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 Posted:   Nov 5, 2013 - 2:28 PM   
 By:   edwzoomom   (Member)

I bought this score awhile back and had not gotten around to listening. In between I read a few thread excerpts that were somewhat lukewarm about it. Not having seen the movie in eons, I had pretty much forgotten everything.

Well today I brought it out and had a blast listening to it. Not recalling the movie, I felt like I was watching one of the old silent movies where the music carried you as swiftly as the printed words on the screen. I could picture the pirates, the sword fights, all of it. I loved it and am very glad I bought it.

Time to revisit the movie!

 
 
 Posted:   Nov 5, 2013 - 2:33 PM   
 By:   Ed Lachmann   (Member)

If you have an HD set up, revisit the gorgeous recent Olive blu-ray of "The Buccaneer", nice sharp transfer and decent sound.

 
 Posted:   Nov 5, 2013 - 2:59 PM   
 By:   Gary S.   (Member)

Do yourself a favor and seek out both versions of the movie. The original featured Frederic March as Jean Lafitte, the remake features Yul Brynner with hair as Lafitte, Charlton Heston as Andy Jackson and the Bernstein score. The original also featured Walter Brennan as Mr. Peavey (Jackson's aide) The music was by George Antheil.

 
 
 Posted:   Nov 5, 2013 - 3:05 PM   
 By:   Niall from Ireland   (Member)

I've been wondering if any of the labels are in the process, or thinking about, bringing out an expanded release of the wonderful Bernstein score?

 
 Posted:   Nov 5, 2013 - 3:21 PM   
 By:   edwzoomom   (Member)

Do yourself a favor and seek out both versions of the movie. The original featured Frederic March as Jean Lafitte, the remake features Yul Brynner with hair as Lafitte, Charlton Heston as Andy Jackson and the Bernstein score. The original also featured Walter Brennan as Mr. Peavey (Jackson's aide) The music was by George Antheil.

It's funny that you mention that because I looked around a bit and see that both versions are available. What a wonderful suggestion. Thanks.

 
 Posted:   Nov 5, 2013 - 3:22 PM   
 By:   edwzoomom   (Member)

If you have an HD set up, revisit the gorgeous recent Olive blu-ray of "The Buccaneer", nice sharp transfer and decent sound.

I do Ed and my family has been bugging me all week for holiday shopping ideas. This may be on there! Thanks.

 
 
 Posted:   Nov 5, 2013 - 7:32 PM   
 By:   peterproud   (Member)

I bought the LP years ago and fell in love with the score. Granted it's all a bit melodramatic but the themes are memorable as hell!

I really hope someone is seeking out better masters because the DRG CD I have (2003) sounds pretty awful....definitely would be a welcome surprise to get a remastered release at some point.....I'd love to see the movie one day too smile

 
 Posted:   Nov 5, 2013 - 10:03 PM   
 By:   Sigerson Holmes   (Member)

Elmer includes a tiny self-tribute to his "Buccaneer" score in "Animal House," near the end, when Belushi dresses up as a pirate and brandishes a cutlass. Hope someone is working on both an expanded "Buccaneer" and the complete "Animal House" as well.



More fun threads on this score:

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=84942&forumID=7&archive=0

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=69355&forumID=1&archive=0

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=62501&forumID=1&archive=0

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=19288&forumID=1&archive=1

 
 
 Posted:   Nov 6, 2013 - 2:41 AM   
 By:   manderley   (Member)

These older threads about THE BUCCANEER are quite interesting, but the most unusual highlight seems to be the real conflict over the recording of the music---the conductor, the venue, and the country:

James MacMillan argues that the score was recorded in Munich during the musician's strike, and that Kurt Graunke was the conductor. He cites Bernstein's own comments at various times, and also references several entries regarding THE BUCCANEER in a log book indicating that the Graunke group was involved in a recording of THE BUCCANEER, among various other Graunke sessions for films over the years.

Joe Caps, on the other hand, cites comments made to him by Bernstein that the score was recorded in Mexico during the musician's strike. Since Joe also re-mixed the laserdisc for stereo from the original recording sessions, he has argued that the Paramount log sheets and cue sheets that were made available to him during this remix indicated that the recording was done in Mexico, and that the conducting chores are credited to Bernstein on these same sheets. Additionally, he notes that the voice-over slating was done in Spanish, and that he can hear chatter by Bernstein, himself, during pre-and-post "takes".

It never occurred to me before that both these viewpoints might be CORRECT. If Joe had a stereo track---presumably recorded in Mexico---which synced to the picture, then this HAD to be the picture's original soundtrack music elements, without question. On the other hand, the original Columbia recording, which we've long thought to be the soundtrack, may not be a soundtrack recording at all as we have all assumed, but a re-recording, done in Munich.

