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 Posted:   Jul 10, 2015 - 10:41 AM   
 By:   batman&robin   (Member)

There is a difference between a "listener" and a "collector". Obviously, the person who listen music on tiny headphones in the subway is different from the person who enjoy having a booklet in his hands while listening on speakers at home.

I hate this fallacy, I really do. It's condescending. I listen to my non-physically bought music on well equipped audio set at home or on top-level Bowers & Wilkins P7 headphones.
And I think that the music makes it special, not the way it's released.


I respect you opinion. But wouldn't you agree that there are two different kind of people -- those who are happy to just have the music (digitally or in any other form listenable), and those who are happy if having the physical object (this includes original booklet, factory pressed disc, etc).

I'm not saying in any way that you might be less supportive of the music itself, however I tend to believe you are not one of these persons who would spend hundreds of dollars purchasing a Promo CD. For some, only having it physically is what increases the enjoyment.

 
 Posted:   Jul 10, 2015 - 10:45 AM   
 By:   batman&robin   (Member)

batman&robin: Would you feel the same if the music was released in CD quality download with full artwork? Personally, this would be just fine for me, even if the price is the same as the CD (I save on shipping, the label saves on production).

Answer: No! I'm one of those freaks who want to have original CDs on a shelf. And to make it more clear, the CD that qualifies is only the original factory pressed disc, so this rules out any potential self-made CD-Rs.

 
 Posted:   Jul 10, 2015 - 10:50 AM   
 By:   Solium   (Member)

There is a difference between a "listener" and a "collector". Obviously, the person who listen music on tiny headphones in the subway is different from the person who enjoy having a booklet in his hands while listening on speakers at home.

I hate this fallacy, I really do. It's condescending. I listen to my non-physically bought music on well equipped audio set at home or on top-level Bowers & Wilkins P7 headphones.
And I think that the music makes it special, not the way it's released.


I respect you opinion. But wouldn't you agree that there are two different kind of people -- those who are happy to just have the music (digitally or in any other form listenable), and those who are happy if having the physical object (this includes original booklet, factory pressed disc, etc).

I'm not saying in any way that you might be less supportive of the music itself, however I tend to believe you are not one of these persons who would spend hundreds of dollars purchasing a Promo CD. For some, only having it physically is what increases the enjoyment.


I buy physical media when ever possible but sometimes it's only available as a digital download. While I enjoy all the music the same, I just have no feeling for my digital files. While scanning my score collection on my CD shelf, pulling a score out, looking at the artwork or booklet and importing it into iTunes brings me great joy.

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 10, 2015 - 10:53 AM   
 By:   .   (Member)


I hate this fallacy, I really do. It's condescending. I listen to my non-physically bought music on well equipped audio set at home or on top-level Bowers & Wilkins P7 headphones.

And I think that the music makes it special, not the way it's released.





My Auntie Gertie said almost the exact same thing to me recently:

"I hang cheaply-printed, pixelated reproductions of paintings on my wall at home, in beautiful-looking, really expensive frames.
I think that the art makes it special, not the way it's printed".

Of course, I'm joking... my Auntie Gertie would never use the term "pixelated" because she wouldn't know what it meant. So long as she's happy with her cheap print of The Laughing Cavalier and her expensive frame, that's all that really matters.

 
 Posted:   Jul 10, 2015 - 11:05 AM   
 By:   The Thing   (Member)

I have no aversion to converting my CDs to digital at some point (i.e. when I've got time, and looked into alternative player systems), but as I mentioned in another thread, I can't see myself spending money on digital files as I would on CDs.

I don't read the booklets, but I just can't get over the hurdle of paying money just to own some computer music files. The younger generation don't know any different, and good for them. But I won't be paying thousands of pounds for digital, I'll stick with the music I've got (which is plenty).

So I'm in the category of people who won't be buying anything from anyone where digital is the only option.

