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Off the top of my head... here is an incomplete list of the unreleased, unrepetitive cues from FOTR that I personally am looking forward to hearing in the expanded release...
1. The film version of the opening cue.
2. Inside Bilbo's house.
3. Bilbo's birthday party (will it be on the release though?)
4. Journey to Weathertop (after Strider joins the group).
5. Complete battle of Weathertop.
6. Expanded Council of Elrond featuring the arrivals and the first statement of the Gondor theme in the entire trilogy.
7. Leaving Rivendell, expanded edition cue.
8. Theme for the pass of Carhadras - totally unrepresented on the initial release.
9. Attack of the watcher - also completely unrepresented heretofore.
10. Gandalf talks to Frodo about Gollum inside Moria, including the "all we have to do" moment... my personal favorite moment of this entire awesome score, previously unreleased.
11. Troll fight.
12. Expanded Khazad Dum cue with more Dwarvish choir and the music for the long shot of the Fellowship running over the bridge.
13. Boromir talks about Gondor with Aragorn, the whole "white tower of Icthalion" cue.
14. Expanded final fight with the Uruk Hai, another manjor unreleased highlight.
Anyone else should feel free to contribute to the list!
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And happy 100, expanded FOTR thread!
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Posted: |
Sep 19, 2005 - 2:49 AM
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By: |
SchiffyM
(Member)
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Well, that's a judgement call; for some of us, including myself, a held note that goes on for more than a second can indeed be worth hearing. You might as well say a whole score isn't good, and therefore shouldn't be released; you always have the option of not buying it if it is, but the people whose opinion of the music differs from yours don't have the option of getting it if it doesn't come out.
Yes, held notes for more than a second can be worth hearing. I'm not on a vendetta against held notes. This was a quick and easy example, but not an absolute one.
And yes, it's a judgment call. Of course it's a judgment call! Everything about this is a judgment call! I'm explaining my preference, for me, for my taste, for my life, when somebody responded with disbelief that anybody could possibly want less than the entire score. I would never tell anybody else what their choice should be, but I was telling you mine.
I've never produced an album, and likely never will, so never fear that I will ever rob you of music you want. What do I say to someone who wants all the music, you ask? I say to them "Buy full score albums! You will like them more than I will!"
As for the benefits of repeated listenings to a lengthy CD to really delve into what I like... well, I get this in theory, but the fact is, for my life, this is just not going to happen. I have a job (often 60 hour weeks or more), a wife, and three kids. There simply isn't time in my life to listen to as much music as I'd like to.
None of which is supposed to convince you to change what you want, because I do understand what you want, and that's fine. All I want is for you to understand why I might want something else without being insane.
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*SIGHS*
Y'know, I'm a simple guy with a simple outlook on life and possibly a very simple naive way of looking at things, and I apologise if my simplicity makes me look an idiot here! However, can you guys remember the "good old days" when, if we were lucky, a soundtrack album was released on vinyl and, if we were lucky, it might have stretched to what? 40-45 mins of music?
Can you remember those days of hungrily awaiting with voracious appetite the next possible release of your favourite composer's latest score? Buying it, clutching it in your trembling hands and belting home to ensconce yourself beside the record player and listening intently to each expression of orchestral nuance that your musical idol had contrived to put on sheet music and expertly conducted the players in creating a pleasing wall of sound? Remember those days?! They were barren days were they not?
What have we got today? Music created to our hearts content often 70-80 minutes worth! Scores released like confetti and what gratitude is extended? Little or none! NO - we'd rather bitch! We'd rather moan about the "packaging" or its "too much music" or it's a "rip off", or "they're screwing us for more money"!
LORD GOD ALMIGHTY - WHAT THE HELL IS WRONG WITH YOU PEOPLE?
We (mostly) live in a free and democratic society that largely works on the free market economic principle - if you want it and you're prepared to pay for it, it's yours! NO ONE is FORCING any of you wet blankets to buy this collection. NO ONE is FORCING you to listen to it, and I for one am sorely pissed off with the lack of gratitude displayed by an overly pampered generation who's only mantra is: "give me, give me, give me"!
I love the fact that I am "allowed" to hear almost every note that Howard Shore in his sublime creativity put on musical staves - music that came through stress and worry and dear knows what else emotion he went through to create a notable composition that constitutes the scores to 3 films that may not ever last as long as HIS music.