It would be interesting to find out if any or all of the cues on the Columbia "soundtrack" recording sync to the picture without any fudging or stretching. Perhaps one of our highly-trained computer experts with a fine SoundForge program could try these cues out against the picture and give a response.

A fascinating mystery from 50 years ago, I'd say.

Of course, the matter may even be more complicated. Wasn't it VERTIGO which had bits of recording sessions in the US, London, and Munich during this period?

 
 
 Posted:   Nov 6, 2013 - 7:06 AM   
 By:   Joe Caps   (Member)

Columbia Records matches the film, except for some internal edits to shorten the battle scenes.
Also had paper work where Paramount is sending copies of the mags to Columbia Records for the album. Why rereocrd in Munich when there was no reuse on the Mexican sessions?

 
 
 Posted:   Nov 6, 2013 - 7:56 AM   
 By:   James MacMillan   (Member)

http://www.afi.com/members/catalog/DetailView.aspx?s=&Movie=52491

 
 
 Posted:   Nov 6, 2013 - 8:04 AM   
 By:   Niall from Ireland   (Member)

http://www.afi.com/members/catalog/DetailView.aspx?s=&Movie=52491

Thasss it then, all settled, recorded in Munich...I'll drink to that...hic!

 
 Posted:   Nov 6, 2013 - 9:15 AM   
 By:   edwzoomom   (Member)

Elmer includes a tiny self-tribute to his "Buccaneer" score in "Animal House," near the end, when Belushi dresses up as a pirate and brandishes a cutlass. Hope someone is working on both an expanded "Buccaneer" and the complete "Animal House" as well.



More fun threads on this score:

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=84942&forumID=7&archive=0

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=69355&forumID=1&archive=0

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=62501&forumID=1&archive=0

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=19288&forumID=1&archive=1


This scene was awesome - never knew the irony until now. I do have a funny story related to Animal House. I had seen the movie when it was released and told my parents how hilarious it. Well, my mother - a petite proper lady in her mid sixties - INSISTED on seeing it so off we went. She was a trooper and laughed hysterically through the entire movie and blushing I am sure. She never asked to leave. The funny part came - not in the movie but from my mom - when the huge cake parade float appeared with the famous words "Eat Me" came up on the screen. Of course the entire theatre roared but when the noise settled, this USUALLY tiny little voice (my mom) asks "Eat Me?" Why is that so funny? It's a cake isn't it?"

Needless to say, I lost it and everyone around us lost it. She then insisted on an explanation of what it meant (again in the loud voice) - more laughter. I told her I would tell her later (oh and yes I had to). The best part came when the woman in front of us told me my mom was the best part of the movie. She has been gone many years now but this story is one of my favorites!

 
 
 Posted:   Nov 6, 2013 - 9:54 AM   
 By:   Niall from Ireland   (Member)

Elmer includes a tiny self-tribute to his "Buccaneer" score in "Animal House," near the end, when Belushi dresses up as a pirate and brandishes a cutlass. Hope someone is working on both an expanded "Buccaneer" and the complete "Animal House" as well.



More fun threads on this score:

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=84942&forumID=7&archive=0

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=69355&forumID=1&archive=0

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=62501&forumID=1&archive=0

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=19288&forumID=1&archive=1


This scene was awesome - never knew the irony until now. I do have a funny story related to Animal House. I had seen the movie when it was released and told my parents how hilarious it. Well, my mother - a petite proper lady in her mid sixties - INSISTED on seeing it so off we went. She was a trooper and laughed hysterically through the entire movie and blushing I am sure. She never asked to leave. The funny part came - not in the movie but from my mom - when the huge cake parade float appeared with the famous words "Eat Me" came up on the screen. Of course the entire theatre roared but when the noise settled, this USUALLY tiny little voice (my mom) asks "Eat Me?" Why is that so funny? It's a cake isn't it?"

Needless to say, I lost it and everyone around us lost it. She then insisted on an explanation of what it meant (again in the loud voice) - more laughter. I told her I would tell her later (oh and yes I had to). The best part came when the woman in front of us told me my mom was the best part of the movie. She has been gone many years now but this story is one of my favorites!


Ha ha, that's a great story

 
 Posted:   Nov 6, 2013 - 3:02 PM   
 By:   edwzoomom   (Member)

Elmer includes a tiny self-tribute to his "Buccaneer" score in "Animal House," near the end, when Belushi dresses up as a pirate and brandishes a cutlass. Hope someone is working on both an expanded "Buccaneer" and the complete "Animal House" as well.



