100 years. These persons have not 'graduated' (so-to-speak) onto the more advanced abstract music. (They may go to their graves never coming to terms with such dissonances)
I don't think it's a vertical hierarchy. It's more horizontal -- you can like dodecaphony AND romantic music on the same level. It's just that different cognitive mechanisms are at play for each. Also, one can like certain TYPES of dodecaphony and romantic music, but not necessarily all. For example, I adore Goldenthal's excursions into various forms of dissonance, but hate Morricone's version of same. I am utterly fascinated by much of Stockhausen, but never got Leonard Rosenman. Etc. It's a wide field.
I posted my list from Talk Classical over here because I think Tall Guy never saw it before (I don't think he has ever been a member of Talk Classical).
I haven't seen it before, and I'm not a member of Talk Classical. I only have time for one sandpit at a time - but I believe I've read it from time to time when referenced here. As with any message board, a fair amount of it is more like Talk Bollocks.
This doesn't mean Tall Guy needs to listen to 100 composers.
Very considerate of you! I am familiar with several of the composers on your list, and the premise of my original post was to mention ONE composer rather than 100. But I'm more flexible in the rules than my Oslovian mate, so no sweat.
Earlier within this thread I mention that Merikanto is my 4th favorite whilst Koechlin is my No.1
You'll be pleased to know that because of this, I've checked out this Koechlin of whom you speak. I was very impressed, although it remains to be seen if I'll continue to pursue appropriate youtube videos.
[plus I also like to needle Tall Guy about his obsession for Shostakovich; here's my Top 100 and Russians are barely on my list let alone DS.]
Absolutely: insufficient Russians, and too many Goldsmith. But it's your list, not mine. Do I come across as "obsessed" with Shostakovich? Maybe I do. I have a library of maybe 15-20 books either entirely or primarily about DDS and the more I read about him the more convinced I am that if I had to choose ONE famous person whose experiences tell the story of the 20th century, 'twould be him. I can't say that I've ever felt "needled" by you, but I might just be lying to diminish your efforts (clue: I'm not.) We'd probably get on very well in real life. That or kill each other.
I truly think that these 5 composers as cited as the 'best' from the 20th century (Stravinsky, Shostakovich, Schoenberg, Britten & Bartok) because most listeners haven't explored the variety out there by so-called 'obscure' composers whose discographies and concert performances are slim.
I kind of agree with that, but I also don't, because IN GENERAL things find an appropriate level over time. Clearly in music as well as in art, people who aren't appreciated in their lifetime can take on much greater significance after death. But if people have to make an effort to persevere with music that doesn't immediately appeal, the vast majority won't bother. In art, you can glance at a picture or a sculpture or an installation and make a snap judgment - music isn't like that. And plenty of people prefer the immediately accessible.
Right now, a list of my favourite composers would include Mieczyslaw Weinberg. I'm pretty set in my ways, but can still be enthused by new discoveries. Weinberg has scaled the ramparts of my inertia and for me is entirely a 2016 phenomenon. The amazing access that youtube provides has assisted in this, but I've bought every discrete Weinberg CD I've found in shops, and have pointed Mrs TG towards the set of string quartets by way of my Christmas gift. I was similarly interested in Boris Tishchenko, sparked off by HIS relationship to DDS, but never to this extent.
Once one gets into Roberto Gerhard, Dutilleux, Ohana, etc., the tonal & neo-classical music from the '20s through the '40s no longer satisfies ...
No doubt true for some. I suspect I'm largely rooted more in the tonal, with a mild and passing interest in the more abstract. The heart wants what the heart wants.
I would like to nominate Alexander Glazunov (1865–1936). He was an extremely influential composer and teacher in Russia. His pupils included Rachmaninov, Shostakovich, Prokofiev and even Tiomkin. Had he been born a little later he could no doubt have been a great film score composer. Like his teacher Rimsky-Korsakov, Glazunov was also a master orchestrator.
A good sampling of his works are the Violin Concerto, Piano Concerto No. 1, Symphony No. 5, tone poem Stenka Razin and his ballets (especially The Seasons and Raymonda).
Here's the Violin Concerto performed by Itzhak Perlman. A true masterpiece.
Glazunov is fairly well known. I like a lot of his stuff, and his orchestrational skills are well-documented, but I think he's fairly 'lightweight' in the scheme of things, especially among the Russians. Like a "Pops" composer long before that term was used.
True, but it's not that I don't like him. I do. I just don't find him as "deep" as other composers. But sometimes, you just want "evergreen"-type stuff, and on that he delivers.
