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I tried Legend again and I'm sorry but the orchestration makes it sound like half the orchestra are drunk.
I hear some ST:TMP, NIMH and Poltergeist in here and I'd rather just listen to those far superior scores.
Maybe you put on the Tangerine Dream album by mistake?
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Posted: |
May 11, 2021 - 3:11 AM
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By: |
Nono
(Member)
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Music really ought not to be a competition anyhow and I should have avoided qualifying the worth of Jerry's Legend in comparison to Ravel or Bartok. But as I mentioned earlier, I doubt even Jerry would feel comfortable comparing himself to those giants of the 20th century.
Two friends of mine interviewed Jerry Goldsmith in 1995 during the recording sessions for POWDER and the composer was very humble, as he always used to be.
He would have probably been more upset than flattered to be considered the equal of Ravel and Bartok, indeed. He didn't particularly like fans.
Ravel and Bartok didn't come from nowhere and were influenced by the music of their time and by a longer musical tradition, but as soon of their own style matured, we can't say anymore they sound like X or Y (or just here or there, but never as a whole). And they didn't use "techniques", except maybe when they were learning music, while some characteristics of their music became "techniques" for others.
But as you said, music is not a competition, and classical and film music don't share the same purpose.
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Solium: I tried Legend again and I'm sorry but the orchestration makes it sound like half the orchestra are drunk. I hear some ST:TMP, NIMH and Poltergeist in here and I'd rather just listen to those far superior scores.
You do understand the music for the goblins is intended to be queasy and unsettling?
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Unsurprisingly, in the end it always seems to come down to who's got the biggest dick.
Hello, did someone call? 
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"He didn't particularly like fans"
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Haha!
THAT'S the understatement of the year!
The stories I heard, from the old MFTM and Legend Society days, are hilarious.
His disdain for The Fans is LEGEND-ary!
He probably preferred the music critics over the fans
Two of my biggest childhood heroes hated us. Jerry Goldsmith and Obi-Wan Kenobi. 
What a bunch of cranky old farts.
Someone who was friends with Jerry Goldsmith once told me the following story. He was having lunch with Goldsmith, when a young guy passed their table, and stopped to tell the composer how much he admired his work. Goldsmith thanked him, but as soon as this fan left, Goldsmith rolled his eyes dismissively.
What made this different from the usual "fan interaction" was that the person who paused to speak to Goldsmith was not some "groupie" but a young, up-and-coming Hollywood composer, who already had some decent credits.
This person who told me this story explained that, for decades, Goldsmith had no idea his work was appreciated by anyone beyond his colleagues in the business. Then in the 80s, the Goldsmith Society appeared, people started sending him letters (and a few weirdos started pestering him). It was all relatively sudden, and he never quite knew how to deal with it, and whether this fan following was for real, or just a passing thing.
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Posted: |
May 11, 2021 - 9:16 AM
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By: |
Solium
(Member)
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"He didn't particularly like fans"
---------------------
Haha!
THAT'S the understatement of the year!
The stories I heard, from the old MFTM and Legend Society days, are hilarious.
His disdain for The Fans is LEGEND-ary!
He probably preferred the music critics over the fans
Two of my biggest childhood heroes hated us. Jerry Goldsmith and Obi-Wan Kenobi.
What a bunch of cranky old farts.
Someone who was friends with Jerry Goldsmith once told me the following story. He was having lunch with Goldsmith, when a young guy passed their table, and stopped to tell the composer how much he admired his work. Goldsmith thanked him, but as soon as this fan left, Goldsmith rolled his eyes dismissively.
What made this different from the usual "fan interaction" was that the person who paused to speak to Goldsmith was not some "groupie" but a young, up-and-coming Hollywood composer, who already had some decent credits.
This person who told me this story explained that, for decades, Goldsmith had no idea his work was appreciated by anyone beyond his colleagues in the business. Then in the 80s, the Goldsmith Society appeared, people started sending him letters (and a few weirdos started pestering him). It was all relatively sudden, and he never quite knew how to deal with it, and whether this fan following was for real, or just a passing thing.
I certainly understand older artist and celebrities not understanding such fandom. It was something reserved for pop stars. I think pop culture fandom generally started with Star Trek TOS in the late 60's and early 70's. I also understand some artists just want to do their work and not become "celebrities". It was decent of Goldsmith to appease the fan with a polite "Thank you" even if he really didn't care for the praise.
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Jerry Goldsmith was a great "classical" composer, as were Ennio Morricone and Bernard Herrmann, or Miklos Ròzsa, to name just a few.
I think it they are not really to be compared to "classical" composers, as they are "classical" composers whose main output was film music.
