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Expanding on Morricone's reply, I think the tapes for Oliver are lost as the TT blu-ray had a music-and-effects track rather than a regular isolated track for the score.
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Posted: |
Apr 11, 2017 - 2:01 PM
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By: |
manderley
(Member)
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Years ago, and by that I mean, literally, 5 or 6 decades ago, Johnny Green used to turn up on the occasional radio talk show around the LA area. It was, I think, after he'd left MGM and RAINTREE COUNTY and was now working independently on the big roadshow pictures he was then associated with, like PEPE (!!!), WEST SIDE STORY, and OLIVER.
He would occasionally make reference to the sound studio in his home where he did projects related to his work and apparently had top-flight equipment in the mag tape environment.
I wonder if Green's music library and archives might have ended up somewhere that they might be accessed, and if any of the missing elements might be found there, even if of 2nd generation tapes.....
Secondly---and this is weird---I once read some comments by Green about the OLIVER music masters. This was so many years ago I can't remember the circumstances of his comments, but it appeared that someone was working with him to put together a re-master of the OLIVER soundtrack.
They looked and looked and finally found an original (I believe) 35mm fullcoat mag film element. I don't know if this was original to the film, or a submaster made for the original album, but Green commented, in a shocked tone, that the mag film, which would normally have 3 or 4 running tracks/channels (for stereo) had been "edited" by physically punching out holes (with an office paper punch???) and/or slicing out thin strips (with a matte knife???) within the magnetic-coated film stock where no audio information was intended to be picked up by the sound heads for a transfer!!!
In those days I was familiar with working with mag film, and Green certainly was too, and I've never heard of such a thing. Green said that looking at some sections of the mag master was a little like looking at a computer-punched paper tape or punched-card made by key-punch operators. This process, Green indicated, was not everywhere in the tape length, but only in sections (and selected sound channels on the tape) where changes were made. So it wasn't everywhere, but in those sections where it was, it looked a little like a collander or sieve!!
I guess I've remembered this over the years because it seemed so out in left field as to the extreme way you might solve a mag editing and re-mixing issue---and it stuck with me.
But I suppose if you had to make changes or edits, and you didn't want to go through a full mag re-mix, this might have been an idea based on then-viable computer technology to fix the problem cheaply and fast. But can you imagine how a master, which shrinks and stretches over time, and really needs to stay intact to be salvageable decades later, would have survived this?
If Green was describing this accurately, I'd say that the chances for an OLIVER cd re-boot are slim to nil.
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Posted: |
Apr 11, 2017 - 2:41 PM
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By: |
Grecchus
(Member)
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But I suppose if you had to make changes or edits, and you didn't want to go through a full mag re-mix, this might have been an idea based on then-viable computer technology to fix the problem cheaply and fast. But can you imagine how a master, which shrinks and stretches over time, and really needs to stay intact to be salvageable decades later, would have survived this?
That must be the then new DigiLog format that didn't quite catch on?
Those stupid, stupid, stupid b.......s!
Edit: It was probably underscore they were taking out in their origami strip/excise edits. A true paradox. To retain as much structural integrity as possible, the mag tape, if found, would require an expensive buttressing method to ensure it could be read without shearing it unevenly or over-stressing the weakened sections. If you are prepared to do that to the tape in the first place, then the intention was probably to trash it anyway post post-production. The mind boggles!
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