So he's wrong and you're right...?! That's a bit presumptuous. I'll decide myself whether I like it or not, thank you very much.
What are you on about?
I listened to the suite and thought little of it. Peterproud suggested I give it more of a listen, so I put out a request for someone to recommend some tracks. Ant obliged. I listened to said tracks and didn't think much of them either, citing other's earlier comments.
End of.
Where you got this whole right or wrong BS, I don't know.
To be fair to spin, he just stated his opinion of the noted tracks. No one's right or wrong. You either like it or don't. I'm listening to it now and it's flavourful and fun. Quite old school sounding, in that Williams (the Indy films) and Goldsmith (Mummy) way. Nice to hear some clarity in the orchestration. Yes, it's a bit too mickey mousy at times, but way better than programmed chugga chugga chugga to me. It may improve with further listens too, or when heard in context. It took me ages to really get into his FANTASTIC BEASTS & NUTCRACKER scores, but I love them now.
To be fair to spin, he just stated his opinion of the noted tracks. No one's right or wrong. You either like it or don't. I'm listening to it now and it's flavourful and fun. Quite old school sounding, in that Williams (the Indy films) and Goldsmith (Mummy) way. Nice to hear some clarity in the orchestration. Yes, it's a bit too mickey mousy at times, but way better than programmed chugga chugga chugga to me. It may improve with further listens too, or when heard in context. It took me ages to really get into his FANTASTIC BEASTS & NUTCRACKER scores, but I love them now.
Yep, no right or wrong here. It's miles better than most droning scores we get nowadays but it is mickey mousey and frantic at times. Did someone say musical noodling or something to that effect? There's hints of themes and when they play it's awesome. For some reason the themes are more motifs and usually don't play out. The quieter tracks are actually more enjoyable. I'm hoping it grows on me. I consider it a good score to have on in the background as I do other things. It's more enjoyable if I'm not concentrating on every note.
Not a bad score on first listening.... but it does suffer from that "pinched" recording quality that plagues so many JNH scores. Now listening to Mychael Danna's Stillwater which sounds wide and open, despite being small and intimate.
Not a bad score on first listening.... but it does suffer from that "pinched" recording quality that plagues so many JNH scores. Now listening to Mychael Danna's Stillwater which sounds wide and open, despite being small and intimate.
Agreed, but it seems a little better than some in the last 10 years at least?
Same here - JNH, unfortunately, has said in an interview that he would not like to go back to his earlier style anymore. Probably a necessity to get hired these days. But the last score of his I really liked was THE LADY IN THE WATER.
Well, last year's A HIDDEN LIFE was one of the best scores of his entire career (and by far the best score of the year), but that's not really a genre film. Perhaps he's more inspired, and has more creative wriggle room, outside the mainstream.
I could not get past the similarities to his score for THE VILLAGE.
Yeah, I've struggled with HIDDEN LIFE for the exact same reason. It just sounds like sub standard VILLAGE out-takes. It's not a bad score. But whenever I play it, I just wanna go listen to THE VILLAGE instead.
New trailer today. The movie could go either way, and the trailer music is anonymous mass-produced gunk, but about three-quarters through, around 1:25 or so, a swashbuckling jig-type melody—utterly anachronistic to the musical proceedings thus far—gets briefly woven into the Zimmerment. Could this somehow be a snippet of a tune JNH wrote for the score? It's a long shot and it doesn't make much sense in context (since it pointedly doesn't play over the title a few seconds later), but it makes zero sense if it's nothing. See what you think:
I was right! I just started listening, but a version of that theme from the long-ago trailer is indeed in there!
The score is kind of all over the place which isn't helped by its wall-of-sound approach to the orchestra. It's weird because at times it sounds like it's trying to copy John Williams action music while at other times it feels like a pastiche of Williams, but then elsewhere it's kind of making fun of early Disney mickey-mousing music like what Randy Newman did with TOY STORY or Alan Menken in MERMAID and BEAST, but nowhere near as consistent or intelligent. It's like it's trying to be nostalgic, but for what? Williams' music that its copying was HIS take on nostalgia for the "swashbuckling adventures" of the 30s and 40s but made entirely his own. So it's like it's saying it's nostalgic for John Williams' nostalgic interpretation of "swashbuckling adventures". Oddly enough JNH did just fine with WATERWORLD. But the problem nowadays is the orchestras are too packed. This music is crowded with every instrument group, everything layered together in noise - whereas Williams' STAR WARS and INDIANA JONES music used the orchestra quite judiciously (we discussed this in a different thread, attempting to analyze how Williams' music changed from the original Star Wars trilogy to the prequels).
