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 Posted:   Mar 31, 2023 - 1:41 PM   
 By:   ibelin   (Member)

I regret the tone of what I posted initially in this thread as it strongly implied that I was calling some folks racist

I am not offended. Even if you explictly had used the word 'racist', I've learned not to care whenever that word is applied to me.

'Racist'—like 'fascist', 'extremist', etc.—has no meaning nowadays because of simple-minded people using it as an invective against people they don't like. There's a good quote by George Orwell regarding the word 'fascism', but it applies equally to 'racism' and its variants as well: "The word Fascism has now no meaning except in so far as it signifies 'something not desirable'."

It's funny, because the Cambridge Dictionary gives a clear definition of 'racist': 'someone who believes that their race makes them better, more intelligent, more moral, etc. than people of other races and who does or says unfair or harmful things as a result'. Based on that definition, it's not racist simply to point out the skin color of the leading lady in this film. Nor is it racist to point out the sheer insanity of the progressivism that these corporations are shoving down our throats.

Was this black lady REALLY the best actor they could find for the role of Ariel? Come on now.

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 31, 2023 - 3:27 PM   
 By:   Mephariel   (Member)

I regret the tone of what I posted initially in this thread as it strongly implied that I was calling some folks racist

I am not offended. Even if you explictly had used the word 'racist', I've learned not to care whenever that word is applied to me.

'Racist'—like 'fascist', 'extremist', etc.—has no meaning nowadays because of simple-minded people using it as an invective against people they don't like. There's a good quote by George Orwell regarding the word 'fascism', but it applies equally to 'racism' and its variants as well: "The word Fascism has now no meaning except in so far as it signifies 'something not desirable'."

It's funny, because the Cambridge Dictionary gives a clear definition of 'racist': 'someone who believes that their race makes them better, more intelligent, more moral, etc. than people of other races and who does or says unfair or harmful things as a result'. Based on that definition, it's not racist simply to point out the skin color of the leading lady in this film. Nor is it racist to point out the sheer insanity of the progressivism that these corporations are shoving down our throats.

Was this black lady REALLY the best actor they could find for the role of Ariel? Come on now.


Was any actor or actresses really the best they could find for any role in history? How do you prove that?

As a manager in a company, I always laugh when people keep saying things like "Don't hire for diversity, hire the best person for the job." This sounds like someone who never hire anyone in their life. You get 10 candidates and you probably drop 5 of them after the initial screening because they don't fit what you are looking for. Most of the time, there is no "best" among the remaining five, it is just about what you value. If you have an interview panel, someone is going to value the candidate with experience. Someone is going to value soft skills. Someone might value availability or lasting tenure knowing the candidate is not the best. At the end, everyone has biases, and the hiring manager's biases win out.

If you value a faithful adaption of the animated film, then Halle Bailey is not your choice. But if you love her voice, or wants the character to be unique, maybe she is. Also, even if her skin color does have something to do with it, what is the problem? If I want to film to target more black audience and I hire a black actress, that is just business. Lastly, whether you want to admit it or not, people are bias towards certain looks. That is why it is so hard to hire someone to play James Bond. Your ideal Bond is not my ideal Bond.

 
 Posted:   Mar 31, 2023 - 4:45 PM   
 By:   ibelin   (Member)

Was any actor or actresses really the best they could find for any role in history? How do you prove that?

Given that there are tens of thousands—if not hundreds of thousands—of actors, it would be impractical to determine the ABSOLUTE best person for a role. But that's not what I was getting at. Some people are just 'made' for a role: Heath Ledger as The Joker, J.K. Simmons as J. Jonah Jameson, Alan Rickman as Severus Snape, Matthew Lillard as Shaggy, Sir Anthony Hopkins as Hannibal Lecter, et al. In no way, shape, or form is Halle Berry made for the role of Ariel. 'The Little Mermaid' is a musical, yet Berry is not even known as a singer.

