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 Posted:   May 6, 2007 - 2:37 AM   
 By:   JSWalsh   (Member)

I really enjoyed recent (re)viewings of these two films. There's something really entertaining about big Hollywood movies that attempt some philosophical depth, whether or not they succeed.

Any suggestions for a third film to fit into this little "Hollywood Philosophical Novel Adaptation" festival?

 
 Posted:   May 6, 2007 - 7:36 AM   
 By:   Ron Pulliam   (Member)

THE FOUNTAINHEAD!

Absolutely RIVETING!

 
 
 Posted:   May 6, 2007 - 8:06 AM   
 By:   JSWalsh   (Member)

THE FOUNTAINHEAD!

Absolutely RIVETING!


I really, really enjoyed that movie. I first saw it long ago in the middle of the night, and the dialog kinda threw me--at first I thought it was stagey, but then I realized it was MEANINGFUL.

Years passed, and I recently bought this and watched it with my very liberal girlfriend, and we both really enjoyed it.

If I could make any change in the movie, it would be the unintentionally hilarious moment when Patricia Neal thinks of the drill going into the rock...

But it really is a good movie.

 
 
 Posted:   May 6, 2007 - 3:58 PM   
 By:   John B. Archibald   (Member)

My favorite camp moment in THE FOUNTAINHEAD is when Neal, all decked out in high fashion, drops a statue, supposedly "priceless," out the window, and watches it shatter far below...

As for philosophical Hollywood, you might try another cinematic adaptation of Maugham, THE MOON AND SIXPENCE(1942), which introduced Herbert Marshall playing the Maugham surrogate, a performance he essentially repeated in RAZOR'S EDGE. (BTW: I'd love to see the original technicolor sequence at the end of MOON, but it's not included on the DVD release, sadly.)

 
 Posted:   May 6, 2007 - 4:55 PM   
 By:   Steve Johnson   (Member)

I think Steiner's score for THE FOUNTAINHEAD is one of his best. Of course, Patricia Neal fan that I am, I doubt she was ever much more alluring than here, as Ayn Rand's nueroutic heroine, Dominique Francon. I think the movie captures the spirit of the massive book as well as it could.

 
 
 Posted:   May 6, 2007 - 10:36 PM   
 By:   The_Mark_of_Score-O   (Member)

THE FOUNTAINHEAD!

Absolutely RIVETING!


Looks as though another architecture/engineering joke has gone over people's heads.

 
 
 Posted:   May 7, 2007 - 1:14 AM   
 By:   crazyunclerolo   (Member)

THE FOUNTAINHEAD!

Absolutely RIVETING!


Looks as though another architecture/engineering joke has gone over people's heads.


You're not kidding! That rivet almost took off my ear!

 
 
 Posted:   May 7, 2007 - 1:59 AM   
 By:   JSWalsh   (Member)



You're not kidding! That rivet almost took off my ear!


No, I got the joke--I just didn't see the point in posting nothing but "LOL" or something, and chose to continue with my thoughts about the movie. Sorry to deprive you all of another "LOL!" post.

 
 
 Posted:   May 7, 2007 - 3:47 AM   
 By:   crazyunclerolo   (Member)



No, I got the joke--I just didn't see the point in posting nothing but "LOL" or something, and chose to continue with my thoughts about the movie. Sorry to deprive you all of another "LOL!" post.


JS--You may have gotten Scratch's joke, but by responding directly to me you seem to have missed mine. It went over my head, which is why the rivet almost took my ear off! This is the second time you've reacted in a sarcastic, kneejerk fashion to some harmless comment I've made. What's that about?

 
 
 Posted:   May 7, 2007 - 3:59 AM   
 By:   JSWalsh   (Member)



JS--You may have gotten Scratch's joke, but by responding directly to me you seem to have missed mine. It went over my head, which is why the rivet almost took my ear off! This is the second time you've reacted in a sarcastic, kneejerk fashion to some harmless comment I've made. What's that about?


What's sarcastic about saying "I got the joke but didn't think it was worth posting 'LOL' to prove it"?

 
 
 Posted:   May 7, 2007 - 4:14 AM   
 By:   crazyunclerolo   (Member)



What's sarcastic about saying "I got the joke but didn't think it was worth posting 'LOL' to prove it"?


You're right. If that's all you'd written, it wouldn't seem sarcastic at all.

 
 
 Posted:   May 7, 2007 - 4:18 AM   
 By:   JSWalsh   (Member)

I'm sorry if you were offended. I don't see what the big deal is, I just don't think the world needs anymore useless "LOL!" posts or, frankly, anymore like this one. So, back to the subject.

 
 
 Posted:   May 7, 2007 - 4:19 AM   
 By:   JSWalsh   (Member)

Answering my own question to get back on track, the movie I recently enjoyed the most has to be A Man for All Seasons, and I just realized that this would fit nicely into this mini-marathon.

The Fountainhead has been called campy, but I think it's just overly earnest and dramatic. It is about ideas, and movies are perhaps not the best vehicle to discuss ideas. I love the look of the movie, though.

Wow, are there really so few "philosophical" Hollywood/mainstream flicks?

A recent philosophical indie movie, What the Bleep Do We Know? has got to be the worst movie I've watched all the way through in years.

 
 Posted:   May 7, 2007 - 5:38 PM   
 By:   Ron Pulliam   (Member)

I think it's "meant" to be philosophical -- it certainly has Tyrone Power trying to explain to his grandfather, to his best friend, to his mentor from Oxford and to virtually anyone else who will listen just what it is that makes him hate Normans so much and why he just HAD to seek something adventurous --- and I'm talking about the story "The Black Rose", recently issued in the Tyrone Power DVD box.

