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 Posted:   Mar 2, 2019 - 7:37 PM   
 By:   Spymaster   (Member)

How ironic.

For years the film score community has complained that film and television music is compromised because composers don't have free reign. We have praised Ron Jones' Star Trek scores and slammed Dennis McCarthy's because McCarthy did what he was told by producers.

The prey has become the hunter.

Perhaps McCarthy was right all along.

 
 Posted:   Mar 2, 2019 - 7:46 PM   
 By:   Lukas Kendall   (Member)


The irony was not lost on me.

Lukas

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 3, 2019 - 9:10 AM   
 By:   Hurdy Gurdy   (Member)

Well, I'm not likely ever gonna forgot your new composers name, cos he shares it with a Spanish football club wink

And please consider a DVD/CD combo for us dinosaurs who didn't bother signing up for that blu-ray malarkey.

 
 Posted:   Mar 3, 2019 - 10:26 AM   
 By:   Jeyl   (Member)

I don't think it's that ironic. You're not coming into a series' fifth season and telling one of it's frequent composers that they no longer fit with your different direction. You're coming into your own project knowing what you want. Clear distinction.

And no matter how bad this may look, at least you're not ripping off composers with lyrics.

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 3, 2019 - 11:13 AM   
 By:   Spymaster   (Member)

I don't think it's that ironic. You're not coming into a series' fifth season and telling one of it's frequent composers that they no longer fit with your different direction. You're coming into your own project knowing what you want. Clear distinction.
And no matter how bad this may look, at least you're not ripping off composers with lyrics.


The point is that a composer never does what they want. They never have free reign. We condemn producers and directors for setting boundaries - for getting composers to follow a temp track, for directing a composer to write a synth score (such is the case here) - but that's just how it is. It's the director's film. Sometimes the producer's. Sometimes the studio's. Never the composer's. Only when you're on the other side of the fence do you get it.

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 3, 2019 - 11:32 AM   
 By:   JB Fan   (Member)

Well, I always think that composers must listen at least directors...
And let's face it - at least one time in history we get the great score, which was composed following director's instruction.
Remember, when Robert Wise said that score is good, but he have no have THEME? And after that "instruction" Jerry composed iconic Star Trek: TMP Theme smile

 
 Posted:   Mar 3, 2019 - 1:31 PM   
 By:   Jeyl   (Member)

The point is that a composer never does what they want.[/quote]

Rubbish. If Lukas really forced Ron to do something he didn’t want to do, he’d still be attached as composer. You never know if your own vision fully until someone else does something with it. Lukas’ decision tells me that he has a story to tell and he needs the right folks who can help tell it.

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 3, 2019 - 1:38 PM   
 By:   Spymaster   (Member)

Lukas’ decision tells me that he has a story to tell and he needs the right folks who can help tell it.

Which is exactly true of any director.

 
 Posted:   Mar 3, 2019 - 1:42 PM   
 By:   Lukas Kendall   (Member)

A big problem that Ron and I had is that we weren't able to get together in person and sit and watch the film, listen to sample tracks and talk about the film. (I did not temp it—not one note.) As the writer and director, I do have a vision for what the film should be, and given that we were working on it with upwards of a hundred missing VFX, I needed to explain how certain moments were going to appear in the finished film. Ron built a studio north of Seattle and lives up there now, and I have small kids at home and can't easily travel. We tried communicating over the phone and via email but it's not the same thing. He is a pencil-and-paper guy (old school) and so he was writing a few demos and paying to have an engineer assistant mock them up so I could hear them; that process was taking a lot of time and money, and by the time I heard a demo or two we had diverged in what we were thinking and talking about. As I said before it was a frustrating process and Ron was very gracious about accepting my apology for taking up his time and not using him well.

Having gone through this experience now, I definitely have a greater appreciation for what the process of film scoring entails. I think I am fairly unique as I have a lot of film music knowledge and I am able to talk in technical as well as dramatic language. I think Bobby and I worked well together and I hope people like the film and score.

Lukas

 
 Posted:   Mar 4, 2019 - 12:49 PM   
 By:   Justin Boggan   (Member)

I'm sad we won't be getting a new Ron Jones science fiction score. It was a nice thing to look forward to since, for what ever reason, he's still not done "The Orville".

Surely a versatile composer such as himself could have tried a new direction?

 
 Posted:   Mar 4, 2019 - 3:47 PM   
 By:   Yavar Moradi   (Member)

I'd be lying if I said I wasn't disappointed. I was happy to help fund a sci-fi short film by Lukas Kendall, but I'm one of those who was even more excited to be helping commission a new Ron Jones sci-fi score (even an all synth one -- he demonstrated on TNG that he knew well how to use them). I'm really sad this didn't work out, but I guess when it's your first time as a director, certain things just don't work out and it's a learning experience.