As a manager in a company, I always laugh when people keep saying things like "Don't hire for diversity, hire the best person for the job." This sounds like someone who never hire anyone in their life. You get 10 candidates and you probably drop 5 of them after the initial screening because they don't fit what you are looking for. Most of the time, there is no "best" among the remaining five, it is just about what you value. If you have an interview panel, someone is going to value the candidate with experience. Someone is going to value soft skills. Someone might value availability or lasting tenure knowing the candidate is not the best. At the end, everyone has biases, and the hiring manager's biases win out.

Is your 'company' involved with Hollywood in any way? In Hollywood there could be hundreds of people auditioning for a lead role. I don't think it's a coincidence that in seemingly every other production nowadays the selected lead actor, picked from potentially hundreds of auditioners, ends up being black. It's also possible for a role to be cast via offer instead of by holding auditions. Either way, it's as you said: It all comes down to what the hiring manager (or casting director, in this case) values. As agents of Hollywood, hiring managers overwhelmingly value progressivism above all else. They are shoving this crap down our throats.

If you value a faithful adaption of the animated film, then Halle Bailey is not your choice. But if you love her voice, or wants the character to be unique, maybe she is.

Notice how you said 'faithful'. Shouldn't every adaptation be faithful? Hollywood, however, seems to be more concerned with identity politics than with making faithful adaptations. You'd think that a singer would be cast in a faithful adaptation of a musical, but Halle Berry is NOT known as a singer. I've listened to her voice, and off the top of my head I can think of a handful of female actors who have a better singing voice than hers, and none of them are black.

I don't know what you mean when you suggest that some people want the character to be unique. Every role is unique based on the actor. Like I said, some actors are better suited for a role than are others. It's the casting director's job, or SHOULD be the casting director's job, to hire the most suitable person he can find for a role.

Also, even if her skin color does have something to do with it, what is the problem? If I want to film to target more black audience and I hire a black actress, that is just business.

Ah, yes. The 'business as usual' fallacy. Just because something is good for business doesn't make it right.

Lastly, whether you want to admit it or not, people are bias towards certain looks. That is why it is so hard to hire someone to play James Bond. Your ideal Bond is not my ideal Bond.

So what you're saying is that we're all racist? I agree.

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 31, 2023 - 4:53 PM   
 By:   Symphorch   (Member)

Christ...why are we having a race and social justice debate in a dang film score forum? I don't care if Ariel is black, white, yellow, or purple. The only reason why people would get upset is because they're resistant to change and not open-minded. Seeing the videos of little black kids light up when they hear Hailey sing is so heart-warming.

I don't care (and neither should anyone) who they chose to cast Ariel. As long as she does justice to the music and character, which looks like that may happen, that's a win in my book.

Those who feel the need to argue about things like this, get a bigger life. Find issues that are ACTUALLY worth getting in a tizzy over. Life is too short to worry about skin tone on fictional characters. Grow the heck up.

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 31, 2023 - 6:08 PM   
 By:   TerraEpon   (Member)

Surprised the word 'woke' doesn't show up anywhere in this thread.

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 31, 2023 - 6:33 PM   
 By:   GoblinScore   (Member)

Surprised the word 'woke' doesn't show up anywhere in this thread.

It does now....

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 31, 2023 - 9:40 PM   
 By:   joan hue   (Member)

Halle as seen in this youtube has a great singing voice. Another young lady that has even a stronger voice is Rachel Zegler. Her voice was stunning in West Side Story. She is currently making the live version of Snow White. Oh Oh, she is Hispanic which will probably cause more dissent.

I don't understand the problems here. Animators did cartoons in certain years. Over decades, society changes. Live remakes change some skin tones from the original animated cartoons to reflect societal changes. So what. What is important is that the actors are talented, the script is well-written, and the movie has a solid director. We will know this movie's worth when it is released.



 
 
 Posted:   Mar 31, 2023 - 11:24 PM   
 By:   WillemAfo   (Member)

I'm no fan of post-2010s Disney especially the live-action remakes (apart from "Cinderella" I think was the only decent one I remember) but Halle Bailey IS a singer and an actress.

She's been in a Grammy-nominated band with her sister for the past 5+ years and sung for huge events like the Grammys and the Superbowl. She's also been on the TV show "Grown-ish", has done other work for Disney, and has worked with Tyler Perry, Ava Duvernay, and Beyonce. In short, Bailey is well-connected and being in her early-20s she is well-known by the Gen-Z / Social Media audience segment that a lot of movies now target. From a business standpoint in the industry she makes a lot of sense to cast, but she also DOES have the skills.

