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 Posted:   Sep 28, 2005 - 1:52 AM   
 By:   markgso   (Member)

What fun!






10.) Willow = Robert Schumann’s 4th Symphony, 1st movement (the Willow theme, basically “re-timed”)


the _3rd_ (Rhenish), but we know what you meanwink


12.) Sneakers = heavily influenced by John Adams, Philip Glass and Steve Reich (minimalist music; 20th-century orchestral)


yeah, mainly a lot of Adams' Nixon in China; also, Arvo Part's Fratres (as I mentioned before), and John Williams' conspirators theme from JFK


13.) Titanic = Courage Under Fire, Enya’s Book of Days (both used in the temp)


and the good ol' ostinato from Capricorn One when the iceberg hits!


14.) Enemy at the Gates = John William’s Schindler’s List (which some people argue is taken from another symphony, although I can’t remember which one right now)


It's a doodle near the end of Mahler's 8th Symphony; first appeared in Horner in Apollo 13, when everyone's waiting to see if the crew's turned to potato chips at the end


-- Jon


the trumpet call from Apollo 13 was also in In Country, during one of the Viet Nam river fight flashbacks

the brass theme from the end of Wolfen gets reused (in a different orchestration) in Testament

most of the suspense/attack cues in Deadly Blessing consist of Omen II ripoffs

what else?

Ah, no one seems to have mentioned the finale theme from Shostakovich's 5th as the basis for Achilles' theme in a while.

party on...

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 28, 2005 - 2:04 AM   
 By:   markgso   (Member)



Admittedly, that cue is indeed inspired by Carmina Burana, but it's not lifting anything note for note. Horner isn't exactly the only film composer who has been inspired by Orff - it happens all the time.

>>At least in films like "Greystoke" and "Excalibur," the composers from whom the extra music got borrowed received a mention alongside that of the primary composer.


Another nice Carmina Burana knockoff is the big cue at the end of Maurice Jarre's Solar Crisis, and Braun Farnon (sp?) did an electronic one for Time Runner (with Mark Hammill) that got picked up all over the place, from sneak peeks of coming weeks' Star Trek episodes to lots of movie trailers, usually in a beefed up big orchestra and choir version. Of Course, Goldsmith does his own turn on 'Old' Fortuna for the last swordfight in First Knight. But getting back on topic, the old Silva Horner compilation had an earlier version of the Glory cue that very much _was_ a (nearly) note-for-note mockup of Orff. The end of the cue also manages to rip Britten's War Requiem.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 28, 2005 - 2:16 AM   
 By:   Bob S   (Member)

Without getting too judgemental, listen to the similarities here. Am I just imagining them?

Horner:

THE ROCKETEER = "The Wabash Cannon Ball"

TITANIC = "The Leaving of Liverpool" with just a dash of "The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald"

Williams:

HOOK = AMAZING STORIES with its swash buckled

THE PATRIOT = AMISTAD turned from a hymn to a march.

"Smallville" in SUPERMAN = the refrain from the main theme from COWBOYS

and perhaps most subtle of all

"Hedwig's Theme" from HARRY POTTER = THE IMPERIAL MARCH turned into a sinister waltz (don't take my word for it, compare them).

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 28, 2005 - 4:01 AM   
 By:   sergioleone   (Member)

Braveheart

3x3 eyes, Theme: "Kaoru Wada - Pai ~Bojou~"

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 28, 2005 - 5:36 AM   
 By:   gumdrops1   (Member)



I'd like to see specific details where John Williams did this. How far within Debussy's piece (the one you are not even sure of its name)? What are the track timings for the CLOSE ENCOUNTERS music you are speaking about? Does it just sound similar or is it exactly the same?



The music is Debussy's Afternoon of a Fawn. Listen to it and you'll hear CLOSE ENCOUNTERS. Period!

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 28, 2005 - 7:58 AM   
 By:   TerraEpon   (Member)

On the Braveheart note, Hisaishi's Princess Mononoke (2 years LATER, remember) sounds very similar...but that doesn't mean I don't enjoy it a hell of a lot.


-Joshua

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 28, 2005 - 9:54 AM   
 By:   Thor   (Member)

BOOOOOOOOOOOOORING!

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 28, 2005 - 10:51 AM   
 By:   sergioleone   (Member)

funny!!!

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 28, 2005 - 3:24 PM   
 By:   sergioleone   (Member)

help!
I just heard that EVEN the 4 NOTES THEME that he uses everywhere is not a original theme by him... where comes from? do you know? and the greatest question: On how many scores did he include this 4 notes theme?????

