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What’s fun is no one actually uses the term “woke” anymore other than conservatives who use it as a general insult for well, you can see if you scroll up. Not true. Consumers across all spectrum's want to enjoy films without political ideology, diversity mandates or social messaging being shoved down their throats. Go woke, go broke. Everything is political, ideological and has a message. You think that TLOTR was about nothing? Tolkien would disagree. Also, to think that skin color always has to be white because that was how it has always been portrayed is as ignorant of the truth as insisting that Jesus was white.
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Posted: |
Jul 16, 2022 - 10:05 AM
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By: |
SchiffyM
(Member)
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Look, I have a hunch we're facing either a stern talking-to or a locked thread here. All I would say is, I think it's a real shame that there are some who react to casting that reflects the world we live in as "diversity mandates." (And by the way, yes, I do agree that there are films with actual historical contexts where that can be ridiculous. But that is certainly not what we're talking about here, though some are pretending there's a comparison.) For too long, most films took place in a fantasy world, no matter the context, where only white people existed, at least in any meaningful way. I'm happy that that is changing, and sad that some object that that's "forced" and something that "people don't want." What harm is a Black dwarf (or whatever they are) causing anybody that they have to rail against it on the internet? I don't think I'll ever understand. And if anybody chooses to answer this, I would ask that you answer with "what I want" rather than distancing with the generic "what people want."
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Posted: |
Jul 16, 2022 - 2:45 PM
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By: |
joan hue
(Member)
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For too long, most films took place in a fantasy world, no matter the context, where only white people existed, at least in any meaningful way. I'm happy that that is changing, and sad that some object that that's "forced" and something that "people don't want." What harm is a Black dwarf (or whatever they are) causing anybody that they have to rail against it on the internet? I don't think I'll ever understand. I really agree with you, Shiffy. Note also that most of those fantasy films were cast, produced and directed by white people. Our population is now much more diverse. How nice it is that children of color can see themselves as elves, dwarves, or other Tolkien characters. I too don't understand why anyone would be upset about a Black dwarf.
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Posted: |
Jul 16, 2022 - 8:45 PM
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By: |
Grack21
(Member)
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For too long, most films took place in a fantasy world, no matter the context, where only white people existed, at least in any meaningful way. I'm happy that that is changing, and sad that some object that that's "forced" and something that "people don't want." What harm is a Black dwarf (or whatever they are) causing anybody that they have to rail against it on the internet? I don't think I'll ever understand. I really agree with you, Shiffy. Note also that most of those fantasy films were cast, produced and directed by white people. Our population is now much more diverse. How nice it is that children of color can see themselves as elves, dwarves, or other Tolkien characters. I too don't understand why anyone would be upset about a Black dwarf. As an extra hilarious note, anyone who knows even a little bit about Tolkien the man knows he would be the last one to complain about someone adding a black dwarf to an adaptation. Honestly this whole thread is…icky.
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The only real point of argument I could understand is whether changes to the Lord of the Rings universe match the level of logic in what Tolkien laid out. He was pretty specific and detailed in his world-building, so if there is a historical logic to why a dwarf might be darker-skinned or there is a female orc leader in a homo-social patriarchal clan, etc. then I don't really see an issue. On a broader level, I think there is a reasonable frustration with the predictable friction created by media taking existing works and trying to turn them into their own playground instead of making a new one themselves. LORD OF THE RINGS was a specific story in a universe made to serve that story. There is definitely a point where that can get tweaked so much that it basically becomes a generic Dungeons & Dragons universe that's merely leeching off the name brand of LOTR and nothing more. I am very opposed to the excessive expansion and re-writing of franchises to fit needs incompatible with the originals (JURASSIC WORLD series is a current example) and my stance is that some audiences and some production folk (not a lot, but there have been a few I've worked with) are a bit selfish in wanting to change a creative world they didn't make, just to suit their own personal wants. As for this show, we have yet to see. I'm curious how it will all turn out.
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