Now I personally think social media is absolute cultural trash and is a key contributor and enabler of the disposable "content" culture we live in now where there are fewer original works, this "Little Mermaid" live-action remake being one of them... but Bailey at least started AS a singer and has been genuinely working in the industry for while.

But if we want to critique remakes and streaming platforms and the glut of "good-enough" content, I'm down to do that. And when it comes to any of the big three Disney works that Howard Ashman spearheaded, I firmly believe there is no touching them. Ashman brought more than just lyrics to his films, he also essentially functioned partly as director and producer. He brought genuine magic that you just can't replicate.

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 31, 2023 - 11:32 PM   
 By:   Mephariel   (Member)

Given that there are tens of thousands—if not hundreds of thousands—of actors, it would be impractical to determine the ABSOLUTE best person for a role. But that's not what I was getting at. Some people are just 'made' for a role: Heath Ledger as The Joker, J.K. Simmons as J. Jonah Jameson, Alan Rickman as Severus Snape, Matthew Lillard as Shaggy, Sir Anthony Hopkins as Hannibal Lecter, et al. In no way, shape, or form is Halle Berry made for the role of Ariel. 'The Little Mermaid' is a musical, yet Berry is not even known as a singer.

The irony here is that you mentioned Heath Ledger. The choice to cast Ledger wasn't a slam dunk and was widely criticized by the internet. If anything, Ledger is exactly what I am talking about. Somebody made a choice because he saw something in Ledger. But you asked 100 other casting manager, they probably choose someone else. Ledger wasn't "made" for the role. Someone saw something in him and he or she was right about it. This is also true for the casting of Bella Ramsey as Ellie in The Last of Us. Was she born to play Ellie? No. Her performance was retrospectively praised, but most fans were looking at actresses that far better resemble Ellie physically like Kaitlyn Dever. They went for the unfaithful adaption and was rewarded. On the other hand, Tom Cruise looks nothing like Jack Reacher and probably should have never been casted. There are multiple qualities that can make a winning role. Sometimes it is physical similarity and sometimes it isn't. No one has a crystal ball. That is the challenge of hiring someone.

By the way, I am not sure if you know this, but they didn't cast Halle Berry. They casted Halle Bailey, who is a five-time Grammy nominated singer and song writer and is only 23 years old. Is she the right choice? I am not sure. But why do you think she is not other than skin color? And who in your opinion is "born" to play Ariel?

Is your 'company' involved with Hollywood in any way? In Hollywood there could be hundreds of people auditioning for a lead role. I don't think it's a coincidence that in seemingly every other production nowadays the selected lead actor, picked from potentially hundreds of auditioners, ends up being black. It's also possible for a role to be cast via offer instead of by holding auditions. Either way, it's as you said: It all comes down to what the hiring manager (or casting director, in this case) values. As agents of Hollywood, hiring managers overwhelmingly value progressivism above all else. They are shoving this crap down our throats.

So what is the problem here? Are the black actors and actresses not qualify? If they excel in their role, what are you angry at? It is funny you keep complaining about "progressivism" but the only thing you care about seems to be skin color. As for auditions, there are tons of roles that got casted without auditions. Most recently, the role of Feyd-Rautha, which went to white actor Austin Butler, who admitted he didn't audition for the role. So is that progressivism too? Did you just start following the industry yesterday?

Notice how you said 'faithful'. Shouldn't every adaptation be faithful? Hollywood, however, seems to be more concerned with identity politics than with making faithful adaptations. You'd think that a singer would be cast in a faithful adaptation of a musical, but Halle Berry is NOT known as a singer. I've listened to her voice, and off the top of my head I can think of a handful of female actors who have a better singing voice than hers, and none of them are black.

No, not every adaptation should be faithful. The animated version of the Little Mermaid wasn't faithful to the original Danish fairytale either. I love Jurassic Park and that wasn't even close to being faithful to the book. I love V for Vendetta and that wasn't faithful to the graphic novel.