"Classical" music (there are several definitions of the term one can use though, of course. I prefer Leonard Bernstein's, that "classical" music is basically music written down in a fixed form, so that the composition, and in consequence the composer, is the "primary" musical voice that is heard, unlike in, say, jazz or pop music, where the performer is often the "primary" musical voice that is heard) is written for many forms. The classical symphony grew out of the concerto (grosso), which in turn grew out of other instrumental compositions. Beethoven expanded the symphony and brought the chorus to it (so he included elements of the cantata), and Mahler included songs. Strauss wrote tone poems (based on books), Stravinsky ballets, Wagner "Gesamtkunstwerke" (a term he used to distinguish his works from "operas"). Since the beginning of the 20th century, film has proven a fertile ground for a lot of "classical" composers. Film music of course is related to incidental theatrical music, to opera music (particular Wagner), and to ballet, but can be any type of music: classical, jazz, rock/pop, folk music, whatever...
But there are classical composers, like Jerry Goldsmith, Bernard Herrmann, etc. whose body of work mainly lies within film, just as there are other composers who concentrated on just one "type" of music. Mahler, for example, basically wrote only symphonies and song cycles, Wagner and Verdi only operas. Sure, Verdi also wrote a Requiem, just like Herrmann also wrote an opera, etc., but they still had their main focus, and their main focus opera (Verdi) and film (Herrmann).
And if you look at the importance of a composer, you of course look what they set out to do. You look at Mahler in the context of symphonies, not in the context of concertos. You look at Wagner in the context of operas, not in the context of symphonies. And you look at Goldsmith in the context of film, not in the context of operas. And it was there, that he was a giant of 20th century music.
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I tried Legend again and I'm sorry but the orchestration makes it sound like half the orchestra are drunk.
I hear some ST:TMP, NIMH and Poltergeist in here and I'd rather just listen to those far superior scores.
Maybe you put on the Tangerine Dream album by mistake?
I'm listening to TG score this morning. Some pretty decent 80's synth but not what I wanted to hear either.
Love TG Thief, Sorcerer, Wavelength, Firestarter, Flashpoint and Risky Business. Not a fan of Legend from them.
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"He didn't particularly like fans"
---------------------
Haha!
THAT'S the understatement of the year!
The stories I heard, from the old MFTM and Legend Society days, are hilarious.
His disdain for The Fans is LEGEND-ary!
He probably preferred the music critics over the fans
In 1984 Goldsmith was in conversation with Sidney sax about his growing fandom, in summary he saw himself as a craftsman like others working in the film making process, he could not see other professions such as editing, cinematography etc having fanzines and fans asking for autographs .He recognised as he worked in music the term artist was applied more often and because record albums were produced with his music others would feel a sense of ownership of the music and the writer became more revered. He was a shy person not an extrovert narcissist like many pop stars or even the likes of more public engaging people such a Henry Mancini.
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"He didn't particularly like fans"
---------------------
Haha!
THAT'S the understatement of the year!
The stories I heard, from the old MFTM and Legend Society days, are hilarious.
His disdain for The Fans is LEGEND-ary!
He probably preferred the music critics over the fans
In 1984 Goldsmith was in conversation with Sidney sax about his growing fandom, in summary he saw himself as a craftsman like others working in the film making process, he could not see other professions such as editing, cinematography etc having fanzines and fans asking for autographs .He recognised as he worked in music the term artist was applied more often and because record albums were produced with his music others would feel a sense of ownership of the music and the writer became more revered. He was a shy person not an extrovert narcissist like many pop stars or even the likes of more public engaging people such a Henry Mancini.
This honestly comes across in most of his interviews. He seemed uncomfortable with accollades.
I once saw an old TV Ontario segment where Elwy Yost interviewed Goldsmith, and Yost started reeling-off many of the films he'd scored -- "Alien, Planet of the Apes, A Patch of Blue, Seven Days in May, The Patton, Logan's Run, Poltergeist..." and Goldsmith smirked in a "yeah, yeah" kind of way while squirming in his seat. Yost then pointed out "But it is extraordinary -- these are very good movies."
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"He didn't particularly like fans"
---------------------
Haha!
THAT'S the understatement of the year!
The stories I heard, from the old MFTM and Legend Society days, are hilarious.
His disdain for The Fans is LEGEND-ary!
He probably preferred the music critics over the fans
In 1984 Goldsmith was in conversation with Sidney sax about his growing fandom, in summary he saw himself as a craftsman like others working in the film making process, he could not see other professions such as editing, cinematography etc having fanzines and fans asking for autographs .He recognised as he worked in music the term artist was applied more often and because record albums were produced with his music others would feel a sense of ownership of the music and the writer became more revered. He was a shy person not an extrovert narcissist like many pop stars or even the likes of more public engaging people such a Henry Mancini.
This honestly comes across in most of his interviews. He seemed uncomfortable with accollades.
I once saw an old TV Ontario segment where Elwy Yost interviewed Goldsmith, and Yost started reeling-off many of the films he'd scored -- "Alien, Planet of the Apes, A Patch of Blue, Seven Days in May, The Patton, Logan's Run, Poltergeist..." and Goldsmith smirked in a "yeah, yeah" kind of way while squirming in his seat. Yost then pointed out "But it is extraordinary -- these are very good movies."
I actually video taped that when it’s first aired! They were showing The Sand Pebbles that week
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