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 Posted:   Oct 28, 2024 - 2:06 PM   
 By:   Timothy J. Phlaps   (Member)

most of my CD-R from 20 years ago are "dead".

I just went through a huge box of hundreds of CD-Rs, that were either loose or on spindles and stored in an attic for nearly two decades. I'd say maybe five to ten of them failed to read.

None of them had anything useful or interesting on them, but that's a different issue.

 
 Posted:   Oct 28, 2024 - 2:57 PM   
 By:   Nicolai P. Zwar   (Member)

most of my CD-R from 20 years ago are "dead".

I just went through a huge box of hundreds of CD-Rs, that were either loose or on spindles and stored in an attic for nearly two decades. I'd say maybe five to ten of them failed to read.

None of them had anything useful or interesting on them, but that's a different issue.


That's quite a lot! Though CD-Rs are of course more prone to deterioration than pressed CDs. I have some CDrs that are about 20 years old, but last time I checked (which is a couple of years ago), they were doing fine.

 
 Posted:   Oct 28, 2024 - 6:28 PM   
 By:   ryanpaquet   (Member)

I moisturize my CDs monthly.

 
 Posted:   Oct 28, 2024 - 6:30 PM   
 By:   ryanpaquet   (Member)

In all seriousness though CD-Rs are most likely to rot if you write on the tops. The permanent marker leaks into the data layers over time hence ruining the discs.

 
 Posted:   Oct 28, 2024 - 7:33 PM   
 By:   Solium   (Member)

I have hundreds of CD-R's which I play in my car and I haven't had any fail to play yet.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 29, 2024 - 12:14 AM   
 By:   Andy   (Member)



That's what you get from storing them in your aquarium of sulfuric acid all these years.


not so funny, if you loose some treasured films/soundtrack that are not replaceable anymore

most of the rotted CDrs are not selfmade, but bought Limited Editions with printed frontcover on it ( i think some of them are unmentionables) . At the time buying these,i did not recognized these as CDr.

 
 Posted:   Oct 29, 2024 - 2:15 AM   
 By:   Nicolai P. Zwar   (Member)

I have a few CDs amassed over the years, and I know these things are basically very durable. My first CDs I bought in 1987, and (last time I checked) they played just fine.
Of course, CDs can become scratched other otherwise accidentally damaged, various types of handling can impair playability of a CD, that is obviously not "CD rot".
Under "CD Rot" I would consider CDs that actually deteriorate over time with no evident external cause. CDs that are just kept like all the others in the jewel case in the shelf and when you pull them out a few years later perform worse, so they have deterioriertet.
Such a thing exists, and since it is rare, I would suppose it is indeed some kind of manufacturing error. But it's obviously not an error that is immediately apparent, but rears its ugly head years later.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 29, 2024 - 4:58 AM   
 By:   Andy   (Member)

the rotting is caused by the "glue" and the chemicals in the printed booklet.
Back in the first "rotting days" it happens to a new glue used by manufaturer PDO for the layers.
must be 1998-1999 if i remembered correctly. i sent appr. 50 CDs to PDO in the UK and they replaced all but one (Robinson Crusoe)
most CDs from Silva , Unicorn Kanchana, Cloud Nine Records and some Deccas.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 29, 2024 - 6:23 AM   
 By:   Rozsaphile   (Member)

One instance in 40+ years for me.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 29, 2024 - 6:26 AM   
 By:   Thor   (Member)

Not once in 35 years for me. I've had some CDs that have had trouble importing into iTunes without digital skips and hiccups, and I've lost enhanced CD-ROM material (on NIXON, for example), but no rotting, knock on wood.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 29, 2024 - 6:30 AM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

I have some CD that are among the first printed and they all play fine.

The so called 'rot' is all about the manufacturing quality, as someone else rightly stated above

 
 Posted:   Oct 29, 2024 - 7:13 AM   
 By:   Nicolai P. Zwar   (Member)

I have some CD that are among the first printed and they all play fine.