And once again, Halle Berry was not casted. Halle Bailey is playing Ariel. And yes, she is a singer. Whether her voice is great or not is a matter of opinion.

I don't know what you mean when you suggest that some people want the character to be unique. Every role is unique based on the actor. Like I said, some actors are better suited for a role than are others. It's the casting director's job, or SHOULD be the casting director's job, to hire the most suitable person he can find for a role.

And in this case, the casting director found five time Grammy nominated singer Halle Bailey as the most suitable choice. Maybe it was the right choice, maybe not. We shall see.

Ah, yes. The 'business as usual' fallacy. Just because something is good for business doesn't make it right.

What makes it wrong? Her skin color?

So what you're saying is that we're all racist? I agree.

If you are wondering why everyone thinks you are racist, this is why. Where did I say my choice for Bond is a non-white male? If I have to choose right now, I'll pick Richard Madden, or Jacob Elordi. Both are white males. There are so many attributes that can be debatable about Bond beyond race. Sorry you couldn't see that.

You make everything about race. Maybe that is why so many people think you are racist.

 
 Posted:   Apr 1, 2023 - 1:24 AM   
 By:   ibelin   (Member)

The irony here is that you mentioned Heath Ledger. The choice to cast Ledger wasn't a slam dunk and was widely criticized by the internet. If anything, Ledger is exactly what I am talking about. Somebody made a choice because he saw something in Ledger. But you asked 100 other casting manager, they probably choose someone else. Ledger wasn't "made" for the role. Someone saw something in him and he or she was right about it.

The main reason why Heath Ledger was criticized is that he wasn't Jack Nicholson, who was the best Joker at the time. Ledger was also criticized because he didn't look the part; but the Joker, who wears a costume, is defined by his personality. So as Ledger's acting shows, he was actually made for the role—as many, many, many other people will attest.

By the way, I am not sure if you know this, but they didn't cast Halle Berry. They casted Halle Bailey, who is a five-time Grammy nominated singer and song writer and is only 23 years old. Is she the right choice? I am not sure. But why do you think she is not other than skin color? And who in your opinion is "born" to play Ariel?

This is embarrassing on my part. That's what I get for not keeping up with the names of actors. Halle Berry is Catwoman. Halle Bailey is the mermaid. They have similar names. Even if Bailey is a singer, the final decision to cast her as Ariel had little to do with her singing and acting abilities, I'll tell you that. I had listened to her singing voice in one of this thread's videos before writing my previous post, and it was atrocious.

Who is the perfect Ariel? I don't know. As my mix-up shows, I am not savvy when it comes to actors. I am not a casting director, but off the top of my head Ariana Grande would have been a good fit: She's still relatively young, she's way better than Bailey at singing, and she has more acting experience than her. (Her first name even shares the first three letters with Ariel. big grin) She has a 'modern' vibe (for better or for worse) and would have brought in tons of money for Disney. Casting is a difficult affair, however, so maybe it wasn't possible to get her (if she was even considered). A casting director would be able to pull way more names out of a hat than I could.

So what is the problem here? Are the black actors and actresses not qualify? If they excel in their role, what are you angry at? It is funny you keep complaining about "progressivism" but the only thing you care about seems to be skin color. As for auditions, there are tons of roles that got casted without auditions. Most recently, the role of Feyd-Rautha, which went to white actor Austin Butler, who admitted he didn't audition for the role. So is that progressivism too? Did you just start following the industry yesterday?

Halle Bailey clearly is not succeeding in her role. When I use the word 'progressivism', I am referring to the sheer nonsense that is being shoved down our throats not just by Hollywood but by the entire mainstream media. Is 'progressivism' the best word to describe it? I think so, because the titular myth of modernity is the idea of 'progress'. 'Woke' is another good word.

No, not every adaptation should be faithful. The animated version of the Little Mermaid wasn't faithful to the original Danish fairytale either. I love Jurassic Park and that wasn't even close to being faithful to the book. I love V for Vendetta and that wasn't faithful to the graphic novel.