More fun threads on this score:

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=84942&forumID=7&archive=0

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=69355&forumID=1&archive=0

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=62501&forumID=1&archive=0

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=19288&forumID=1&archive=1


This scene was awesome - never knew the irony until now. I do have a funny story related to Animal House. I had seen the movie when it was released and told my parents how hilarious it. Well, my mother - a petite proper lady in her mid sixties - INSISTED on seeing it so off we went. She was a trooper and laughed hysterically through the entire movie and blushing I am sure. She never asked to leave. The funny part came - not in the movie but from my mom - when the huge cake parade float appeared with the famous words "Eat Me" came up on the screen. Of course the entire theatre roared but when the noise settled, this USUALLY tiny little voice (my mom) asks "Eat Me?" Why is that so funny? It's a cake isn't it?"

Needless to say, I lost it and everyone around us lost it. She then insisted on an explanation of what it meant (again in the loud voice) - more laughter. I told her I would tell her later (oh and yes I had to). The best part came when the woman in front of us told me my mom was the best part of the movie. She has been gone many years now but this story is one of my favorites!


Ha ha, that's a great story



Niall, I never thought I would have a chance to share this funny story again.

 
 
 Posted:   Nov 6, 2013 - 7:01 PM   
 By:   TomD   (Member)


It never occurred to me before that both these viewpoints might be CORRECT. If Joe had a stereo track---presumably recorded in Mexico---which synced to the picture, then this HAD to be the picture's original soundtrack music elements, without question. On the other hand, the original Columbia recording, which we've long thought to be the soundtrack, may not be a soundtrack recording at all as we have all assumed, but a re-recording, done in Munich.



The Buccaneer was a VistaVision release, so it seems doubtful that they would mix a stereo track to sync to the mono print. I don't think Paramount was releasing stereo prints at the time. It is possible that they planned ahead for a stereo album, of course. But, was it possible to record in stereo in Mexico at the time? I don't know.

A three track recording to better balance the orchestra with voices and sound effects might have been possible, but The Buccaneer sounds like a real stereo spread to me, at least as compared to three track conversions of Seventh Voyage of Sinbad or Zulu, for example.

 
 
 Posted:   Nov 6, 2013 - 9:07 PM   
 By:   Bob Bryden   (Member)

Bernstein's 'The Buccaneer' has always been a favourite and a much under-appreciated score. Created on the wings of 'Ten Commandments' is has almost as much grandeur and is a melodic banquet. I also consider the film itself terribly under-rated. It's a fine, solid, although glossy historical epic. Any 7 year old worth his salt in 1958 will never forget being thrilled by 'The Battle of New Orleans'. Ha!

 
 
 Posted:   Nov 6, 2013 - 9:16 PM   
 By:   jef29bow   (Member)

Bernstein's 'The Buccaneer' has always been a favourite and a much under-appreciated score. Created on the wings of 'Ten Commandments' is has almost as much grandeur and is a melodic banquet. I also consider the film itself terribly under-rated. It's a fine, solid, although glossy historical epic. Any 7 year old worth his salt in 1958 will never forget being thrilled by 'The Battle of New Orleans'. Ha!

Ah, what he said -- to the tenth power!!!!!!!

 
 
 Posted:   Nov 7, 2013 - 6:37 AM   
 By:   Niall from Ireland   (Member)

Bernstein's 'The Buccaneer' has always been a favourite and a much under-appreciated score. Created on the wings of 'Ten Commandments' is has almost as much grandeur and is a melodic banquet. I also consider the film itself terribly under-rated. It's a fine, solid, although glossy historical epic. Any 7 year old worth his salt in 1958 will never forget being thrilled by 'The Battle of New Orleans'. Ha!

Absolutely Bob! I was exactly seven when I saw it in 1958 and I can still remember the "The Battle of New Orleans" sequence, it was exciting!

 
 
 Posted:   Nov 7, 2013 - 8:20 PM   
 By:   TomD   (Member)

More factoids for the mystery.

According to Variety in March 1958, Paramount was then considering where to record The Buccaneer, due to the strike. I have not found any comment there about where (or when) it was actually scored. They did record some scores in Mexico, though.

The strike ended in July 1958. The Hollywood musicians won almost everything they wanted from their strike against the AFM, and went back to work.

DRG's liner notes say their Buccaneer CD, presumably the same recording as the Columbia LP, was recorded 6 November 1958 (several months after the strike was over). It doesn't seem likely that they would record in Mexico after the strike was over, of course.

The Buccaneer premiered in December 1958 (IMDb).

 
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