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LOG IN Forgot Login? Register General Discussion • Trading Post • Non-Film Score Discussion  Profile • Preferences • Community Rules • Help/Contact • Search Board Search Terms:  Search Within:  topics posts since 2019 2018 posts 2017 posts 2016 posts 2015 posts 2014 posts 2013 posts 2012 posts 2011 posts 2010 posts 2009 posts 2008 posts 2007 posts 2006 posts 2005 posts 2004 posts 2003 posts 2002 posts 2001 posts 2000 posts users  search tips  You must log in or register to post.   Go to page:  1      Non-Film Score Discussion: James Bond Criterion Laserdiscs... ?   Last Post   Posted:   Jan 30, 2013 - 3:35 PM     By:   jenkwombat   (Member) This is going back a ways, but does anyone know why the CAV Criterion Laserdisc versions of DR. NO, FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE and GOLDFINGER were pulled of the market so quickly? My apologies if this has been brought up before. I didn't get anything when I tried the search engine.    Posted:   Jan 30, 2013 - 3:41 PM     By:   John McMasters   (Member) The discs were pulled because of the commentary tracks -- as I recall the studio(s)/right- holders thought they contained statements of a potentially litigious nature. However, pulling them just made more folks seek out the discs and the commentary tracks! I believe that some of the commentary tracks have now been released officially on some discs -- but I may be totally wrong about that!    Posted:   Jan 30, 2013 - 5:44 PM     By:   Eric Paddon   (Member) I think in the case of "Goldfinger", which disappeared abruply wereas the first two films had remained in print on CAV much longer, it had more to do with the obnoxious liner notes of Bruce Eder (who narrated the commentary tracks for "Dr. No" and "Goldfinger") who decided to indulge in one too many cheap shots at Roger Moore that by extension was also attacking EON for still using him as Bond, that didn't please Broccoli and EON management. Nothing I heard on the commentary tracks was remotely close to what those liner notes did. Some have speculated that in the case of "From Russia With Love" people were annoyed over Richard Maibaum commenting on the lesbian overtone of Lotte Lenya's character. I've never bought that argument because criticism of EON management always made more sense to me as a reason for why Broccoli would order them withdrawn. And no, those Criterion commentary tracks were never reissued. The ones on all subsequent Bond DVDs were entirely new ones.    Posted:   Jan 30, 2013 - 9:34 PM     By:   John McMasters   (Member) A discussion about the commentary tracks on another website by folks who gave them a recent listen featured several people who appear to have had first hand knowledge of the to-do, including Steven Jay Rubin who wrote "The James Bond Encyclopedia" and hosted the commentary track for "From Russia With Love". Sounds like there were a number of reasons for the brouhaha. This is quoted from the website: "Steven Jay Rubin, on January 5, 2012 at 12:49 am said: I can offer a thought or two since I hosted the commentary for From Russia With Love. Writer and director David Lee Miller, who ran Criterion back in the early 1990s was one of the pioneers in developing commentary tracks. When we did From Russia With Love, commentaries were very rare and David admitted that they never asked Eon’s permission to do one. Thus, not only did Cubby object to the content, he probably objected vehemently to the fact that they were never asked or consulted. It was a big faux pas on Criterion’s part. Having written “The James Bond Films” in 1981 and having just completed “The Complete James Bond Movie Encyclopedia” in 1990, both done without a tad of EON cooperation, I probably wasn’t number one on their friends list. However, I think my involvement in the commentary was less important to EON than the straight-from-the-cuff content they provided. I can imagine the look on Cubby’s face when Terrence Young started talking about the fact that Lotte Lenya was in her 70s but still screwing left and right. EON was always about control and these discs were, as one of the commentators above said, more appropriate for a roundtable in the local pup. However, for that very reason, they are fascinating and go way beyond the typical press kit interview."    Posted:   Jan 30, 2013 - 10:37 PM     By:   Eric Paddon   (Member) I agree with MarkA's point in that thread about how a LOT of Bond fandom back then was so overly pro-Connery to the point that looking back on it, it doesn't make them look good. Rubin and others of that kind were big boosters of Kevin McClory and his efforts to put a rival Bond film on-screen with Connery and having read Rubin's book as well as that of Raymond Benson back then, there was this tendency to depict the struggle of one of heroic underdog David (McClory) taking on cold, impersonal Goliath (Broccoli) and that McClory's project had more the interests of "real Bond" stuff at heart than did the franchise at the time with Moore. I think the passage of time now makes it clear that McClory was hardly worthy of that kind of depiction (especially once you read "Battle For Bond").    Posted:   Jan 31, 2013 - 6:11 AM     By:   jenkwombat   (Member) Interesting. So, are these versions rare "Collector's Items" now? As kind of a side note regarding the negative comments about Moore: I grew up with Roger Moore as James Bond, so to me, he WAS Bond. I'd never seen any of the earlier films when I was a kid... ...then, I saw the Sean Connery films. Roger Moore is NOT Bond to me anymore.    