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Posted: |
Feb 10, 2019 - 2:55 AM
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By: |
Nono
(Member)
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Brickwalling is not the only problem. Any kind of compression affects the music, re-equalization (rarely for the better), "bright" mastering, but also high levels even if the dynamic range doesn't look affected etc.
"Hot" mixing is also a problem, because when you have all instruments mixed at higher levels, you don't have anymore a coherent musical image, the soundstage is gone, the dynamic is also reduced because everything sounds loud etc.
Sometimes, you have all these at the same time in a "remastered" edition.
But you can also have a kind of "butterfly effect", a minor change can affect the whole sound.
Today, I regularly go back to the older CD editions of the 80's and the 90's. They are not perfect, but sound wonderfully alive.
There are exceptions, of course.
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This whole thread should just be pictures of Varese albums.
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Posted: |
Feb 10, 2019 - 4:23 PM
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By: |
Rozsaphile
(Member)
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Brickwalling is not the only problem. Any kind of compression affects the music, re-equalization (rarely for the better), "bright" mastering, but also high levels even if the dynamic range doesn't look affected etc.
"Hot" mixing is also a problem, because when you have all instruments mixed at higher levels, you don't have anymore a coherent musical image, the soundstage is gone, the dynamic is also reduced because everything sounds loud etc.
Sometimes, you have all these at the same time in a "remastered" edition.
But you can also have a kind of "butterfly effect", a minor change can affect the whole sound.
Yes, many factors. That's why I find the term "brickwalling" simplistic and unhelpful. Why do things get messed up? I suppose, as suggested above, the producer imagines an audience listening in cars or treadmills, where the pianissimi would get lost. There are some young folks who may never have heard a true pianissimo!
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Posted: |
Feb 11, 2019 - 6:33 AM
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By: |
Nono
(Member)
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But I find the majority of releases from Intrada/LLL/FSM and Quartet to be superb (if the original recording was a good one).
La-La Land, FSM and Quartet also apply some compression, and even if it's not brickwalled, you don't have the natural dynamic range of the original recording. They also apply "a modern sound palette", to quote Quartet's words when they re-re-released Casino Royale (with no compression and no "make-up" this time).
Intrada's position has also changed since The Rocketeer, and even if the dynamic range seems to be preserved, the hotter levels they use for their new masters may affect the sound.
And their mixings don't respect the ambience of the soundstage and the position of the instruments within the orchestra (no perspective), since they are all mixed at higher levels.
The original recording of Flesh and Blood had wonderful ambience and dynamic, which are all gone with the new mixing (the La-La Land sounds better, I think that Ford Thaxton and James Nelson applied some reverb to recreate the ambience of the soundstage).
The same can be said about Quartet's A Passage to India, the original album had a great ambience and a wide dynamic range, but not the new one where all instruments have been mixed at higher levels.
And regarding compression, Silence of the Lambs also seems more compressed than others.
Most labels apply more or less compression, and many other things.
I didn't notice all these things some years ago, I felt that something was wrong, but didn't know what. I think that I also didn't want to know, because I spent much money in remastered editions, which are often useless in the end.
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Posted: |
Feb 11, 2019 - 8:21 AM
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By: |
Nono
(Member)
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Some interesting quotations :
"Alien 3 was quite an ambitious, very organic recording with extremely high dynamic range, which we preserved to a great degree, using the original album as a reference." (Mike Matessino)
"Malone’s work has focused on addressing unintended technical anomalies (such as filling dropouts and covering analogue splices) rather than broadly applying a modern sound palette. He has eschewed dynamic range compression and retained the brilliance of the original recording." (Quartet, Casino Royale)
"Question for you guys -- I've gotten a few questions about the sound difference between the complete program and the original CD program. What these guys are noticing is that the complete program is presented with the natural dynamic range of the original recording. The CD program is compressed, meaning the differential between the quietest parts and the loudest parts has been reduced. It provides a thicker sound, but is a bit of an artificial range. This compression seems to be the dominant choice for mastering these days, while Intrada has been religious about not tampering with the natural range. But...if the preference is for the sound of this compression, there's no reason we couldn't adopt that going forward. Just curious about your all feelings on this.
Ironically sound had to be compressed for LPs because the physical material of vinyl wouldn't allow for a wide dynamic range. It was one of the original selling points of the CD medium that you could have a full dynamic range without the need for compression. Kind of interesting that people seem to prefer the compressed sound! Or perhaps they just don't appreciate the natural acoustic. Thoughts?" (Roger Feigelson, about The Rocketeer)
Then :
"Originally premiered by Intrada in 2008, new 2017 edition of Body Double is presented from all new master incorporating several important sonic advantages including much-improved levels..." (Intrada)
As we can see, the full dynamic range of recordings is rarely preserved (and when it is, it's duly mentioned) and mastering levels have increased (which is not an improvement).
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