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Posted: |
Apr 24, 2012 - 10:05 PM
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By: |
Solium
(Member)
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Don't want to fan the embers again, but I happened to catch the film on Foxtel the other day and was so immensely irritated by the score's inappropriateness that I just had to tell someone (and yes, you're the lucky people). I won't comment on the music as music, but the score was just so...so...wrong! This is a story about an apprentice wizard who tries to take over when his master is slain--I mean that's basically it. North's score is about a guy who's just lost his job, his wife has left him and his son is contemplating suicide. I mean it's just the wrong score, whatever its merits. It doesn't belong. Whenever anything starts to happen that we should be getting excited about, North is writing long-held tuba notes, and it does nothing for the scene. Absolutely no excitement is added, and ultimately it becomes difficult to know exactly what we should be feeling in any given scene because the music give us no clues; it sounds indeed like a radio playing in another room.
Sorry to those people who admire the score. By all means keep listening, but you'll never convince me that this was the right score for this Disney movie. I can only echo the conclusion from the Filmtracks review: "It's disgracefully out of place...".
Amazing. I just watched this film a few days ago and agree a thousand percent. I didn't post here afterwards not wanting to stir the pot either. But since you brought it up. Yes, the score is completely inappropriate for the film. Worse yet the score almost ruins the film. Its worse than your typical droning wallpaper score that we get nowadays because it totally takes you out of the scenes. Others are free to love it, but it's one of the worst scores in modern history IMHO. Other than a few "Godzilla vs Mothra" notes it fails horribly. If only Williams or Horner got their hands on this film.
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Alex North is one of the few composers I have really not gotten into properly. I have collected a few scores such as CLEOPATRA, 2001 and DRAGON SLAYER -which I loved as a film and was really taken by the dark and dreary score which I feel also upheld the film in many ways. On getting the cd from La La Land I did play a few selections but found the matter to be requiring a serious listen and contemplation. It helps watching the movie for it to bond with my listening experience and its been nearly 15 years since I last saw it. So thanks for bringing this discussion. I need to bring this out today from the closet and get immersed.
I had heard North's Dragonslayer and Spartacus, maybe other stuff early in my listening career. As much as I have liked modern- and post- modern music, North was still missing something for me. Then I heard 'A Streetcar Named Desire' and it all fell into place for me. I don't know how or why, but Streetcar was my key to North.
I fell in love with Dragonslayer the moment Liberace played it as part of an 'Oscar Nominated Medly' on the Johnny Carson show the year it was nominated.
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Posted: |
Apr 24, 2012 - 11:17 PM
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By: |
Erik Woods
(Member)
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As some have pointed out in this thread (and in other threads in the past) North's score could easily be passed off as "random noise." However, IMO, North's score is quite possibly one of the most accomplished film scores ever written. It's a raw, brutal, dissonant, avant-garde composition with unusual instrumentation and orchestrations. There is no sense of adventure or fun. Dragonslayer is an angry, atonal score with a sense of dread and darkness with masterful contrapuntal writing.
But to truly understand or "get" this score it needs your full attention. This isn't a score you throw on in the background. As the liner notes stated (SCSE release) North tackled this as more of a concert work, which might help some listeners with its coherency. The music flows wonderfully from track to track.
And while some disapprove of its use in the film I think it helps immensely to see the film and experience North's music in context. That's where it works its magic! For those that can keep an open mind will be rewarded by what they hear!
I also think that some have been left disappointed by their own personal expectations. Fantasy/adventure music during that time had an established sound. Lush, thematic, easily identifiable symphonic music. North pushed the boundaries.
Another point to ponder. In the liner notes it is said that besides the relationship between Galan and Valerian everything else was impersonal to North. You know what? It shows in the music. There aren't any lush, grand, emotionally satisfying, tonal themes with one exception... the love theme, which is rather lovely.
It's a challenging score and I can completely understand why some absolutely loathe it. I know I did when I first heard it but now after all these years and another viewing of the film I have come to appreciate what North did with his final score.
-Erik-
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How many people have actually seen this movie in a theater?
I did...
It was quite experience.
Ford A. Thaxton
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I also saw “Dragonslayer” in a first-run theater in Manhattan – one that was equipped to play the “sensurround” version of the audio tracks. It was quite an experience! – the “sensurround” kicked in, if memory isn’t failing, when the dragon’s leg/claw first thumps down into the frame in pursuit of the young woman near the beginning of the film. It was a tremendous moment – so effectively set up in the film -- and the crunching smash really sent a jolt through one’s body.
The “sensurround”, as I recall, greatly enhanced the film – making it darker, scarier, and more threatening musically, thematically, visually, sonically – edging an already dark film into even darker tones. North’s music also thundered on occasion in this audio mix – and fit the film perfectly. I honestly don’t remember being aware of the score when I first saw the film – I was just aware of a wonderfully cohesive experience that left me exhilarated and thrilled. The battle on the mountain top remains one of my favorite film and music sequences of all time – I cannot imagine that sequence without North’s score weaving in and out – for me his music is magical in this film!
But just IMHO based upon my gut level responses to that first viewing – and many subsequent viewings over the years. Man oh man would I ever love to see this film again in “sensurround.” – the sound process may not have been called “sensurround” but aurally it was essentially the same process.
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Posted: |
Apr 25, 2012 - 9:02 AM
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By: |
Rozsaphile
(Member)
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Agree with Jeff Bond. Fine score. Effective, appropriate, interesting.
I see that we published two short reviews in Pro Musica Sana back in the day. (Miklos Rozsa wanted our Society to support all good film music, not just his own.) William Finn found it a "dazzling" score: "The half-serious, half-mocking mood of the music captures the prevalent tone of the film to perfection. . . . The end title music . . . takes the film out with a laugh, rattle, and a bang." I myself wrote contrasting DRAGONSLAYER with "last year's CARNY, spare, sour, and perfectly on-target." The new score "seems to have struck some of the SPARTACUS fire from this unpredictable composer. . . . "When an invincibly American scherzo breaks out at the close, you know that -- like it or not -- you have been in the grasp of a commanding composer" (PMS 34 [1981-82]). Two issues later came Ken Sutak's "Dragonslayer Inquiry," citing a score "as close to perfection as film music . . . has ever come." You can read all these commentaries at the Rozsa site www.miklosrozsa.org
It seems that early audiences (at least people sensitive to film music) were not at all put off by DRAGONSLAYER. They didn't even think it particularly dour or difficult.
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Posted: |
Apr 25, 2012 - 9:36 AM
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By: |
mnrvason
(Member)
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I just watched the film again recently. The effects were amazing for the time, but I found myself being distracted by the music in a very unpleasant way. Love the music outside of the film. As many have mentioned, Northwrites complex and interesting music and Dragonsalyer is no exception.
Except...
In my opinion, the music was simply inappropriate (aside from the booming menace of Vermithrax's theme). The music seemed more fit for a film from the 40's than the 80's. There was a structure to the score that just didn't work in the film for me.
I do enjoy the music, as I said, outside of the film, as a listening experience. But matched with the movie, it was simply too much of a distraction (I make the same distinction with Morricone's score to Mission To Mars...LOVE the beauty of the music...in the film, I could only ask myself repeatedly "WHAT WAS DEPALMA THINKING????"). Would rather Robbins have gone with Horner, even though Horner had not yet "arrived."
tldr; Music = 4 Stars, Film = 4 Stars, Music in Film = 2 Stars.
SheriffJoe
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Dragonslayer is a superb score. 
