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 Posted:   Jun 24, 2022 - 3:50 AM   
 By:   Andy   (Member)

What do you think, by composer, was his/her greatest achievment in counterpoint use in a special score or cue ,and, if the use of it, did it enhanced a scene more than another musical form.

another interesting question ( i do not know if it exists) a max number of counterpoint lines used


Andy




 
 
 Posted:   Jun 24, 2022 - 4:24 AM   
 By:   Broughtfan   (Member)

I don't know about greatest achievement, but three examples that are, to my mind, particularly outstanding:

Jaws - a number of cues featuring overlapping motifs. A score worthy of serious study (I can understand why even Benjamin Britten admired it).
Star Trek: TMP - Enterprise before its launch into space (beautiful, intricate stuff)
Witness - Barn raising scene (baroque influenced, works great in the film)

Special mention should be made of Morton Stevens' scores for "Hawaii Five-0" (especially the earlier season scores). I don't know anyone else who wrote quite like he did (especially for montage/passage of time scenes). Just a unique (film music) talent.

 
 Posted:   Jun 24, 2022 - 10:26 AM   
 By:   Paul MacLean   (Member)

Bach probably gets the award in the realm of classical music.

As far as films, the one that leaps to my mind is John Williams' "The Spiders".

https://youtu.be/p5h_333N5cs?t=170

And the "Mine Car Chase".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2PcGnTtn-OU

 
 Posted:   Jun 24, 2022 - 2:14 PM   
 By:   SBD   (Member)

Off the top of my head, the B section of the Raiders' theme and Short Round's theme in "Short Round Helps" from Temple of Doom.

(@1:32)

 
 
 Posted:   Jun 24, 2022 - 4:58 PM   
 By:   Broughtfan   (Member)

Chase sequence from "Time After Time" (Miklos Rózsa). A fine example of counterpoint in film music (fugato, canon).


(1:36 chords to end, actually whole sequence is spectacular)

 
 
 Posted:   Jun 24, 2022 - 5:09 PM   
 By:   Smaug   (Member)

I always thought Morricone out on a counterpoint show in his Humanoid score (l’umandoide).

 
 
 Posted:   Jun 24, 2022 - 6:29 PM   
 By:   villagardens553   (Member)

On John Barry's symphonic arrangement of Midnight Cowboy (both the Concert JB and Moviola versions) he adds a rather regal counterpart to the main melody about midway through. I've always loved it.

 
 Posted:   Jun 24, 2022 - 7:33 PM   
 By:   Ron Pulliam   (Member)


 
 Posted:   Jun 24, 2022 - 7:35 PM   
 By:   Ron Pulliam   (Member)


 
 
 Posted:   Jun 24, 2022 - 7:50 PM   
 By:   TacktheCobbler   (Member)

I’m not sure if it really counts as counterpoint (I’m not especially learned in musical composition), but as far as overlapping themes, the climactic “Caesar Now Be Still” from Rózsa’s Julius Caesar is especially impressive with the melding of the Caesar/Antony theme and Brutus’ theme.

 
 Posted:   Jun 24, 2022 - 7:55 PM   
 By:   DavidCoscina   (Member)

For traditional contrapuntal writing, Alex North wrote a lot of sophisticated music. The Spartacus main theme has a fugal passage which is quite exquisite. Dragon slayer also has non diatonic fugal material too.

The Shark Cage fugue and Tourists on the Menu from Jaws are also terrific.

Bill Conti’s Rocky has some wonderful contrapuntal sections too.

Mancini’s Lifeforce main theme

Newman’s Shawshank and Little Women from 1984

 
 
 Posted:   Jun 24, 2022 - 10:51 PM   
 By:   joan hue   (Member)

Below is a 21-year-old thread I started on Counterpoint if anyone is interested.

https://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=1500&forumID=1&archive=1

I think Franz Waxman enriches his main theme for the movie Mr. Roberts by using counterpoint at the 1:29 mark.





 
 Posted:   Jun 25, 2022 - 12:34 AM   
 By:   No Respectable Gentleman   (Member)

End Title of THE GREAT TRAIN ROBBERY.

 
 Posted:   Jun 25, 2022 - 12:49 AM   
 By:   johnbijl   (Member)

Horner was the master of counterpoint. Cocoon, and his musical essay Deep and timeless sea especially.

 
 Posted:   Jun 25, 2022 - 2:00 AM   
 By:   Spinmeister   (Member)

"The Great Fire" from Forever Amber by David Raksin

 
 
 Posted:   Jun 25, 2022 - 8:23 AM   
 By:   Andy   (Member)

Hi Ron


Anastasia is a perfect example, thanks, Newman gives a foretase of things to come, and both themes reperents the conflicts,

one of my all time scores, and a very good exmaple ist Jerry Goldsmith's "Night Crossing", Final Flight has this all, and as far as i remember, Patch of Blue has some great counterpoint passages too, have to a revisit this soon.

 
 
 Posted:   Jun 25, 2022 - 1:07 PM   
 By:   rfkavanagh   (Member)

One that always comes to mind for me - mainly because it remains one of my favorite pieces from any score to this day - is from Georges Delerue's Agnes Of God (1985). Counterpoint isn't necessarily a signature part of the score overall, but in this piece the secondary string melody that comes in under the primary flute melody just before the two-minute mark is a masterful weaving together of separate but complementary lines.

Plus, this is just a beautiful piece of music - I still get chills when the intensity shifts around 1:10. smile

 
 Posted:   Jun 25, 2022 - 7:58 PM   
 By:   Ron Pulliam   (Member)

I like all the provided examples. There are tons more, of course, but finding a few to fit "greatest achievement" is tricky.

 
 Posted:   Jun 25, 2022 - 8:18 PM   
 By:   Ron Pulliam   (Member)

"The Charge of the Light Brigade" by Max Steiner should be in contention:

 
 Posted:   Jun 25, 2022 - 8:24 PM   
 By:   Ron Pulliam   (Member)

 
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