But yeah, I was indeed expecting a Ron Jones soundtrack CD for my $30. Lukas, if you are actually still on good terms with Ron, do you think he would be willing to let you put his demos on the score disc as a bonus, at least? I for one would be interested to hear what you decided not to go with (since Ron wrote it), if you and your final composer don't feel too terribly uncomfortable with the comparison. And obviously there would be room on the disc. In fact for the original perk you wrote,

"The Sky Fighter short film score by Ron Jones will not be long enough to fill out a CD by itself, so it will be combined with other new music composed and recorded by Ron Jones at his SkyMuse Studios facility north of Seattle and released as a special limited edition by La-La Land Records—with YOUR NAME in the special thanks list in the packaging!"

So...what happens with that additional material, now? Will Bobby Villarreal be writing "other new music" to fill out the CD of his film score? Will that same "other new" Ron Jones music still be put on the album with Bobby's score, for those who were looking forward to it and gave based on the hope of new Ron Jones compositions?

Or were you saying we'd get a movie/score combo, the score disc of which would just be the short length of the short film score itself?

Yavar

 
 Posted:   Mar 4, 2019 - 6:36 PM   
 By:   Lukas Kendall   (Member)


Yavar, nobody is more disappointed than I am. And I am embarrassed, to boot, now that I can't deliver what I promised to the donors. I am not exactly sure what we'll produce as a CD or CD-blu ray combo, but we will do the best we can. Sorry but there's pretty much no way I can go back to Ron and ask to release his demos, nor would I want to subject him to any more annoyance and bad feelings on this project.

Lukas

 
 Posted:   Mar 4, 2019 - 7:13 PM   
 By:   Yavar Moradi   (Member)

That’s what I was afraid you’d say, but I appreciate you taking the time to write that response. Of course I understand how disappointing this must be for you too. I hope, apart from this, that your relationship with Ron isn’t too damaged. You’ve done so much to champion his music over the years and I hope you still have more Ron Jones soundtracks in your future to produce.

I’ll tell you what — convince Seth MacFarlane to hire Ron to score an Orville episode and all will be forgiven! big grin

Yavar

 
 Posted:   Mar 4, 2019 - 7:31 PM   
 By:   foxmorty   (Member)

A tough situation all around. But as a donor don’t sweat it. This is shaping up to be a great Hollywood story. Man what an update!

 
 Posted:   Mar 4, 2019 - 7:32 PM   
 By:   Adam.   (Member)

Lukas, you have nothing to be embarrassed about. There were bound to be bumps and bruises along the way on this project and, surprise, things have happened that you could not foresee. Live and learn.

I (and I'm sure a few others) contributed funds to your project as a way of thanking you for making these beautifully produced FSM soundtracks available to us. Seeing your finished film will just be a bonus! smile I'm looking forward to it. With or without a score.

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 5, 2019 - 3:35 AM   
 By:   Hurdy Gurdy   (Member)

Hey Lukas, just be thankful you never had John Williams tied in to score it.
Then you would have HAD to use what you were given!

wink

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 5, 2019 - 5:38 AM   
 By:   Loverozsa   (Member)

I, too, contributed to Thank Lucas for FSM and all of the great releases. No problem with me. Looking forward to
seeing the finished product!!!!!

 
 Posted:   Mar 5, 2019 - 6:43 AM   
 By:   Nicolai P. Zwar   (Member)

Stuff like this happens... Peter Jackson was happy, enthusiastically happy with Howard Shore on LORD OF THE RINGS, but the two had different ideas about KING KONG, and so they parted. It's perfectly normal that sometimes things just don't work out. I am actually surprised that it did not work out in this case though, since I assumed there was at least some understanding upfront about what kind of a score for what kind of a movie it's going to be.

I keep my fingers crossed for the project and wish for Lukas to make the movie as good as can be.

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 5, 2019 - 6:54 AM   
 By:   Hurdy Gurdy   (Member)

It does highlight an interesting point about why 'pencil and paper' guys (as Lukas called RJ) may struggle to nab or maintain modern films, if the younger, more tech/computer/keyboard savvy can demo and relay what the producers want much more swiftly and economically.
Maybe explains why the composers we lament not working (Cliff Eidelman, Lee Holdridge, John Scott etc) could be being overlooked for the Remote Controllers (Balfe and co) on the grander scale of things?

 
 Posted:   Mar 5, 2019 - 8:56 AM   
 By:   Tom Servo   (Member)

It does highlight an interesting point about why 'pencil and paper' guys (as Lukas called RJ) may struggle to nab or maintain modern films, if the younger, more tech/computer/keyboard savvy can demo and relay what the producers want much more swiftly and economically.
Maybe explains why the composers we lament not working (Cliff Eidelman, Lee Holdridge, John Scott etc) could be being overlooked for the Remote Controllers (Balfe and co) on the grander scale of things?


It isn't just the crew at Remote Control that might have more tech savvy than some of the older composers, it's every younger composer working today, they are all asked to provide mock-ups and demos of their work and so everyone in town has to learn how, whether you're Lorne Balfe, John Powell or Michael Giacchino.

 
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