The animated version of 'The Little Mermaid' wasn't faithful to the original Danish fairy tale because the latter was a literary fairy tale, not a musical. Ariel wasn't even in the original fairy tale; it was an unnamed mermaid (who was described as white, by the way). The only things in common between the two are the title and some plot elements. That hardly makes the animated version an adaptation. Now Disney is distorting the fairy tale even more by filling it with their woke nonsense.

A movie's being better than the book on which it is based (e.g., Fight Club) is almost always because it remained relatively faithful to the source material (while taking some liberties here and there) and just happened to be better incidentally.

If you are wondering why everyone thinks you are racist, this is why. Where did I say my choice for Bond is a non-white male? If I have to choose right now, I'll pick Richard Madden, or Jacob Elordi. Both are white males. There are so many attributes that can be debatable about Bond beyond race. Sorry you couldn't see that.

You make everything about race. Maybe that is why so many people think you are racist.


Because people totally haven't been saying that Idris Elba would be, like, the BEST James Bond EVER. OMG!!! Yeah, right. roll eyes

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 1, 2023 - 2:38 AM   
 By:   WillemAfo   (Member)

Ariana Grande doesn't have serious acting experience for a film like this. Nickelodeon acting is different from feature acting, or even network sitcom acting, just like showrunning prestige TV like Game Of Thrones is different from showrunning a network TV show. Ariana Grande is also more known by the public AS a singer.

Halle Bailey straddles the line between singing and acting well and as I pointed out has already worked with Disney and other huge names.

Grande's singing persona and looks also work against her for this role - her singing persona is hyper-sexualized and her face looks tough and assertive with flatter features. Bailey's persona is none of that and her facial features and rounded cheekbones give her a more innocent, sweet look that fits the character. If you've ever seen interviews with Halle Bailey she also comes across just as sweet, in contrast Ariana Grande occurs much more aggressively - there's no way that's going to go over in the room.

I'd think far more than casting, the real concerns would be all the "BWAAAAAAAAAM" throughout the trailer and the Game Of Thrones-dragon-fire-esque ship battle that makes this seem more like a nightmare than a fairytale.

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 1, 2023 - 3:02 AM   
 By:   John Rokesmith   (Member)

Even if Bailey is a singer, the final decision to cast her as Ariel had little to do with her singing and acting abilities, I'll tell you that. I had listened to her singing voice in one of this thread's videos before writing my previous post, and it was atrocious.

Halle Bailey clearly is not succeeding in her role. When I use the word 'progressivism', I am referring to the sheer nonsense that is being shoved down our throats not just by Hollywood but by the entire mainstream media. Is 'progressivism' the best word to describe it? I think so, because the titular myth of modernity is the idea of 'progress'. 'Woke' is another good word.


So Halle Bailey is clearly not succeeding? How do you come to that conclusion? Watching about 30 seconds of footage from the trailer? Alan Menken during his talk to music students in Vienna last October said she was wonderful. I just can't make up mind whether it's you or Menken who is more qualified to judge her performance and singing abilities at this point in time.

The claim that her casting had little to do with her singing and acting abilities is fairly ridiculous. This is a project that Disney hopes will be a major blockbuster. And when you cast someone who is not a major star (especially internationally) you look for someone who can carry a movie. Nobody will go with a black lead who is terrible just to show their wokeness (especially as you wouldn't have faced any backlash for casting a white actress in this particular part).

I have no idea whether she will be good or not. I am waiting for the movie to come out and will make my judgment afterwards.

 
 Posted:   Apr 1, 2023 - 6:43 AM   
 By:   SchiffyM   (Member)

Ariana Grande doesn't have serious acting experience for a film like this. Nickelodeon acting is different from feature acting, or even network sitcom acting, just like showrunning prestige TV like Game Of Thrones is different from showrunning a network TV show.

I'm really not a fan of defining people's futures by their pasts. There are hundreds of light comic actors who have surprised us by being fine dramatic actors, and vice versa. (There are also certainly many who've shown their limitations when they've tried to stretch, of course.)

Is showrunning "Game of Thrones" different from showrunning "iCarly"? Well yeah, sure, just as showrunning "Barney and Friends" is different from showrunning "Teletubbies," and just as making an omelette is different from baking a cake. But the skill sets are very compatible and there's no reason to assume an intelligent person can't apply his learned skills from one to the other.

