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 Posted:   May 9, 2021 - 2:56 PM   
 By:   OnyaBirri   (Member)

Kritzerland has at least three albums with "Geisha" in the title.

How would you describe these albums, and how would you rank them? Which of the three have the most or least exotica content?

Any chance Kritzerland would bundle all three and offer me a discount?

 
 Posted:   May 9, 2021 - 3:16 PM   
 By:   Mose Harper   (Member)

Around 12 minutes of My Geisha is taken up by selections from Madame Butterfly.
Otherwise it's a typically lovely, lush Waxman 50's/60's romantic dramedy score with some Asian ornamentation here and there.

I love it. It was one of my first, and still favorite, Kritzerland releases.
But I could easily live without the MB material, which disrupts the flow for me.

 
 
 Posted:   May 9, 2021 - 5:55 PM   
 By:   zooba   (Member)

I have THE GEISHA BOY, the Jerry Lewis movie, soundtrack from Kritzerland. I like it. Grand and Big from Lewis' regular composer Walter Scharf.

You can hear samples here:

http://www.kritzerland.com/geisha.htm

 
 
 Posted:   May 9, 2021 - 5:57 PM   
 By:   zooba   (Member)

Samples from Kritzerland's MY GEISHA release:

http://www.kritzerland.com/myGeisha.htm


 
 
 Posted:   May 9, 2021 - 6:24 PM   
 By:   zooba   (Member)

THE BARBARIAN AND THE GEISHA from Kritzerland:

http://www.kritzerland.com/barbarian_violent.htm


 
 Posted:   May 9, 2021 - 6:27 PM   
 By:   Yavar Moradi   (Member)

The Friedhofer took the longest to grow on me (like a decade, to be honest -- I got the original Intrada edition and originally didn't care much for it even though I usually like Asian-tinged Hollywood scores) but over time it has grown in my estimation and now it might be my favorite of these three (which are all good). Of course I'm not sure whether it would best fit your own sensibilities, Onya, so I don't know how much my taste on this matters to this thread.

Yavar

 
 
 Posted:   May 9, 2021 - 6:40 PM   
 By:   zooba   (Member)

Not from Kritzerland, but definitely my personal favorite "GEISHA" Movie Score. Heartbreaking and Beautiful from Maestro John Williams. MEMOIRS OF A GEISHA:


 
 Posted:   May 9, 2021 - 6:43 PM   
 By:   Yavar Moradi   (Member)

Agreed, zooba. For superb “Geisha” scores in this thread but Williams wrote my favorite of them all.

Yavar

 
 
 Posted:   May 10, 2021 - 6:20 AM   
 By:   OnyaBirri   (Member)

"Barbarian and the Geisha" is eliminated through a combination of hideous cover art and John Wayne involvement. (My pad is a John Wayne-free zone.)

 
 Posted:   May 10, 2021 - 8:52 AM   
 By:   Nicolai P. Zwar   (Member)

The Geishas of Kritzerland


Now there's a title for a movie that needs to be made.

 
 Posted:   May 10, 2021 - 8:57 AM   
 By:   Yavar Moradi   (Member)

"Barbarian and the Geisha" is eliminated through a combination of hideous cover art and John Wayne involvement. (My pad is a John Wayne-free zone.)

Not sure what makes the cover art "hideous" though I can sympathize with an aversion to John Wayne. Don't think Hugo Friedhofer (or your ears) should be penalized for it though! (Rest assured this doesn't sound like a western score, haha.)

Yavar

 
 
 Posted:   May 10, 2021 - 9:31 AM   
 By:   OnyaBirri   (Member)

"Barbarian and the Geisha" is eliminated through a combination of hideous cover art and John Wayne involvement. (My pad is a John Wayne-free zone.)

Not sure what makes the cover art "hideous"...


Beginning in perhaps the late 1990s, there has been a trend in which film studios will produce new artwork for their back catalogs to make the films look more "contemporary." Presumably, this is to trick viewers with no interest in cinema history into thinking the films are recent.

In some cases, when a boutique label releases a score, the film studio bullies the label into using whatever crappy artwork is on the current DVD release.

Billy Goldenberg's "Duel" is one such example. Just imagine if they would have used the 1970s Italian film poster for the CD!

At any rate, the artwork on "John Wayne Goes Geisha" looks suspiciously like one of those film studio hack jobs. Based on other Kritzerland releases that feature excellent, period-appropriate artwork, I would guess that this was not their idea.

... though I can sympathize with an aversion to John Wayne. Don't think Hugo Friedhofer (or your ears) should be penalized for it though! (Rest assured this doesn't sound like a western score, haha.)

Perhaps you are right, although if I had to compose music to John Wayne's image, it would not bring out the best in me.

I do admire the fact that John Wayne explored his feminine side by playing a geisha decades before this kind of thing became societally encouraged.

 
 Posted:   May 10, 2021 - 9:48 AM   
 By:   Mose Harper   (Member)

I'd drawn a blank on Geisha Boy and I've had that for several years now. I own the Friedhofer too, but haven't gotten around to ripping/listening to it yet.

