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Yes, I think we underestimate Copland's influence in 'defining' the Western sound.
I'm not sure, but I think it was Leonard Bernstein that said Copland invented the "American" sound.
I love Benstein but i think it was Charles Ives.
Copland himself credited Virgil Thomson more than anyone else with cracking the code on the American sound with his scores for Plow That Broke the Plains and The River.
Those gents were certainly ahead of their time, especially Ives, though in a way Copland refined it to a specific style that was more directly influential in all who came after. Bernstein's bandit music seems very idiosyncratic to himself though.
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Posted: |
Sep 1, 2017 - 3:37 AM
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By: |
MusicMad
(Member)
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I've lived with - and loved - the film: The Magnificent Seven (1960) most of my life. i can't recall when I first saw it - probably a re-run in the late 1960s when it was partnered with its follow-up Return of the [Magnificent] Seven (1966). For some (teenage) years I preferred the latter film as it had (from memory at that time) more action. My father thought differently, saying how he enjoyed the early party of the film, as Chris recruits his comrades. Of course, as I grew older and re-watched, I realised he was right.
The film is far from perfect and there are a few too many corny scenes~characters ... I'm not struck on Robert Vaughn's Lee and Brad Dexter overplays his scenes, etc.
But: the film became ... at least 30 years ago ... my favourite film of the western genre and I re-visit it with great pleasure every so often. And, of course, the music is one of its greatest draws (sorry for the pun). Almost concurrent with me being exposed to the James Bond Theme and some of the music from those early JB007 adventures, so this iconic theme entered my consciousness. Happily, for me, its link with a cigarette brand remained unknown for many years (I'm not sure if that brand/advertising campaign was ever used in the UK).
My first vinyl LP was the well-known Big Western Movie Themes - Geoff Love & his orchestra, side A tr.6 - fabulous. A little under a year later I bought the LP (Sunset label) Return of the Seven not understanding the distinction between the scores to the two films. And over the years, I've replaced that LP with CDs of the original film score including two re-recordings and, of course, the Ryko label release of that original re-recorded album.
I've got so that when the theme plays (as yesterday morning: the opening track on CD1 of Silva's The Essential Elmer Bernstein) I hardly listen ... I know it so well. More often than not it's the alien arrangement - such as Franck Pourcel's 1972 recording - tr.1 of his album Western - which grabs my attention.
But when I do play one of the full score (or that album re-recording) releases ... and listen attentively ... I know that after 45+ years this remains my favourite western film score. I know that this is a subjective matter and hence others will challenge my statement but, for me: it is the best score for this genre as it perfectly encapsulates everything which, to me, is what the wild west was about (in cinematic terms that is ... I'm not seeking to suggest that this has anything to do with the real-life times).
But: do I want to read an analysis? I won't say No but it's not high on my agenda. I did so for Il Buono, Il Brutto, Il Cattivo (1966) a few years ago but found it rather tedious (not helped by my lack of musical knowledge). That said, I always look into any thread which talks about this favourite western score.
Mitch
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Watching Joan's documentary, it's interesting in Part 1 I think, how the story evolved from the Kurosawa and became contemporary. The original Samurai were out-of-work soldiers turned mercenaries, as befitted Japan then. The original Newman screenplay was to have the Seven as post-Civil War mercenaries, an obvious parallel, maybe mostly Confeds, but this became mostly gunslingers instead, as more apt for 1950s/'60s America.
That's a really interesting thing: the development away from military heroes to rebel anti-heroes. Of course 19th Century SW and Mexico had lots of renegade bands of cowboys, Vaqueros, bandits, rustlers and westernised Native American reservations dodgers etc., so that does fit, but you start wondering how this film at the very least documented, if not inspired, a whole generation who were being birthed into 1960s values.
In Sturges' film the gunfighters achieve a sort of spiritual redemption rather than mere disillusionment. Sympathy for the devil.
Actually, it probably resonated with a whole generation of US WWII vets, and yet, they say it only succeeded in the US after being strained through Europe.
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Is there a link anywhere to Elmer's charming anecdote about the child and the coin-operated rocking horse that played the main theme?
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William, sorry I don't know the answer to your question. Anyone else?
I can't find it, but I heard it on a broadcast interview somewhere.
Elmer said he was in a depressed mood, somewhere in a small town in Europe(?), musing about how his life was going, what his legacy would be, whether he was fulfilling his potential. He was sitting beside a coin-in-the slot children's rocking-horse amusement.
A small boy ran up, stuck a coin in the slot, and jumped on, with no notion of course who this anonymous tourist was. The thing started playing the main theme from The Magnificent Seven, and the kid was in ecstasy.
He said, 'Well, if that's really how I'll be remembered, I can settle for that, to give pleasure like that: that's not a bad legacy', or words to that effect. It lifted his mood. The child probably never knew the impact he'd had.
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So, WHIT happened tae this WHITMER's analysis thread?
Tak it oot again.
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) about this score round these parts got me to listen to the durn thing again this morning. After everything I said above, I am finding this great fun, and I think I'm finally over my Marlboro Man hangup. (Listening to the Phoenix recording with James Sedaris because that's all that's available to me at work, I find I still love this version, the first one I owned.)
Good article you posted. Thanks.