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 1, 2023 - 8:12 AM   
 By:   joan hue   (Member)

Nobody will go with a black lead who is terrible just to show their wokeness (especially as you wouldn't have faced any backlash for casting a white actress in this particular part).

I have no idea whether she will be good or not. I am waiting for the movie to come out and will make my judgment afterwards.


Perfectly stated. Maybe there were actual tryouts for this movie. Of course, we should all wait until we see the movie before judging it.

 
 Posted:   Apr 1, 2023 - 11:09 AM   
 By:   ibelin   (Member)

Grande's singing persona and looks also work against her for this role - her singing persona is hyper-sexualized and her face looks tough and assertive with flatter features. Bailey's persona is none of that and her facial features and rounded cheekbones give her a more innocent, sweet look that fits the character. If you've ever seen interviews with Halle Bailey she also comes across just as sweet, in contrast Ariana Grande occurs much more aggressively - there's no way that's going to go over in the room.

Yes, virtually all famous female pop singers nowadays are hyper-sexualized. I've listened to some of her songs in the past but haven't watched any of the music videos. Nor have I watched any of her interviews. I am just saying that it would have been (somewhat) less absurd to cast someone like her. She was simply the first to come to mind. There are probably more 'wholesome' options out there, but I wouldn't know.

I guess the only answer to our problems is that a Little Mermaid film didn't need to be made at all.

That concludes my rant.

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 1, 2023 - 12:36 PM   
 By:   Mephariel   (Member)

The main reason why Heath Ledger was criticized is that he wasn't Jack Nicholson, who was the best Joker at the time. Ledger was also criticized because he didn't look the part; but the Joker, who wears a costume, is defined by his personality. So as Ledger's acting shows, he was actually made for the role—as many, many, many other people will attest.

Right, which is why we should at least wait until the movie comes out before judging Bailey right? Like you said, there is more to a role than physical traits.

This is embarrassing on my part. That's what I get for not keeping up with the names of actors. Halle Berry is Catwoman. Halle Bailey is the mermaid. They have similar names. Even if Bailey is a singer, the final decision to cast her as Ariel had little to do with her singing and acting abilities, I'll tell you that. I had listened to her singing voice in one of this thread's videos before writing my previous post, and it was atrocious.

That is just your conjuncture. Nothing more, nothing less.

Who is the perfect Ariel? I don't know. As my mix-up shows, I am not savvy when it comes to actors. I am not a casting director, but off the top of my head Ariana Grande would have been a good fit: She's still relatively young, she's way better than Bailey at singing, and she has more acting experience than her. (Her first name even shares the first three letters with Ariel. big grin) She has a 'modern' vibe (for better or for worse) and would have brought in tons of money for Disney. Casting is a difficult affair, however, so maybe it wasn't possible to get her (if she was even considered). A casting director would be able to pull way more names out of a hat than I could.

Again, this goes back to values right? Ariana Grande is 29 years old and maybe they felt she was too old to play Ariel. Who knows. I also found it curious people have issues with race when it comes to Bailey but not with the ethnicity of Grande. Grande is Italian, not Danish and she looks nothing like Ariel in the animated film either.

Halle Bailey clearly is not succeeding in her role. When I use the word 'progressivism', I am referring to the sheer nonsense that is being shoved down our throats not just by Hollywood but by the entire mainstream media. Is 'progressivism' the best word to describe it? I think so, because the titular myth of modernity is the idea of 'progress'. 'Woke' is another good word.

The movie isn't even out yet and Bailey clearly didn't succeed?

And I found it amusing that you found "racism" to be a meaningless word but not "woke." Everything is woke according to certain population on the internet.

The animated version of 'The Little Mermaid' wasn't faithful to the original Danish fairy tale because the latter was a literary fairy tale, not a musical. Ariel wasn't even in the original fairy tale; it was an unnamed mermaid (who was described as white, by the way). The only things in common between the two are the title and some plot elements. That hardly makes the animated version an adaptation. Now Disney is distorting the fairy tale even more by filling it with their woke nonsense.