Of the two (MG and GB), Boy has more Japanese travelogue style passages. It's a more obvious comedy score , though, with the usual Mickey Mousing at tiimes, if that makes a difference.

If you can hang with that aspect, it's still an entirely pleasant listen.

Of the two, I still greatly prefer the Waxman- even with the 12 minutes of Madame Butterfly. But GB clearly seems to have more frequent, obvious Japanese accents, if that's what you're looking for.

 
 
 Posted:   May 10, 2021 - 9:56 AM   
 By:   Morricone   (Member)

"Barbarian and the Geisha" is eliminated through a combination of hideous cover art and John Wayne involvement. (My pad is a John Wayne-free zone.)

John Huston and John Wayne couldn't be further away in their sensibilities. And yet this is one of my Wayne favorites because it inverts what Wayne's American presence represents including bringing plague to the Orient. The scene where Wayne clobbers a big ape only to be clobbered by his miniature friend over a hat is classic Huston. Huston is the only director among Frank Capra, William Wyler and George Stevens whose two "Why We Fight" documentaries were banned because one was about post war traumatic stress syndrome (never talked about in those days) and the other was considered antiwar. As Huston responded "if I ever make a prowar film I should be taken out and shot". And Friedhofer's score in places probably feels the most tragic of the bunch.

 
 
 Posted:   May 10, 2021 - 10:19 AM   
 By:   OnyaBirri   (Member)

"Barbarian and the Geisha" is eliminated through a combination of hideous cover art and John Wayne involvement. (My pad is a John Wayne-free zone.)

John Huston and John Wayne couldn't be further away in their sensibilities. And yet this is one of my Wayne favorites because it inverts what Wayne's American presence represents including bringing plague to the Orient. The scene where Wayne clobbers a big ape only to be clobbered by his miniature friend over a hat is classic Huston. Huston is the only director among Frank Capra, William Wyler and George Stevens whose two "Why We Fight" documentaries were banned because one was about post war traumatic stress syndrome (never talked about in those days) and the other was considered antiwar. As Huston responded "if I ever make a prowar film I should be taken out and shot". And Friedhofer's score in places probably feels the most tragic of the bunch.


Fair enough.

My point is that John Wayne is a major stumbling block for me. The context you provide is helpful.

 
 Posted:   May 10, 2021 - 10:23 AM   
 By:   Yavar Moradi   (Member)

Actually, Onya, Kritzerland’s designer appears to have made particularly good use of this original poster design:


I prefer it to the Intrada cover, which also doesn't seem to match any DVD or Blu-ray of the film I've seen:


I think the original poster art for the film was generally pretty bad...

Yavar

 
 
 Posted:   May 10, 2021 - 10:30 AM   
 By:   OnyaBirri   (Member)

Actually, Onya, Kritzerland’s designer appears to have made particularly good use of this original poster design:
https://www.google.com/shopping/product/7438351723139125352?q=barbarian+and+the+geisha+poster&client=safari&hl=en-us&biw=375&bih=553&tbs=vw:g,ss:44&prmd=sivn&prds=num:1,of:1,eto:16897567608042163257_0,prmr:1,cs:1


You can't see the difference, and did you read my post?

I don't think it's Kritzerland. I think it's a bad attempt by the studio to make the film look more contemporary.

 
 Posted:   May 10, 2021 - 10:46 AM   
 By:   Yavar Moradi   (Member)

I know the phenomenon you’re talking about, but I’m pretty sure you’re wrong about it applying in this case, and that Kritzerland came up with the best cover design they could based on the available poster art. Multiple people in the announcement thread were pleasantly surprised by it (probably because it was an improvement over the Intrada, which I also think was probably not studio-mandated): https://filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?pageID=1&forumID=1&threadID=87712&archive=0

Google the original posters for this movie. A lot of them are incredibly cringey. I think Kritzerland made the best possible cover in this case.

Yavar

 
 
 Posted:   May 10, 2021 - 10:49 AM   
 By:   OnyaBirri   (Member)

I know the phenomenon you’re talking about, but I’m pretty sure you’re wrong about it applying in this case, and that Kritzerland came up with the best cover design they could based on the available poster art.

Yavar


If so, it is not in keeping with their historic use of original poster/album art.

 
 Posted:   May 10, 2021 - 10:52 AM   
 By:   Yavar Moradi   (Member)

If so, it is not in keeping with their historic use of original poster/album art.

Well, I already posted the original poster with the exact image they used as the basis for their cover, above. Kritzerland has released tons of Fox scores and many times has used the original art. Why would Fox mandate something different for this obscure John Wayne non-western?

This is actually the cover on most DVD and Blu-ray versions of the film I've found online:


I'm guessing that would be more to your taste? But IMO it's not a great look.

On the other hand I like this new cover art very much (I wonder what the source was; maybe a foreign poster?) but I assume it wasn't available when Kritzerland did their CD edition...


I haven't been able to find the source of this online, if it was an old poster.

Yavar

 
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