 
 Posted:   Jul 10, 2015 - 11:41 AM   
 By:   SchiffyM   (Member)

These conversations always get heated. Some people just can't get past the idea of paying for something that they can't hold in their hands, and that's fine. To me, music isn't something one can hold in one's hands, anyway. I prefer CDs, mostly out of habit at this point, but I'll buy music I love as downloads if the sound quality is good.

(And I don't know how downloads came to be known as "digital," because CDs sure are digital, too.)

But regardless of our personal preferences, clearly labels like Disques Cinémusique would not go this route had consumers not spoken, and had the economics of it necessitated this move.

 
 Posted:   Jul 10, 2015 - 12:30 PM   
 By:   Sirusjr   (Member)

I used to love my physical media and buying CDs but lately now that everything is converted to FLAC format on the computer and the booklet scanned when I get it, there is little distinction between a lossless file purchased as a download and a CD. This has especially been reinforced when I decided to toss all of the cases and keep just the discs themselves and the booklets so I can significantly compress the amount of space taken up by the music on the shelves. I very rarely ever listen to my music while reading through the booklet but if I wanted to do that I have scans of the booklets available which to me is the same thing. If I had a choice, I would stop buying CDs entirely but I like the music released by Intrada and Kritzerland among others so I have no choice if I want to purchase the music.

Like others have said, the cost of shipping greatly increases the total amount spent on music in a large way such that I would gladly buy everything in CD quality FLAC downloads if it was available. And, I listen to my music through my tower speakers at home and if they are not available through my Sennheiser headphones so I rarely listen to music through low quality headphones just because it is digital.

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 10, 2015 - 1:26 PM   
 By:   TerraEpon   (Member)


I hate this fallacy, I really do. It's condescending. I listen to my non-physically bought music on well equipped audio set at home or on top-level Bowers & Wilkins P7 headphones.


Indeed. Though I much prefer physical, I do have a decently large digital collection (mostly bought for VERY cheap from eMusic.com and more recently a decently amount from eClassical.com, plus various Bandcamp stuff) and I listen to them using $200 Sennheiser headphones with a $200 Asus sound card. Which is the same medium I listen to CDs with (which, incidentally I now rip to lossless anyway...)

 
 Posted:   Jul 11, 2015 - 12:57 AM   
 By:   johnbijl   (Member)


I hate this fallacy, I really do. It's condescending. I listen to my non-physically bought music on well equipped audio set at home or on top-level Bowers & Wilkins P7 headphones.

And I think that the music makes it special, not the way it's released.





My Auntie Gertie said almost the exact same thing to me recently:

"I hang cheaply-printed, pixelated reproductions of paintings on my wall at home, in beautiful-looking, really expensive frames.
I think that the art makes it special, not the way it's printed".

Of course, I'm joking... my Auntie Gertie would never use the term "pixelated" because she wouldn't know what it meant. So long as she's happy with her cheap print of The Laughing Cavalier and her expensive frame, that's all that really matters.



That's not the same thing, now is it?

When I'm playing music from a cd it's the exact same audio waves coming out of the speakers as when I play a lossless download. Both contain the exact same bits. Nothing is 'pixelated'.

If you wanna use this analogy it would be comparing playing a recorded file to having a symphony orchestra in your home playing Ben Hur for you live. That might by cool, but considering my current living situation that doesn't sound practical.

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 11, 2015 - 6:34 AM   
 By:   .   (Member)


That's not the same thing, now is it?

When I'm playing music from a cd it's the exact same audio waves coming out of the speakers as when I play a lossless download. Both contain the exact same bits. Nothing is 'pixelated'.





This is about DC going download only and offering only sub-CD quality. They talk of iTunes and streaming. Where is a lossless option mentioned?

 
 Posted:   Jul 11, 2015 - 7:14 AM   
 By:   johnbijl   (Member)


That's not the same thing, now is it?

When I'm playing music from a cd it's the exact same audio waves coming out of the speakers as when I play a lossless download. Both contain the exact same bits. Nothing is 'pixelated'.


This is about DC going download only and offering only sub-CD quality. They talk of iTunes and streaming. Where is a lossless option mentioned?



