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Posted: |
Mar 22, 2020 - 4:07 PM
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By: |
Thor
(Member)
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But how much "less" can art (yes, Morder's work is art, calm yo'self) be taken subjectively before anyone of varying repute decrees it to be objective? Analytics are nice and all, but in the end, art boils down to a subjective framework of interpretation.
I never disagreed with this. But again, analysis/interpretation is a very different act than just shouting from the rooftops whether you like something or not. There are degrees of subjectivity. Analyzing something requires focussing on intentions, and looking at it from the artwork's perspective. It's still subjective, as is all interpretation, but it's LESS subjective, hence MORE objective than just mere preference. I would think this is common sense.
After Tony took his bloody swan dive into the indoor pool, the musical phrasing truly does sound like Peter Frampton bailed and just shouted WOM WOM WOM over and over again in his vocalizer. What I'd like to know is what was going through DiPalma's mind when he approved this?
Haven't seen the film in ages, so I can't comment on that scene in particular off the top of my head, but I think both film and score is a masterpiece. The mythological fatalism of Tony's theme, the 'yuppiness' of the 80s beats, the Gina theme that is both alluring and tragic at the same time. Just fantastic all around!
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How about this one:
Maurice Jarre's FIREFOX !?
Clumsy and dull electronic score in the first 2/3 parts of the movie...to eventually turn to first degree childish patriotic orchestral score in the last part...
A total failure IMHO.
This Clint Eastwood cold war vehicule deserved better.
I wish it had been scored by Lalo Schifrin, in THE FOURTH PROTOCOL style mode.
Don't misunderstand me, I have nothing against the composer.
Maurice Jarre is not my favorite composer, by very far, all right, but he anyway delivered some great epic scores like PASSAGE TO INDIA, CROSSED SWORDS or nice western scores like VILLA RIDES....
He's cool by me, but his synths do leave a lot to be desired, with delightful exceptions like Witness and Enemy Mine. Although I couldn't declare any score he did illfitting.
It's been ages since I've seen Firefox, and given the record, I'd still like to "rediscover" it.
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But how much "less" can art (yes, Morder's work is art, calm yo'self) be taken subjectively before anyone of varying repute decrees it to be objective? Analytics are nice and all, but in the end, art boils down to a subjective framework of interpretation.
I never disagreed with this. But again, analysis/interpretation is a very different act than just shouting from the rooftops whether you like something or not. There are degrees of subjectivity. Analyzing something requires focussing on intentions, and looking at it from the artwork's perspective. It's still subjective, as is all interpretation, but it's LESS subjective, hence MORE objective than just mere preference. I would think this is common sense.
It truly is not and I hope should never be, for it is easily corrupted to serve one's own ego. Even amongst the educated, there must be further room for education, such as the mere notice of how a work affects others in different ways beyond its origin. Granted, an opinion can be detailed within an inch of its life, but it still remains an opinion. Whether someone is shouting about watermelons or decreeing the holy will of objective fact as immutable law enforced by several MegaCity Judges and Carousel Sandmen, art needs to live and grow beyond this, for it is the product of imagination which exceeds reality's incapacity to achieve truth beyond fact (or dogma, in this case). It's what keeps a work relatable, beyond those who worship it (HOW CAN NOT YOU LIKE THIS!) and those who detest its very existence (THIS RUINS EVERYTHING!). How can art evolve beyond the constraints evoked by individual and committee alike without its own continued exploration of what makes me "me", you "you", and us "us"?
After Tony took his bloody swan dive into the indoor pool, the musical phrasing truly does sound like Peter Frampton bailed and just shouted WOM WOM WOM over and over again in his vocalizer. What I'd like to know is what was going through DiPalma's mind when he approved this?
Haven't seen the film in ages, so I can't comment on that scene in particular off the top of my head, but I think both film and score is a masterpiece. The mythological fatalism of Tony's theme, the 'yuppiness' of the 80s beats, the Gina theme that is both alluring and tragic at the same time. Just fantastic all around!
And I'm glad you feel that way (which, in a way, proves my point), but for "me" it was in spite of Moroder's insistence to clog up the works with his simpleton-ish obviousness, to the point of parody (it would even strain to fit a Mel Brooks version). DiPalma was doing just fine extolling those themes through his own savvy, but it was the greatest of struggles to gain that sympathy through the mire of whatever tried and failed to match it.... subjectively speaking. It's the cinematic equivalent of "The Funeral of Queen Mary" played by a slide whistle & kazoo ensemble at a wake (okay, maybe a clown funeral would work).
PS: To keep this from sounding like an allout attack on the Giorgmeister, I'm not against him as a person. I'm sure he makes excellent quiche.
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Posted: |
Mar 24, 2020 - 1:25 AM
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By: |
Thor
(Member)
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It truly is not and I hope should never be, for it is easily corrupted to serve one's own ego. Even amongst the educated, there must be further room for education, such as the mere notice of how a work affects others in different ways beyond its origin. Granted, an opinion can be detailed within an inch of its life, but it still remains an opinion. Whether someone is shouting about watermelons or decreeing the holy will of objective fact as immutable law enforced by several MegaCity Judges and Carousel Sandmen, art needs to live and grow beyond this, for it is the product of imagination which exceeds reality's incapacity to achieve truth beyond fact (or dogma, in this case). It's what keeps a work relatable, beyond those who worship it (HOW CAN NOT YOU LIKE THIS!) and those who detest its very existence (THIS RUINS EVERYTHING!). How can art evolve beyond the constraints evoked by individual and committee alike without its own continued exploration of what makes me "me", you "you", and us "us"?
That's one of the more non-sensical rants I've read in a while. Are you sure it was written under the influence of a little 'something something'? 
As for Moroder's SCARFACE, I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.
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It truly is not and I hope should never be, for it is easily corrupted to serve one's own ego. Even amongst the educated, there must be further room for education, such as the mere notice of how a work affects others in different ways beyond its origin. Granted, an opinion can be detailed within an inch of its life, but it still remains an opinion. Whether someone is shouting about watermelons or decreeing the holy will of objective fact as immutable law enforced by several MegaCity Judges and Carousel Sandmen, art needs to live and grow beyond this, for it is the product of imagination which exceeds reality's incapacity to achieve truth beyond fact (or dogma, in this case). It's what keeps a work relatable, beyond those who worship it (HOW CAN NOT YOU LIKE THIS!) and those who detest its very existence (THIS RUINS EVERYTHING!). How can art evolve beyond the constraints evoked by individual and committee alike without its own continued exploration of what makes me "me", you "you", and us "us"?
That's one of the more non-sensical rants I've read in a while. Are you sure it was written under the influence of a little 'something something'?
I'll take that as an agreement.
As for Moroder's SCARFACE, I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.
And this as an admission.
Just trust me, there are enough "scholars" roaming around telling everyone what and how to like or hate something in the name of "objectivism".
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Like Thor I am struggling to find "unfit" scores -- scores I don't like, sure, but "unfit"? Perhaps the song score that was imposed on "Jack the Giant Killer". The new song score the film's owners wanted to put in place, in purely practical terms, didn't fit the film as edited, so they reedited the whole film, arranged dialogue, imposed songs and came up with a version that "fit" the song score. But the new song score version did end up with a score that fitted it!
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Just goes to show...I liked Dunkirk and its score,
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