 
 Posted:   Sep 28, 2005 - 3:28 PM   
 By:   Moonie   (Member)

help!
I just heard that EVEN the 4 NOTES THEME that he uses everywhere is not a original theme by him... where comes from? do you know? and the greatest question: On how many scores did he include this 4 notes theme?????




I give up!!

sd

geesh

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 28, 2005 - 3:39 PM   
 By:   Mark Olivarez   (Member)

Horner's style has gotten so predictable that it's basically become boring and lazy to my ears. I've gotten rid of a good majority of his scores, especially those written after 1989.

There's just nothing really interesting or fresh about his music anymore.


 
 Posted:   Sep 28, 2005 - 3:49 PM   
 By:   Heath   (Member)

help!
I just heard that EVEN the 4 NOTES THEME that he uses everywhere is not a original theme by him... where comes from? do you know?


It's derived from Alexander Nevsky composed by Prokofiev.

Sorry, but the guy's a fucking joke (and I mean neither Mr Nevsky or Mr Prokofiev).

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 28, 2005 - 3:53 PM   
 By:   Roger Feigelson   (Member)



16.) Journey of Natty Gann = parts of Copland’s Appalachian Spring (or is it another Copland piece?)


-- Jon


This one also cribs liberally from Britten's Four Seas.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 28, 2005 - 6:18 PM   
 By:   TerraEpon   (Member)



It's derived from Alexander Nevsky composed by Prokofiev.



Er no, it's the opening to Rachmaninoff's 1st Symphony. I don't think it was in Nevsky, but Rach was many years earlier...

-Joshua

 
 Posted:   Sep 28, 2005 - 6:35 PM   
 By:   Damian   (Member)

Regarding 'the four notes'.I once heard/read that for a person to be guilty of plaigarism it has to be6/7(?) notes,aleast.Anyway go listen to Stravinsky's'The Rite Of Spring'.Everythings in that(especially sci-fi stuff).

 
 Posted:   Sep 28, 2005 - 6:49 PM   
 By:   Mr. Marshall   (Member)

Regarding 'the four notes'.I once heard/read that for a person to be guilty of plaigarism it has to be6/7(?) notes,aleast.Anyway go listen to Stravinsky's'The Rite Of Spring'.Everythings in that(especially sci-fi stuff).

Four notes is plagiarism?
Give me a break!

Anyone who has ever played/wrote music knows how absurd that statement is.

If you want to nail JH for copying you don't have to reach that low.

Bruce Marshall

 
 Posted:   Sep 28, 2005 - 8:19 PM   
 By:   Hadrian   (Member)

gumdrops1 wrote: The music is Debussy's Afternoon of a Fawn. Listen to it and you'll hear CLOSE ENCOUNTERS. Period!


I own 2 recordings of "Prelude to the Afternoon of a Fawn" and the original and expanded releases of CLOSE ENCOUNTERS and can detect no plagiarism on Williams part. Plagiarism is a very serious charge to make. Unless you can supply exact locations within the music, your argument is baseless.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 28, 2005 - 9:55 PM   
 By:   fmfan1   (Member)

I have enjoyed many of his scores as they have proven (to me) to be effective in supporting the films. However, I am very turned off by the extensive "influences."

Add: The main instrumental theme of An American Tail. It's Borodin's "In the Steppes of Central Asia."

 
 Posted:   Sep 29, 2005 - 12:07 AM   
 By:   Jon A. Bell   (Member)

Okay guys, I'm going to take this thread straight to hell. :-)

1.) A friend of mine (who shall remain nameless, although he's known to the higher-ups at FSM), pointed out to me years ago, that you can sing most of the lyrics of the "Gilligan's Island" theme song, to the main title music of "The Rocketeer." (It breaks down after a bit, but try it!)

2.) And I discovered (due to a flash of either brilliant insight or complete neural misfiring), that the lyrics to the old, cheesy cartoon "Hercules" can be sung, virtually in their entirety, to the main theme from "Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow." (In fact, it's damn near impossible now for me to listen to this score without those stupid lyrics coming to mind.)

There. Now I've infected you with this information, and you're gonna have to try to purge it from your memories. Heh, heh, heh...

-- Jon

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 29, 2005 - 1:10 AM   
 By:   Bob S   (Member)

. . . you can sing most of the lyrics of the "Gilligan's Island" theme song, to the main title music of "The Rocketeer." (It breaks down after a bit, but try it!)



No, no, no, no, no! The lyrics from "Gilligan's Island" are best sung with the melody to Led Zepp's "Stairway to Heaven."

 
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