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Posted: |
May 19, 2018 - 5:40 AM
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By: |
Graham Watt
(Member)
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Hi, I noticed that in the previous threads (one the initial announcement, and another the "Now Shipping" thread), there seemed to be a real lack of comments and observations about the music itself. So I'm starting this thread. What d'ya all think of it? How would you compare it to Volume 1? Good, bad or neutral I'm sure James Fitz can take it, and would be interested to know your thoughts, as I am. I'm on about my sixth listen. I've done it through good quality headphones with the volume cranked up, I've listened to it on the music centre whilst pacing around with a furrowed brow, I've air-conducted to it, I've listened to it in its entirety without a pause, I've done it in chunks... This is undoubtedly a quality release, excellently performed and recorded. But I'm having the same problem with it as I have (had) with Volume 1. It's not drawing me in, and I don't know why. I love early Goldsmith, I love the Boris Karloff TV show, I love "unconventional" music... I'm immediately engrossed by unusual musical approaches, the economy of means forcing the composer to use his skill and imagination to come up with something unique. In broader terms, "difficult" music attracts me when it's interesting. I'm often held spellbound by all that kind of stuff. But on my sixth listen THRILLER 2 is still holding me at arms length. I'm not noticing a musical tension there which would keep my interest. I keep drifting off and thinking about other things when it's playing. There ARE quite a lot of low-key Hermannesque passages with just a bed of low strings under some discreetly-played rising or falling figures, but there's enough really great material which SHOULD capture my attention more and doesn't, or hasn't done so far. And then I look at the contents and wonder why. "God Grante That She Lye Stille" has lovely bits in it but keeps drifting away from me. "The Bride Who Died Twice" is a real early showcase for Goldsmith's later big-screen westerns. "Late Date" is the one which I feel works the best - all that unusual percussion (egg-shakers, yeah!) and prepared piano create a very on-edge listen. "The Weird Tailor" has lovely passages and one long "nothing happening" stretch. I love the tolling bell at the climax, but I'm only affected by it because I remember the creepy-as-hell ending to the episode it accompanied. "Masquerade" is whimsical and spirited, but seems to go on for far longer than its 12 minute suite. It's also largely just a light-hearted reworking of "Well of Doom", which appeared on Volume 1. I'm surprised that wasn't mentioned in the liner notes, but they're surprisingly scant in the sense that, although I'm in awe of John Burlingame's dedication and knowledge, when speaking about the presentation of each score, he only has room for, "The suite includes..." followed by a list of cues and info in brackets about what's happening on-screen - "Spoil Sport!" (they reluctantly follow the old man into the master bedroom), "Honeymooners" (a brief respite from the strange goings-on as the two try to sleep), "The Cellar" (Charlie searches for the old woman)..." Hmmmmm. Anyway, moving on, "Terror in Teakwood" is quite brief, with some amazingly chilling effects near the end, but at the moment I can't for the life of me think what went before. The CD ends with the beautiful, and beautifully performed "Nocturne for Violin and Piano" (not by Goldsmith) which has woken me up from my slumber twice. Quickly looking at what I've just written, it comes across as terribly negative. But there is hope. I listened to "God Grante That She Lye Stille" for the seventh time this morning, loud through the headphones, and paid attention to all the detail. It was terrific. But I knew that if I'd gone onto the next suite, my mind would have started to wander. Maybe I just ought to do this in stages. I know I'm repeating myself but it's really odd. I finally "got" the first suite this morning, but I've never had to work so hard at "getting" good music in my life. Really interested in hearing your own observations.
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Posted: |
May 19, 2018 - 11:53 AM
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By: |
SchiffyM
(Member)
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Look, either it grabs you or it doesn't. It grabs me. These small ensembles and inventive orchestrations speak to me. I love that you can hear each instrument. It feels intimate, but no less grand for it. A few weeks ago, people on this board were yearning for a definitive "Supergirl" release, so I listened to that score, for the first time in maybe five or six years. To be candid, I hated it. It felt like four kitchen sinks thrown at me at once – screaming orchestra, swirling effects, whooshing synths, unconvincing fanfares (all performed very sloppily, too!). There's a moderately appealing theme buried under all that, but I couldn't wait for the album to be over. "Thriller" is, to me, the perfect antidote – music confident enough in its power to persuade that it never needs to raise its voice. But to each his own. I'm just incredibly grateful that this music is out there. I love it.
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Graham, i give you credit for buying v.two since you were lukewarm about v.one! Sorry this one didn't 'thrill' you either. I liked the first and look forward to getting this one soon. Brm
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Posted: |
May 20, 2018 - 4:28 AM
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By: |
Graham Watt
(Member)
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Thanks for the replies so far. It's all interesting, and I don't think that anyone would mistake lukewarm responses for ingratitude - not that anyone has, yet. You know Schiffy, your comments are particularly interesting because I have often used very similar vocabulary when talking about Goldsmith's early TV work, in fact I touched on it in my third paragraph (the economy of means forcing the composer to rely on his real talent and imagination to come up with ways of making effective music). And the way you express your aversion to SUPERGIRL could have been written by me! Anyway, since posting that initial rabbit yesterday I've had THRILLER 2 on rotation non-stop and now have every note ingrained into my noggin. The familiarity helps, and I ended up agreeing that it's really pretty excellent. As I (think I) said about Vol. 1, it's a slow-burner which doesn't put all its cards on the table at once. Maybe that was a way of expressing mild disappointment. So yes, I really like THRILLER 2 (and 1) now. But to be honest, I don't think it'll ever truly "thrill" me, and I say that because just after playing THRILLER 2 this morning (that was the eleventh spin) and thinking, "Yeah, it's good after all", I put on Intrada's BROTHERHOOD OF THE BELL/ A STEP OUT OF LINE again, and was once more absolutely AMAZED at how utterly brilliant that CD is. Of course, it would be silly to expect a THRILLER score to sound like the two on the aforementioned Intrada disc , but it does kind of highlight the way I wanted to react to hearing the Tadlows and didn't. I'm enjoying this discussion and reading your comments. I hope more people contribute. So far it's been healthy and enlightening.