I love music. I especially love film music, and I for one am grateful that more and more of this genre of music is being released and it has grown in stature from the contempt that was usually meeted out to filmscore proponents in the "good old days".
Maybe part of MY problem is the way I listen to filmscores. You see, I was brought up in a small back water village in rural Ireland; there was no such thing as a multiplex! The local cinema was a run down flea pit that really should have been condemned and was eventually shut down. However, once in a while, usually after saving, I'd treat myself to a balcony seat in this musty old place and watch the "big" films long after their inital release and be wooed by the music. That's how I got into filmscores, but often I never saw the movies - they didn't come, but I'd get the score (eventually) and listen to the music as it was presented on the album. So yes, I learned to appreciate scores as "stand alone" entities - no moving image to marry the sound to.
So all this palaver about divorcing score from moving image is utter tosh in my opinion, it's just a state of mind - a wanton opt out of credible engagement of the intellect and soul with what is being conveyed by the composer.
However, I digress! I am delighted and estatic about these releases and will add them with pride and affection to my other 3 CD's from the LOTR trilogy. No one is forcing me but, because I love film music and especially more from a cherished score I will gladly part with few paltry £'s, or $'s if you prefer, to listen to music that will bring me pleasure that can't be measured in terms of money.
To you nay-sayers I would say: you've never had it so good, but the sad thing is that you don't even realise how well off you really are.
I feel sorry for you.
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well said.
Your words brought a tear to my eye.
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My friend, you do bring back memories. Getting on my bicycle and pedaling as fast as possible to my local record store and trying to find Jaws, Superman, Close Encounters, Moonraker and Star Wars on LP. Then later, going nuts over the Trek movie scores. I graduated to CD, but the magic had left. For some reason, having more money and buying soundtrakcs in smaller media seemed less satisfying. I kept the majority of my LPs, even when a CD came out of that same LP. At least, I can still listen to Temple of Doom.
I am a supporter of having as much music as possible upon release of the album. Certainly many shorter albums are great experiences. Total Recall, for example was a perfect initial album. But when the expanded CD came out, I was thrilled to have some of the cues I really liked from the film but didn't make it to the CD initially. The Sand Pebbles rerecording did not impress me in the slightest and I wondered why this score was considered so wonderful. When Varese put out the expanded, complete score, I heard a clip and went batty for it. It's now my favorite Goldsmith album.
And saying "I heard it in the film and did or didn't like the missing cues" isn't the same thing to me either. I've heard a number of scores that sound better divorced from the dialog and sound effects, and vice versa. Sure, it's possible for a complete score album to be daunting and slow going and perhaps a better album presentation is only a fraction of the score. It depends, I guess on the score and the listener. But to just dismiss it without listening to it as presented seems like voluntary ignorance. The LOTR box sets might very well be too much to bear (I mean, how often to I really listen to the entire 2 CD set of King of Kings?), but as they say "you never know til you find out."
It's like coming to the US, reaching New York City and getting robbed. You then turn around and go home saying "I hated America and I saw all I needed to to get a good understanding of the rest of it." Well, you really didn't, cause you only saw a little and the rest were pictures in a book. Gotta see it all in person. Same, for me, goes with soundtracks. Because if I went by the 1983 LP release of Return of the Jedi and skipped the 2 CD rerelease, I'd never have gotten some really great music.
Not expecting to cheange any minds here, just saying how I think.
Today is really a great time to be a film music lover. Scores of scores are being released weekly. It'll peter out in time, so let's just bask in it.
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Frankly I buy what I want, don't really listen to other's opinions in regards to album length and find that I enjoy film music alot more when I stay away from the message boards.
I'm excited about this release and wish all scores could get the same treatment.
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I am very happy that we're getting these releases...
However, the question still remains, what format is the DVD going to be in? Are the film scores being presented in Dolby Digital or DTS?
I doubt that the disc is going to be DVD-A because I don't think that one can fit three hours worth of music on one DVD-A disc.
I could be wrong, though.
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I am very happy that we're getting these releases...
However, the question still remains, what format is the DVD going to be in? Are the film scores being presented in Dolby Digital or DTS?
I doubt that the disc is going to be DVD-A because I don't think that one can fit three hours worth of music on one DVD-A disc.
I could be wrong, though.
Would the DTS on it be a first for a film score only DVD?