They talk about 'download and streaming' on 'sites [sic] like iTunes', never of the resolution. That's why I said that it is good news 'if lossless'.

 
 Posted:   Jul 11, 2015 - 7:22 AM   
 By:   johnbijl   (Member)

I respect you opinion. But wouldn't you agree that there are two different kind of people -- those who are happy to just have the music (digitally or in any other form listenable), and those who are happy if having the physical object (this includes original booklet, factory pressed disc, etc).

Interesting. Would you say that collecting the physical cd is more important to you than collecting the music?



I'm not saying in any way that you might be less supportive of the music itself, however I tend to believe you are not one of these persons who would spend hundreds of dollars purchasing a Promo CD. For some, only having it physically is what increases the enjoyment.

Most I spent on a cd was two hundred dollars on the Bacchus-release of Lethal Weapon. I've spent amounts in the range of $ 50 - 150 for promo's and out-of-print releases. I *almost* had spent a pretty hefty price on Delerue's La Revolution Francaise, just before the re-release. Because I wanted the music, not the cd.

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 18, 2015 - 8:49 AM   
 By:   ZardozSpeaks   (Member)

Did anybody comment on the titles of these 'new release' digital downloads from Disques Cinémusique?

http://www.disquescinemusique.com/english/HOME_eng.html

George Duning's Cowboy & 3:10 to Yuma!



24 heures de la vie d'une femme by Jean Prodromidès.



Cléo de 5 à 7 by Michel Legrand.



... and this is only about half of what's there (music by Frank Skinner, Georges Delerue, Georges Auric, etc.)

These new digitals are primarily vinyl LP or EP programs that would be too short for the typical CD duration. If a French EP was issued onto CD, it would likely be combined with around a half dozen other EP programs to fill up to 70-to-80 minutes of duration (and fans of a particular composer might not care to have on the same disc other composers whose music they don't like or care about).

I think DC's decision to go digital on these French EP programs bodes well for future restorations of similar material (lots of vinyl out there with music by Garvarentz, Bolling, etc.).
The customer pays for 4 cues @ 69 cents per track.
I hope album masters from Barclay and Philips are ready for such distribution.
Who knows? Perhaps Robert Farnon's Shalako will arrive via Disques Cinémusique smile

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 18, 2015 - 9:16 AM   
 By:   ZardozSpeaks   (Member)

I still had some hopes that more Sarde and Jansen scores - some of them never published even on LP - from the CAM/Pema catalogue might be released on CD by them in the near future. But of course this will not be the case anymore.


Hi, Stefan.

Would Pierre Jansen's music for Claude Chabrol's Alice ou la dernière fugue (1976) be one of the titles in the Pema/C.A.M. catalogue?
This is a Jansen score never before released in any format.

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 18, 2015 - 9:48 AM   
 By:   Stefan Schlegel   (Member)

Hi, Stefan.

Would Pierre Jansen's music for Claude Chabrol's Alice ou la dernière fugue (1976) be one of the titles in the Pema/C.A.M. catalogue?
This is a Jansen score never before released in any format.


Yes, ALICE OU LA DERNIÈRE FUGUE is in the Pema/CAM catalogue and I had really hoped that this score would come from DCM in the near future on CD as they had also licensed LA DENTELLIÈRE two years ago from Sugar. But I am very skeptical now if something like this will happen anymore because DCM has to pay a license to Sugar in Italy - whether they release it on CD or only as a digital download. And what will be their profit just from a digital download? This is probably not rewarding at all for them, and how do they want to pay several hundred Euros/Dollars for it? The other question is: Will Sugar llicense something like this at all only for digital download purposes?
So the future doesn't look really bright as I see it. What we will definitively get now and in the future from DCM will mainly be vinyl rips again from scores which are in the public domain here in Europe and also in Canada. And probably not album masters as you assumed in your posting above.
One can already see the consequences with these EP vinyl rips which are now released again because they can be done so cheaply and because the scores are older than 50 years. So the original publisher doesn't have to be paid. Just look at the Legrand CLÉO EP or the Delerue AUTRE FEMME EP. These are EPs from 1962 and 1963 - so no problem at all for DCM to do a vinyl rip of them and offer them as digital downloads. We are not talking here about album masters anymore.
The four tracks from the CLÉO EP had even been on a Hortensia CD compilation in the early 90s so it is even easier for DCM to just take it from there.