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Posted: |
May 20, 2018 - 10:41 AM
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By: |
Hurdy Gurdy
(Member)
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I don't have vol 2 yet, so canna comment on it at the moment. But I can see where Graham is coming from, from listening to vol 1. I love hearing the little motifs and phrases that you spot, that went on to become List of Adrian Messenger and Coma etc. I don't LOVE the music as such, or in the same way as other film scores by him. It doesn't resonate with me like, say, the End Titles from The Swarm or Logan's Run or things like Lonely Are The Brave or Flim Flam Man. But hearing the thought and musical design that's going on under quite limited resources is phenomenal. It's like reading an early, never published Stephen King novel that's raw and lean and flawed, but containing those little things that went on to become the reason you love his stuff. To me, anyway. It's a fascinating insight into his emerging musical brain. It's more of a cerebral ride than an emotional one.
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God Grante That She Lye Stille and The Bride Who Died Twice grabbed me immediately. Both of those are a hugely enjoyable examples of his style at the time. The rest of the album was a little tougher going, especially Terror in Teakwood, but I can appreciate what Jerry was doing dramatically, and there some real stand-out moments. Overall, I like this even better than the first Thriller album and am of course super happy these rerecordings exist. More please. It's interesting Jens, that you single out the first two on the CD as grabbing you immediately, then mention that it gets increasingly tough going right up until the particularly tough "Terror in Teakwood" (I take it we're discounting the lovely final track, the special arrangement of Giovannini's "Nocturne" from that episode). I suspect there's a bit of "Thriller-fatigue" in your response. Your favourites happen to be the first two suites on the disc. The "toughest" for you is the last. The first score totals almost 16 minutes, the second just under 10, and the last just over 7 minutes. Maybe you were getting worn out for whatever reason. If that's the case, I can identify with it. I've said all this in previous posts, but in different words I feel that it's a CD which plays much better in shorter doses. I had seven minutes to spare before going to work yesterday, so I listened to "Terror in Teakwood" on its own, and it was spectacular. I'd never heard it that way before ( I'd previously only listened chronologically to the whole CD, with "Teakwood" at the end, just when I'd had more than enough). It's not that there isn't enough variety in the music to keep it taut and interesting throughout, but there is a kind of heavy Herrmannesque plod to some of it which can become wearisome (although Disc 1's "Well of Doom" might be the most indicative of that sound). So, it's worth spending time with each score as a separate entity. I'm really beginning to like them all now in different ways, although "Late Date" is still the one that works for me most. I don't have to put any effort into enjoying that one at all!
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Thriller 2 is just awesome. Hard to decide which one of the suites is the best on this set. Every one is unique - "God Grante That She Lye Stille" is very climiatic, "epic" in some way (those horns!). "The Bride Who Died Twice" have wonderful woodwinds writting, and brass theme is very militaristic and is nice counterpoint for light lovely flutes. And what a wonderful horn finale we hear at the end of suite. "Late Date" is very specific, suspense, music, again with great use of piano and flutes and it is really unique. "The Weird Tailor" is i think my own favourite suite from vol 2 - what an incredible, creepy atmosphere in this music! "Masquerade" is also very nice, with some kind of sound used years later in similar way by Danny Elfman. "Terror in Teakwood" is the one which I didnt like to much, by Giovannini theme is just beauty. Music is great in suite format, it flows very well and Leigh very good decide what a fragments use to present this music in the best possible way. Prague Orchestra plays beautifully led by Nic Raine, and gave us true "Goldsmith" sound, which is very specific and not easy to recreate. There is still 6 more episodes with Goldsmith music, so im hope that James and company decided to finishing this wonderfull "Thriller" series with one more album and we get final "Thriller 3" album.
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Does this volume not have an End Credits Suite, like the first volume, wherein all the major thematic material is recapped into lovely bite-sized chunks? I really liked that idea in volume one. It helped me separate the various themes and motifs from each episode.
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Does this volume not have an End Credits Suite, like the first volume, wherein all the major thematic material is recapped into lovely bite-sized chunks? I really liked that idea in volume one. It helped me separate the various themes and motifs from each episode. No, it doesn't Kev. The Tads at Tadlow realised too late that none of the scores featured a violin, so they concocted a new adaptation of the "faux-classical" piece (not by JG) so as to feature the lovely Lucie on violin! Buy it anyway, ya galoot.
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Oh, fear not Graham, it is a definite near future CD purrrr chase! I've recently received a box of CD's from Intrada AND some discs from BSX are coming soon, in addition to SOLO, which has been in constant play for nearly a week now. I'll save it for a rainy (= I've got no new CD'S to play) day.
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Graham, i give you credit for buying v.two since you were lukewarm about v.one! Sorry this one didn't 'thrill' you either. I liked the first and look forward to getting this one soon. Brm It has arrived! First suite is superb!
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Where the heck is Mr. Oddysey?
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Anyone catch the proto- SAND PEBBLES theme?
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I really like the prologue/suite format. I wish the other labels would adopt it when releasing tv scores. Makes more sense than cramming 35 minutes of short repetitive cues from a 60 minute program. Btw Wonderfully recorded and mixed. Sounds like they are playing.in my.living.room! Bruce
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