Anyways, let me know when this thread is ready to hear my pitch for the "Matterhorn" movie starring The Rock.
My only issue is the mickey mousey music. Again I think he took this approach because the film was edited in a brisk fashion. Sub Attack suffers from this approach. But there are some fantastic cues like Underwater Puzzle and Petal Negotiations. These are epic JNH cues. I also love the main adventure theme its just not used enough in the score. JNH has always been bombastic in his approach, it works for him when its largely thematic.
You ever found yourself surrounded by a maelstrom of hyperactive kids/dogs (what's the difference?) screaming their lungs out chasing one another around the room while trying to carry on a polite conversation with the owner(s)?
That's Jungle Cruise.
Have you ever wondered what a nondescript adventure score in the Williams/Broughton/McNeely/Debney mold that avoided any form of copyright infringement as output by an AI might sound like?
My only issue is the mickey mousey music. Again I think he took this approach because the film was edited in a brisk fashion. Sub Attack suffers from this approach. But there are some fantastic cues like Underwater Puzzle and Petal Negotiations. These are epic JNH cues. I also love the main adventure theme its just not used enough in the score. JNH has always been bombastic in his approach, it works for him when its largely thematic.
The film itself is as hyperactive as the music for sure.
The two cues you mentioned I did notice because they START really nicely, especially “Petal Negotiations”. But they devolve very quickly into chaos. I can’t really tell what JNH’s goal was here. I think he is great at moody orchestral stuff, which is everywhere in his early works like THE FUGITIVE, the quieter parts of WATERWORLD, THE VILLAGE…
But apart from the main theme for WATERWORLD, I think he’s doing almost a “Zimmer-wall-of-sound” approach to the action music, so it just sounds cacophonous. I’ve said it before but the most enjoyable scores to me have a contour and evolution overall. It’s hard to find the main thread of this one.
I'm surprised that with all the comparisons going around there aren't more comparisons with JNH himself. This has so many musical gestures that are very much him, in the same category as Atlantis, King Kong, Dinosaur, Maleficent, etc, and like many of his animation/family adventure scores there aren't necessarily through-composed set pieces so much as a handful of catchy motifs that really shine at times. And this is VERY tuneful compared with some of his output!
I'm surprised that with all the comparisons going around there aren't more comparisons with JNH himself. This has so many musical gestures that are very much him, in the same category as Atlantis, King Kong, Dinosaur, Maleficent, etc, and like many of his animation/family adventure scores there aren't necessarily through-composed set pieces so much as a handful of catchy motifs that really shine at times. And this is VERY tuneful compared with some of his output!
Rayas' Dragon theme is also instantly recognizable.
To me, this score's distillation of "adventure music" from other film scores reminds me of the family guy episode where Peter hums the opening song for "Indy's First Adventure" from THE LAST CRUSADE. Like, it's an approximation of good adventure music, but in a not-good and unserious way:
I think it's a solid score. I'm hearing more distinct melodies—and distinct melodic moments—than I did in RAYA or most of his 2010s scores, the first FANTASTIC BEASTS being the exception. A lot of it is derivative of his 2000s golden age, but only in the same general way that Williams' heroic music of his golden age could be said to be—i.e., not enough to make it an issue for me on album. "A Steamer to Brazil" and "Jungle Cruise" are the most entertaining consecutive four minutes of film music I've heard in some time.
I’ve listened to everything you’ve all said but I think it’s great. Best score of the year so far.
The action music is some of the best I’ve heard in years. Shut up about it being a Williams-pastiche. That’s the whole point… it’s supposed be like that! I mean, you’re not wrong but why is that a problem?! This is seriously good music. I’d rather listen to this than most of the drivel being poured out recently.
I just started listening, but a version of that theme from the long-ago trailer is indeed in there! 