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Would the DTS on it be a first for a film score only DVD?
No... Titanic had one, I believe.
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You're right about the Titanic DTS CD. I don't think that any other film scores have been issued in that format; I don't think so, though. I've been following multichannel soundtrack albums for a while now.
However, the Titanic DTS CD was exactly that, a CD that had DTS instead of the standard linear PCM of a regular CD. Any CD player plugged into a DTS capable amplifier via one of the digital outputs (optical, coaxial) would be able to play it. The TOC information is almost identical to that of a regular CD. I also think that the capacity of this format is the same as a regular CD (around 80 minutes).
This is listed as a DVD. So technically, it would be a different format.
Oh, the DVD-Audio issue of the Morgan/Stromberg recording of Erich Wolfgang Korngold's The Adventures of Robin Hood has a DTS track as well as the advanced resolution surround. Incidentally, I think that this release is a must-have if you're into excellent film music and good sound. A really classy release.
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Posted: |
Sep 20, 2005 - 8:30 AM
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By: |
Thor
(Member)
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Hey Greg, old pal, I couldn't agree more with you!! We ARE being spoiled rotten these days, and although I'm only 27 years old, I know the "dark times" that you speak of. In fact, we are so spoiled these days that it has become almost TOO MUCH! EVERYTHING is getting a release and MOST OF IT gets an expanded and complete presentation. There's no room for sitting back and enjoying the treasures that come out anymore (of course, you don't HAVE TO buy the things that keep getting released, but you get kinda frustrated just knowing about THEIR EXISTANCE).
I have, in fact, been thinking about writing an article for FSM on how ungrateful some of us are and how great a time we live in in terms of soundtrack releases (all major films get a soundtrack release, there are rereleases of old albums, premiere releases and rerecordings of old classics etc.).
However, the immense gratitude (and also frustration, because I don't have the time and money to keep up) I have for the current state of affairs does not prevent me from having a critical opinion on one particular aspect or "trend" that is part of this, namely the "complete and chronological" issue. One thing is to be grateful for the time of soundtrack releases that we live in, which I certainly am. Another is to accept the IDEOLOGY that drives many of these releases, i.e. that the FILM should be used a point-of-departure for releasing the music. THAT I can't agree with, and I have to express that opinion whenever a major "complete and chronological" soundtrack event pops up, like this expanded LOTR: FOTR ordeal. It's not bitching, the way I see it. It's just a sigh that film music is suddenly seen to be a byproduct of the film rather than an independent musical odyssey.
But for heaven's sake, people, please buy a trillion LOTR: FOTR boxed sets and enjoy them to your heart's content.
NP: STAR WARS: THE PHANTOM MENACE (Williams, single-disc version, of course)
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Posted: |
Sep 20, 2005 - 4:12 PM
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By: |
Olivier
(Member)
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Oh, the DVD-Audio issue of the Morgan/Stromberg recording of Erich Wolfgang Korngold's The Adventures of Robin Hood has a DTS track as well as the advanced resolution surround. Incidentally, I think that this release is a must-have if you're into excellent film music and good sound. A really classy release.
Waitwaitwaitwaiwait--
The DVD-Audio edition of The Adventures of Mark Twain features a DTS track as well?
I was terribly dismayed my SACD player couldn't play DVD-A, thus such splendid scores as this one, which I've been greatly enjoying since its release.
Now, if there is a DTS tracks, I'm going to order it, since my player is actually a DTS-compatible DVD/SACD player.
Is this the only instance, or do DVD-A usually come with DTS as well?
I can'( believe i hadn't noticed it: it is clearly stated on the cover ( http://store.acousticsounds.com/browse_detail.cfm?Title_ID=15031 ).
One more time, just to be sure: it will play as a regular DTS DVD on my "non DVD-A but DTS DVD / SACD player", right?
Or can it be played only if the player is DVD-A compatible?
Lest I'm still not clear: does the player need to be DVD-A compatible to access the DTS layer/data and play it, or will a regular DTS DVD be able to play it (even if it's SACD comaptible)?
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Greg Phillips, you're my hero.
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Yes, the DVD-Audio discs of The Adventures of Robin Hood and The Adventures of Mark Twain have 1509 kb/s DTS tracks that can be played in any equipped DVD player. However, I believe both discs were also issued as SACDs.
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