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That was fascinating, and really very beautiful. Thanks so much Joe!
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A recording of un-recorded Goldsmith cues (from any project), would be a CD I'd get.
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I think Jerry was quite humble about his Star Trek score. Love his self-deprectiating humor.
I appreciate that Jerry, who occasionally not just wouldn't, but really couldn't, explain exactly where his music came from for a given picture, had patience and understanding with the inability of others to put into words the things that they felt intuitively. He's known for 'hating temp tracks', but I'm given to understand that he wasn't that way with Joe Dante. He knew that Joe wasn't saying, "I want to music to sound like this," rather, "I want the scene to feel like this," and that was most thoroughly communicated via the temporary use of music, rather than with words. And Joe's team knew that using Jerry's music would muddle that communication, since Jerry already had stronger ties of his music with the films for which he wrote it, so they usually used Bernard Herrmann to color their rough cuts (a lot of Trouble With Harry, which makes a lot of sense given the usual tone of a Dante picture).
So even though he didn't like temp tracks generally, he still appreciated their use where communication of something felt and intuited was otherwise hard to get across.
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I honestly think that this is a perfect example of collaboration, which movie making is all about. We might have those maverick auteur directors that do 'their own thing' like Kubrick. But Wise was a Hollywood director. Goldsmith would not, in my humble opinion, be upset for one second working with a legend like Wise. And he is simply telling the story as it unfolded.
Nothing to see here, move on.
Sorry folks, but that's how I see it. And THANK GOD! Wise was indeed er.. wise here. Do we not think? I absolutely LOVED that sequence where Kirk is taken by Scotty to the Enterprise. This is my experience back in the day. I remember in sci fi mags etc the amount of people who MOANED about that. BORING they said. For Christ's sake get on with it.
Some of those same people were quite happy to watch the Pan Am shuttle go to the wheel in space (eh? Who fans), but hated this? I found that sequence quite emotional and will never understand Trek fans who disliked it, or the movie.
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I honestly think that this is a perfect example of collaboration... I remember in sci fi mags etc the amount of people who MOANED about that. BORING they said.
And Wise was clearly very satisfied with the final result. In the Director's Cut commentary, he talks repeatedly about having deliberately not cut scenes long accused of being Too Long, because Goldsmith's music was perfect there. That's a 20 years later paraphrase, but was basically his sentiment about it.
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Wow that was really beautiful! Thanks to everyone involved!
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One of my favorite film composer v director anecdotes goes something like this (and I regret that I don't remember the composer--possibly Rozsa or Bernstein-- so if anybody else knows, please chime in):
The composer meets with the very, very young director, who is obviously meeting a composer chosen by the producer, and the director says: "So, tell me what you've done?"
The composer responds, giving the director a rather extensive recounting of his credits, and then says: "Now, you."
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Posted: |
Sep 19, 2021 - 8:30 PM
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By: |
mducharme
(Member)
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I missed out on this thread months ago and only am now caught up.
At first I felt like this didn't work as well for the scene, but after hearing it a few more times, I actually think this works even better than the original. It shows how V'Ger is evolving, moving to a new plane of existence, by developing an understanding of the human emotion of love. I don't feel that the love theme in this instance really represents Decker and Ilia's love specifically, but the emotion of love in general, at least in the context of this scene and how it is used in this alternate cue. V'Ger is learning from their love, as an example of what love can be. I think Goldsmith did great with this first version.
The revised cue in the film was great of course - it was more cerebral and was more of an awe/wonderment mood, but this could have really given the film a bit more of the emotional side it was missing. It would be great to get this actually recorded by a real orchestra and perhaps included as an "alternate version" in a UHD release, although I somewhat doubt that would happen.
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