 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I'm listening to the samples right now, and I'm very much digging it.
Having never seen the film (sports dramas are very, very low on the list of things I care about) I couldn't give a monkeys if it was right for it or not, it's a CD I'll be picking up.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
That's my half-baked theory is that Goldsmith's slow transition out of the 80s is one of the factors that contributed to him having 2 scores rejected in the latter half of the 80s and a couple rejected in the early 90s. Not that it can be reduced to any one thing - no doubt it is more complicated than that. Just seems like there was more during this period than any other period for him and it was around the time that his music made a transition to less electronics. And I recall an interview post-80s from Goldsmith where he admitted that he may have overdid the electronics or something to that effect. Its one thing to have that kind of drum loop for a film like Gremlins 2 which is fun and young at heart. It is quite another to do it for a film like Gladiator which, from the clips I saw, seemed to have very different kind of pretensions. That may have contributed to the score being rejected I'm guessing.
- Adam
I really like this theory. I think you've put your finger on something that did contribute to several score rejections in this period. If you're trying to count LEGEND as late 80's, you're off a little. It was released theatrically in Europe in late '85 and Jerry's work was reported in Variety to have begun early in the year - at least composing the song sung by Mia Sara. And - if anything - the US release junked the score because it DIDN'T have enough synthesizers (it was replaced by Tangerine Dream's electronic score, after all). And I've always wondered if this event contributed to Jerry's wholesale acceptance of electronic sounds that followed. It would surely be ironic if that is later what contributed to the rejection of GLADIATOR.
The other film from the early 90's GLADIATOR period that Jerry's score was dropped from reportedly was THE PUBLIC EYE. But I've never heard anyone admit to actually hearing this and I've wondered - since the others have slipped out - if he ever actually recorded it. It would be interesting to find out what its mix of synthesizers to orchestra might have been. Perhaps this would give your theory even more weight.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
So I'm wondering how many more (officially) unreleased rejected Goldsmith scores there are...apparently The Public Eye, and also Wall Street if I'm not mistaken? Is that it now?
Yavar
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Here's what little information I have found on it over the years (on my site, of course):
Recorded at: Hit Factory (London).
Score Recordist: Mike Ross-Trevor.
So, if anybody has contact information for Mike, he might be able to provide some more details.
Didn't the Hit Factory close down? Since I recall it was Mike whom kept copies of "Legend", perhaps he has a copy of this, too.
|
|
|
|
|
|
I would've thought Bruce Botnick would know more (and he certainly would've told Jeff), but maybe not since this was apparently recorded in London?
Yavar
|
|
|
|
|
|
So I'm wondering how many more (officially) unreleased rejected Goldsmith scores there are...apparently The Public Eye, and also Wall Street if I'm not mistaken? Is that it now?
Yavar
I've read different reports on whether or not WALL STREET was actually recorded. I tend to think not. But maybe it existed as a synth mock-up.
Apparently, Goldsmith himself claimed most of his score to BABE was recorded, but it wasn't so much rejected as that his contract ran out just when the producer and director got into a fight over how dark the film should be, and the eventual outcome changed the editing and the expected tone of the music. Maybe he was too busy with POWDER and AIR FORCE ONE to go back to it - but I wasn't there so I don't know...
Goldsmith once claimed that the reason ALIEN NATION wasn't used was because the film was re-edited after his score was done at the studio's request and his music didn't fit the film anymore.
ALIEN NATION and GLADIATOR aren't exactly examples of great cinema - maybe they'll end up being remembered more for the rejected scores than any other reason. Ditto TIMELINE and 2 DAYS IN THE VALLEY.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Wow, didn't know that about Babe. A very exciting prospect (though I love the film and the existing score by Westlake with a little help from Camille Saint-Saens...)
Yavar
|
|
|
|
|
|
Wow, didn't know that about Babe. A very exciting prospect (though I love the film and the existing score by Westlake with a little help from Camille Saint-Saens...)
Yavar
Well, that's more information than I had previously on "Babe".