Posted:   Jan 31, 2013 - 7:46 AM     By:   Eric Paddon   (Member) It's one thing to argue that the Connery Bond films are the best in the series. It's another thing to have kept whining that Connery wasn't still playing Bond all through the 70s and 80s and that all the Bond films after Connery were bad and that ergo, if Kevin McClory was resorting to all kinds of maneuvers to get another Bond film made that might use Connery, then that made McClory a hero (never mind that thanks to McClory we lost the ability to see SPECTRE and Blofeld used in a real Bond film again). Great as Connery was in the 60s he IMO could not have sustained the character into the 70s and 80s because of his rougher personality (and I still maintain he could not have been credible at all in OHMSS).    Posted:   Jan 31, 2013 - 8:00 AM     By:   John McMasters   (Member) Well, thanks to this thread I'm gonna crank up my ancient LD player this weekend and give the "Goldfinger" CAV set a spin (the only one I acquired of the withdrawn Criterions) and listen to the commentary. It's been years!    Posted:   Jan 31, 2013 - 8:07 AM     By:   jenkwombat   (Member) John McMasters, be careful if your Laserdisc Player is really "ancient". I put one in my player, which hadn't been used in about 10 years, and a disgusting, rubbery goop oozed on to my laserdisc and stuck to it. Some part of it's inner workings had deteriorated over the years apparently. (Thankfully, the disc was not a rare one.)    Posted:   Jan 31, 2013 - 9:48 AM     By:   John McMasters   (Member) Wow. Thanks for the warning.    Posted:   Jan 31, 2013 - 1:12 PM     By:   'Lenny Bruce' Marshall   (Member) John McMasters, be careful if your Laserdisc Player is really "ancient". I put one in my player, which hadn't been used in about 10 years, and a disgusting, rubbery goop oozed on to my laserdisc and stuck to it. Some part of it's inner workings had deteriorated over the years apparently. (Thankfully, the disc was not a rare one.) mine just wouldn't play    Posted:   Jan 31, 2013 - 1:13 PM     By:   'Lenny Bruce' Marshall   (Member) one sad result of the controversy is we don't get to hear Guy Hamilton's fantastic story regarding seeing GOLDINGER with an audience. The story about a fan commenting out loud about the 007/Odd Job finale is priceless bruce    Posted:   Jan 31, 2013 - 4:43 PM     By:   Mike_J   (Member) Interesting. So, are these versions rare "Collector's Items" now? As kind of a side note regarding the negative comments about Moore: I grew up with Roger Moore as James Bond, so to me, he WAS Bond. I'd never seen any of the earlier films when I was a kid... ...then, I saw the Sean Connery films. Roger Moore is NOT Bond to me anymore. Interesting view. Sir Rog was my first Bond too and ai discovered the pre-'73 movies subsequent to Golden Gun. And what I found - with the exception of Diamonds (which was never written for Connery anyway) was that the previous Bonds were so different to Moore's they could have been from an entirely different series. Likewise with the post Moore Bonds. Fact of the matter is there is no one James Bond because the films and the characters are so very very differnt in each evolution of the character. I still love most of Rog's movies and to me I love his Bond, but I also love Connery, 50% of dalton's contribution to the series and the first couple of Brosnan's entries.    Posted:   Jan 31, 2013 - 5:37 PM     By:   LRobHubbard   (Member) Of course, one can find mp3s of those commentary tracks if one is willing to do a little digging...    Posted:   Feb 1, 2013 - 7:20 AM     By:   jenkwombat   (Member) Didn't Criterion offer the commentaries on cassette at one point? I seem to recall hearing that. Or am I thinking of something else?    Posted:   Feb 1, 2013 - 7:39 AM     By:   Buscemi   (Member) Didn't Criterion offer the commentaries on cassette at one point? I seem to recall hearing that. Or am I thinking of something else? That's correct. However, this was squashed quickly by Bond's rights holders.    Posted:   Feb 1, 2013 - 7:59 AM     By:   jenkwombat   (Member) I knew the CAV versions were pulled, and quickly replaced with CLV versions (sans commentaries), but I hadn't known the commentaries were the *reason* they were pulled. Criterion had other titles in its collection which had commentaries on their CAV versions, but not on their CLV versions of the same movie. (I never understood why they couldn't put the commentaries on CLV Laserdiscs; I guess it was just to make you buy their Deluxe much-higher-priced packages.)    Posted:   Feb 1, 2013 - 12:13 PM     By:   Eric Paddon   (Member) The CLV versions were actually released simultaneously with the CAV versions which was SOP for Criterion at the time, to give some a cost-effective alternative. The one other feature from Criterion CAV Bond releases that has never been duplicated was the music/effects track only options for Dr. No and Goldfinger. Both also had "Bond Bread" commercial parodies.    Posted:   Feb 1, 2013 - 5:25 PM     By:   jenkwombat   (Member) BTW, my apologies for saying anything controversial, or that rubbed anyone the wrong way. It wasn't my intent to start another "Who's the best Bond?" thread. It's been my experience with talking to movie lovers (and Bond fans) over the years that, more often than not, people's favorite 007 is the first one they saw playing the part. Or the one they grew up with...     Non-Film Score Discussion: James Bond Criterion Laserdiscs... ?    < 1  >   Go to page:  1   First Post    General Discussion • Trading Post • Non-Film Score Discussion  Profile • Preferences • Community Rules • Help/Contact • Search Board You must log in or register to post.   Go to page:  1

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