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 18, 2015 - 10:02 AM   
 By:   .   (Member)








The tracklist shows this to be a copy of the old promo disc of 3:10 to Yuma.
Regurgitated, unlicensed stuff like this only serves to make the chances of an official, worthier release of the score all the less likely.
No surprise that DC isn't producing CDs of this. Neither do any of the illegal download sites that have offered this same promo disc for years.
Such a release is like anti-matter to everything we value from our respected labels. Why give money to respected specialists Kritzerland to open vaults for the restoration and skilled presentation of classic albums and scores, if sub-Harkit-level rip-offs from DC will do?

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 19, 2015 - 1:27 PM   
 By:   Bob DiMucci   (Member)

58 years after the release of the film--and after a promo LP, promo CD, and several other available downloads-- damn those SOBs at Disques CinéMusique for jumping the gun on a legitimate release of 3:10 TO YUMA.

 
 Posted:   Jul 19, 2015 - 1:48 PM   
 By:   Advise & Consent   (Member)

*

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 19, 2015 - 2:14 PM   
 By:   Mr. Popular   (Member)

There is a difference between a "listener" and a "collector". Obviously, the person who listen music on tiny headphones in the subway is different from the person who enjoy having a booklet in his hands while listening on speakers at home.


I hate this fallacy, I really do. It's condescending. I listen to my non-physically bought music on well equipped audio set at home or on top-level Bowers & Wilkins P7 headphones.

And I think that the music makes it special, not the way it's released.


Agreed here. It's all about the music to me. If I get a lossless version of a score, I'll buy it. In the end, I buy music to enjoy.

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 19, 2015 - 2:23 PM   
 By:   Mr. Popular   (Member)

I used to love my physical media and buying CDs but lately now that everything is converted to FLAC format on the computer and the booklet scanned when I get it, there is little distinction between a lossless file purchased as a download and a CD. This has especially been reinforced when I decided to toss all of the cases and keep just the discs themselves and the booklets so I can significantly compress the amount of space taken up by the music on the shelves. I very rarely ever listen to my music while reading through the booklet but if I wanted to do that I have scans of the booklets available which to me is the same thing. If I had a choice, I would stop buying CDs entirely but I like the music released by Intrada and Kritzerland among others so I have no choice if I want to purchase the music.

Like others have said, the cost of shipping greatly increases the total amount spent on music in a large way such that I would gladly buy everything in CD quality FLAC downloads if it was available. And, I listen to my music through my tower speakers at home and if they are not available through my Sennheiser headphones so I rarely listen to music through low quality headphones just because it is digital.


I use J-River media server to stream my lossless tunes to my high end receiver and speakers. I also pay for a legit backup cloud service as well as backing up on a physical drive AND CD-Rs when I have the time unless I have the physical CD which is filed away. So there is never going to be a way for me to lose this music as the service I use for backing in the cloud is used by every company on earth AND the CIA. To me, that seems quite secure.

I wish people wouldn't denigrate those of us who listen this way. I don't denigrate CDs as I still enjoy them as well. It all depends on the options I am being offered. Sometimes, I want it right now and in the case of some Mancini scores on HDtracks, I bought some of them to hear right now in glorious 24 bit.

In the end, I buy music to enjoy. I always have. To me I am a fan of the music not a "collector". To me a collector is somebody who buys something to admire on a shelf. A fan is somebody who is active and wants to hear it, dissect it, immerse themselves in it.

No offense to anybody here. I just tire of the digital is lame because I can't hold it in my hands blah blah argument. I am no worse a fan than anybody here for liking lossless digital. To me, having a folder available through my receiver to play 10s of thousands of lossless tracks at the click of a remote is exciting and keeps life interesting for me.

Just my 2 cents. Not meant to disparage anybody.

 
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