Yavar, my site:
http://www.rejectedfilmscores.150m.com/list.html
Most of his score for "Domesti Disturbance" was recorded (more information on my site, of course)
A sessions musician told me he had a score repalced on "Speed". Now, I understand people are hestitant to not believe that, and will say that's not true, but they have to understand, I take the word of a film score session player from hundreds of scores, over them. I checked other titles with him and his mind was right on all them, and I asked again to make sure he wasn't confusing it. So, take it for what it's worth.
There's also demos for "Reindeer Games" and "The Kid". The last one I can tell you was not his shining moment. I can't elaborate further on that.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Wow, didn't know that about Babe. A very exciting prospect (though I love the film and the existing score by Westlake with a little help from Camille Saint-Saens...)
Yavar
Well, that's more information than I had previously on "Babe".
Yavar, my site:
http://www.rejectedfilmscores.150m.com/list.html
Most of his score for "Domesti Disturbance" was recorded (more information on my site, of course)
A sessions musician told me he had a score repalced on "Speed". Now, I understand people are hestitant to not believe that, and will say that's not true, but they have to understand, I take the word of a film score session player from hundreds of scores, over them. I checked other titles with him and his mind was right on all them, and I asked again to make sure he wasn't confusing it. So, take it for what it's worth.
There's also demos for "Reindeer Games" and "The Kid". The last one I can tell you was not his shining moment. I can't elaborate further on that.
I wish I could remember my original source on BABE, but I do remember thinking that what was on your site seemed to basically confirm it in my opinion. But, you know, when people start talking about contracts sometimes that's just to cover up something different than what actually happened, and serves to protect somebody's ego. And sometimes it's the other way around and somebody wants to make a contractual issue into something more dramatic. Really, believing the sources of some of this info comes down to how much confidence you can place in the source. And, honestly, I don't know for sure.
But based on just in-print sources at the time of BABE's release (once it became a surprise success), there was a genuine disagreement between the director and the producer with the more successful track record (George Miller as I recall) and in the end it wasn't the producer who fully got his way. He wanted a darker BABE, and chose to direct the sequel himself to get that result. That seems to suggest where the conflict over the direction of the score might have begun.
We may never know for sure. I just want to make it clear I don't know any of this for fact because I wasn't present, just relaying what I've heard and read and seemed credible because it was supported at least partially by other sources.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
In a world of diminishing Goldsmith returns where the best we can hope for is a few more minutes of "Congo," this release is like a revelation for me. It's a fully formed, full-throated effort from a really rich time period. The low piano stabs, the tragic-tinged love theme, the (now) retro funk orchestra stuff. It's just this side of kitsch, and the sound quality puts the unmentionable to shame. People comparing this to "Criminal Law" can have their point of view, but this is a fantastic release that should be getting lots of attention.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
 |
Posted: |
Mar 7, 2013 - 8:12 AM
|
|
|
|
By: |
Nils
(Member)
|
In a world of diminishing Goldsmith returns where the best we can hope for is a few more minutes of "Congo," this release is like a revelation for me. It's a fully formed, full-throated effort from a really rich time period. The low piano stabs, the tragic-tinged love theme, the (now) retro funk orchestra stuff. It's just this side of kitsch, and the sound quality puts the unmentionable to shame. People comparing this to "Criminal Law" can have their point of view, but this is a fantastic release that should be getting lots of attention.
Agreed. Having listened to the full CD, my previous description of "energetic, catchy and fun" from listening to the samples definitely still stands. And overall, the synth stuff is less corny than I'd feared based on the samples (or is it just that I've become acclimatized to Goldsmith's late 80's-early 90's synths?  )
Not everyone's cup of tea, I guess, but an entertaining ride if you know what you're getting into.
If I've got his filmography straight, this release means that THE PUBLIC EYE is the ONLY Goldsmith score - rejected or not - since 1981 (THE SALAMANDER) that hasn't got an official release of some sort. And judging from Jeff's post above, it may be a while before we see that one...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