So it is ok to make a creative choice one time, but not a second time? What kind of logic is that? Directors and producers make creative choices that deviated from the original story all the time. Jackson expanded Liv Tyler's role in LOTR because he felt there should be a stronger female presence. In Jurassic Park the book, Alan Grant loves kids, but in the film, he hates kids. In the Earthsea TV series, the entire cast was changed to white actors when the book described them as dark skinned. Also, you mentioned Grande right? So you think it is ok to make a creative choice to cast an Italian actress and not a black actress? So ethnicity doesn't matter, but race does?

A movie's being better than the book on which it is based (e.g., Fight Club) is almost always because it remained relatively faithful to the source material (while taking some liberties here and there) and just happened to be better incidentally.

But the original animated film wasn't faithful to the fairytale. And it turned out ok. And the general criticism of the Disney live action films is actually opposite of what you just posted. The Lion King was heavily criticized for doing nothing different than the animated version. Beauty and the Beast faced the same criticism. That is why most people called them pointless remakes.

Because people totally haven't been saying that Idris Elba would be, like, the BEST James Bond EVER. OMG!!! Yeah, right. roll eyes

There are hundreds of actor names being thrown around to play the next Bond and Elba is one of them. People think he would make a good Bond because he is masculine and ooze sex appeal. Again, I am sorry you can't think beyond race. Personally I think Elba is way too old.

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 1, 2023 - 2:08 PM   
 By:   joan hue   (Member)

https://movieweb.com/idris-elba-will-not-be-james-bond/

Read the above to see Elba's response to playing Bond. He wants to keep doing the Luther franchise. I think he is great actor who could have played Bond, but also, he is probably too old to start the Bond movies.

Lately, Bond rumors have been swirling around Aaron Taylor-Johnson.

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 1, 2023 - 2:43 PM   
 By:   WillemAfo   (Member)

I'm really not a fan of defining people's futures by their pasts. There are hundreds of light comic actors who have surprised us by being fine dramatic actors, and vice versa. (There are also certainly many who've shown their limitations when they've tried to stretch, of course.)

Is showrunning "Game of Thrones" different from showrunning "iCarly"? Well yeah, sure, just as showrunning "Barney and Friends" is different from showrunning "Teletubbies," and just as making an omelette is different from baking a cake. But the skill sets are very compatible and there's no reason to assume an intelligent person can't apply his learned skills from one to the other.


Of course people can do more than just what's on their resume. I'm explaining to the person who doesn't like the casting of Halle Bailey and suggested Ariana Grande instead, why Bailey has exactly the experience, look, and attitude needed far more than Ariana Grande and how Bailey's casting fits how Disney and the industry tends to cast people.

The industry is generally risk-averse and it's usually the exception to pull someone out of nowhere. Steven Spielberg is an exceptional director and cast the fantastic Rachel Zegler as the lead in "West Side Story" not only with her having approximately ZERO television and film credits but from an open casting call on Twitter, which is not typical for casting lead roles.

Disney tends to be more standard in their casting. Rob Marshall has directed mostly musical films and been very successful at it, including a few for Disney. He's a relatively safe choice for Disney to select as director. As I stated before from a casting perspective, there are lots of physical and attitudinal reasons why Halle Bailey better fits Ariel than Ariana Grande, not to mention that at the time of casting Bailey was 19 and Grande was already in her late 20s.

Anticipating another comment, yes actors act above and below their ages, but age does have an impact on one's POV and the industry does tend to cast fairly close to age, particularly with younger roles.

If people want to see Ariana Grande on film they can see her as Glinda in the upcoming "Wicked", which is a role that she would be far more suited for. Unlike "The Little Mermaid" it's an ensemble role in an ensemble piece with over 2x the number of songs than "The Little Mermaid".

 
 Posted:   Apr 5, 2023 - 9:57 AM   
 By:   Jason LeBlanc   (Member)

 
 Posted:   Apr 6, 2023 - 8:22 AM   
 By:   Jason LeBlanc   (Member)

‘The Little Mermaid’ Live-Action Film Modifies Song Lyrics To Include Consent

https://deadline.com/2023/04/the-little-mermaid-live-action-film-modifies-song-lyrics-include-consent-1235318933/

 
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