The so called 'rot' is all about the manufacturing quality, as someone else rightly stated above


Even if it is caused by manufacturing errors (and I agree that is the most likely case), it is nevertheless still real "rot", in the sense that the condition worsens without obvious external influences.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 29, 2024 - 7:16 AM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

I have some CD that are among the first printed and they all play fine.

The so called 'rot' is all about the manufacturing quality, as someone else rightly stated above


Even if it is caused by manufacturing errors (and I agree that is the most likely case), it is nevertheless still real "rot", in the sense that the condition worsens without obvious external influences.


Yeah, in these cases those cd quickly spoil, and if are really only a limited number of companies. The idea that this is any kind of wide spread problem is just not correct. I guess any amount of it is annoying, but this is not a large scale issue at all, it is a minuscule number

 
 Posted:   Oct 29, 2024 - 7:32 AM   
 By:   Nicolai P. Zwar   (Member)



Yeah, in these cases those cd quickly spoil, and if are really only a limited number of companies. The idea that this is any kind of wide spread problem is just not correct. I guess any amount of it is annoying, but this is not a large scale issue at all, it is a minuscule number


You're right, it's not a widespread problem as far as I can tell, and no one here has claimed otherwise.
Still, even though in my experience it seems to affect less than 1 in 1000 CDs (though of course I don't regularly check all my CDs... they are usually just sitting in a shelf doing nothing), it is still something that can happen.
I also did not find they rot "fast", rather slow, almost unnoticeable. (But EAC diligently points to any "suspicious" areas when ripping a CD, so you can actually notice it even if the errors are not "audible" (yet?)).

PS: Unrelated I just checked on two CD-Rs with ancient data which I burned over 20 years ago and kept in a box in our garage. They read just fine.

 
 Posted:   Oct 29, 2024 - 8:04 AM   
 By:   Octoberman   (Member)

the rotting is caused by the "glue" and the chemicals in the printed booklet.
Back in the first "rotting days" it happens to a new glue used by manufaturer PDO for the layers.



It bears mentioning that that is one cause, but not the only one.
Another culprit is that in some cases, the plastic "sandwich" that envelopes the aluminum layer may not be completely sealed during a pressing run.
The aluminum is exposed to air, how ever minutely, and eventually oxidization occurs.
Oxidization is not the same thing as rust (though it is visually similar), but it is just as damaging.

This is one of the practical reasons MFSL used gold in their CD's*.
Gold is a noble metal and generally does not react to oxygen.

(*Besides prestigious bragging rights. smile )

 
 Posted:   Oct 29, 2024 - 8:25 AM   
 By:   Mr. Jack   (Member)

My copies of The Black Hole and Hush started developing an annoying "chit-chit-chit" noise on top of the music within the last year or so, so yes, CDs can go bad over time.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 29, 2024 - 9:35 AM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

My copies of The Black Hole and Hush started developing an annoying "chit-chit-chit" noise on top of the music within the last year or so, so yes, CDs can go bad over time.

Jack, that is the squirrel sitting at your window

 
 Posted:   Oct 29, 2024 - 9:57 AM   
 By:   Octoberman   (Member)

My copies of The Black Hole and Hush started developing an annoying "chit-chit-chit" noise on top of the music within the last year or so, so yes, CDs can go bad over time.

Jack, that is the squirrel sitting at your window



For THE BLACK HOLE to get hit... that double sucks--after the ordeal just to get that CD made!

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 29, 2024 - 10:41 AM   
 By:   Andy   (Member)

, the plastic "sandwich" that envelopes the aluminum layer may not be completely sealed during

This is exactly the cause of the use of the affected adhesive in conjunction with the chemical reaction of the printing ink.

 
 Posted:   Oct 29, 2024 - 12:53 PM   
 By:   Octoberman   (Member)

, the plastic "sandwich" that envelopes the aluminum layer may not be completely sealed during

This is exactly the cause of the use of the affected adhesive in conjunction with the chemical reaction of the printing ink.



Just to be clear, I'm talking about the edge of the disc whereupon the 2 side of plastic did not seal to begin with.

That's how the unfortunate infatuation with running a green felt marker along the outer rim got started.
Seems to me that doing that would only increase the chances of rot! LOL

 
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