Frankly, I found little philosophical in it except for the idea that we each, in or own way, must find what we truly love...something worth dying for.

But Power was as perplexing as he was as Larry Darrell in "The Razor's Edge"...never able to verbalize exactly what he was seeking or what he ultimately found, but both films let us know he "found" it.

Still and all, "The Black Rose" is a richly produced film and has some sterling performances, not the least of which is Orson Welles as an Asian general.

 
 Posted:   May 7, 2007 - 5:42 PM   
 By:   Ron Pulliam   (Member)

Would anyone classify "The Manchurian Candidate" as a philosophical film?

I don't believe it was intended as such...it certainly shocked many people.

But we're more jaded now in our views of what our government (in the U.S.) is capable of doing, even if we disapprove. So...could this film be seen as a philosphical diatribe against political machinations to attain power regardless of cost -- personal, moral, etc.?

Could it be seen as having any philosphical value in terms of exposing the underbellies of ambitious parents?

 
 
 Posted:   May 7, 2007 - 6:47 PM   
 By:   John B. Archibald   (Member)


But Power was as perplexing as he was as Larry Darrell in "The Razor's Edge"...never able to verbalize exactly what he was seeking or what he ultimately found, but both films let us know he "found" it.




But that's the conundrum behind anything concerning spirituality. It's some kind of a never-ending search, more perceived in others than in oneself. The people who've "found it," as you say, are usually self-effacing enough not to admit it.

Audrey Hepburn talks about it in THE NUN'S STORY, when she says, "I thought I'd reach some kind of resting place...," and she is curtly informed by her Mother Superior: "There is no resting place."

Even Power says in RAZOR'S EDGE that he has had great moments of doubt about the path he has taken.

Let me direct you to T.S.Eliot's THE COCKTAIL PARTY, specifically a dialogue between the characters Celia Coplestone and Sir Henry Harcourt-Reilly. Celia says at one point:
"You see, I think I really had a vision of something
Though I don't know what it is. I don't want to forget it.
I want to live with it. I could do without everything,
Put up with anything, if I might cherish it.
In fact, I think it would really be dishonest
For me, now, to try to make a life with anybody!
I couldnt' give anyone the kind of love-
I wish I could - which belongs to that life."

I have a wonderful lp set of the original cast of this play, wherein Alec Guiness and Irene Worth do this scene. Wonderful.

It would appear, then, that this spiritual journey of which we speak is more something for the individual to fathom, than for anyone else to attempt to explain.

 
 
 Posted:   May 7, 2007 - 7:39 PM   
 By:   The_Mark_of_Score-O   (Member)

But Power was as perplexing as he was as Larry Darrell in "The Razor's Edge"...never able to verbalize exactly what he was seeking or what he ultimately found, but both films let us know he "found" it.

Being another young-man-journeys-to-the-mysterious-East-to-search-for-the-meaning-of-life tale, THE BLACK ROSE is THE RAZOR'S EDGE, for all intents and purposes, though by 1950 Power was getting pretty long in the tooth to play a member of any "lost" generation.

Still and all, "The Black Rose" is a richly produced film and has some sterling performances, not the least of which is Orson Welles as a Turkish general.

Welles's character, General Bayan, was not a Turk, but a Mongol, who led the armies of Kublai Khan in its conquest of China's Sung Dynasty in the late 13th century.

Beyond this, Jack Hawkins's performance as Tris is the real, and only, gem of what's an otherwise unsurprising and tedious film that, for the most part, is little more than a colorful travelogue, and whose leading lady, Cecile Aubrey, resembles a monkey.

 
 Posted:   May 7, 2007 - 8:04 PM   
 By:   Ron Pulliam   (Member)




But that's the conundrum behind anything concerning spirituality. It's some kind of a never-ending search, more perceived in others than in oneself. The people who've "found it," as you say, are usually self-effacing enough not to admit it.

Audrey Hepburn talks about it in THE NUN'S STORY, when she says, "I thought I'd reach some kind of resting place...," and she is curtly informed by her Mother Superior: "There is no resting place."

Even Power says in RAZOR'S EDGE that he has had great moments of doubt about the path he has taken.

Let me direct you to T.S.Eliot's THE COCKTAIL PARTY, specifically a dialogue between the characters Celia Coplestone and Sir Henry Harcourt-Reilly. Celia says at one point:
"You see, I think I really had a vision of something
Though I don't know what it is. I don't want to forget it.
I want to live with it. I could do without everything,
Put up with anything, if I might cherish it.
In fact, I think it would really be dishonest
For me, now, to try to make a life with anybody!
I couldnt' give anyone the kind of love-
I wish I could - which belongs to that life."

I have a wonderful lp set of the original cast of this play, wherein Alec Guiness and Irene Worth do this scene. Wonderful.

It would appear, then, that this spiritual journey of which we speak is more something for the individual to fathom, than for anyone else to attempt to explain.




Sigh. I see.

Sigh.

So, the crux of the matter is that anything or anyone promising a path to enlightenment or truth is basically only saying "step this way"...but you're on your own finding it.

 
 Posted:   May 7, 2007 - 11:47 PM   
 By:   Steve Johnson   (Member)

Still and all, "The Black Rose" is a richly produced film and has some sterling performances, not the least of which is Orson Welles as a Turkish general.

Yes, wearing his Turk- er, Mongol Renaissance version of "The Man-ssiere"

 
 
 Posted:   May 8, 2007 - 12:32 AM   
 By:   The_Mark_of_Score-O   (Member)

So, the crux of the matter is that anything or anyone promising a path to enlightenment or truth is basically only saying "step this way"...but you're on your own finding it.

It's as simple as clicking your heels together three times, and reciting "There's no place like home..."

 
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