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 Posted:   Mar 25, 2014 - 1:57 PM   
 By:   Golden Suns   (Member)

So there's a petition, directed toward Intrada and Disney Records, to get Ron Jones's score from the DuckTales TV series released:

https://www.change.org/petitions/disney-records-intrada-release-the-complete-music-score-for-ducktales-on-cd-and-or-itunes

If you're familiar with FSM's Star Trek: TNG Ron Jones project, you know what this amazing composer was and still is capable of. He created a bunch of *very catchy* themes for the ducks, and each of the TV specials featured a different adventure theme. "Treasure of the Golden Suns" in particular has got to be the best of the lot (and yeah, that's where my username comes from), with its incredibly memorable score which would be reused countless times in later episodes, thus becoming staples of the series itself.

Anyway, the Silver Age of animation as a whole has been sorely ignored in the soundtrack department, so I think this petition is one way to get the ball rolling.

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 25, 2014 - 2:13 PM   
 By:   Kim Tong   (Member)

Really?
Another petition for animated scores? This must be Eric Donovan since they just registered today to post this right?

 
 Posted:   Mar 25, 2014 - 2:17 PM   
 By:   The Mutant   (Member)

Really? Another petition for animated scores? This must be Eric Donovan since they just registered today to post this right?

That's funny. I thought YOU were Erik Donovan...

 
 Posted:   Mar 25, 2014 - 2:19 PM   
 By:   Senn555   (Member)

From what I've gathered over time, petitions are far more useful at making an impact for political / social justice causes rather than influencing big corporations in the entertainment industry. If they held any weight, Hasbro and Nickelodeon would have released soundtrack albums for My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic and Avatar: The Last Airbender a long time ago - and those petitions have thousands of signatures.

For what it's worth though, I signed this DuckTales soundtrack petition a few months ago, and I'd love releases of that as well as Darkwing Duck, TaleSpin, Goof Troop, and other Disney Afternoon shows. (as well as for Disney to release DVD sets of the remainder of what they didn't already put out... sigh)

Not trying to sway you away from your objective - keep pushing for it, maybe keep bugging Intrada about it every now and then. They're the closest partner with Disney and they ought to do it given enough demand.

Another idea: Did you try sharing this on ToonZone.net, or other similar websites / forums based on animation?

Also, refresh my memory... Thomas Chase and Steve Rucker did music for DuckTales too, right? What exactly did they and Ron Jones do on the show again?

 
 Posted:   Mar 25, 2014 - 2:36 PM   
 By:   solium   (Member)

Never hurts to try, but I think the data is in and petitions just don't work when it comes to soundtracks. I thought the new thing was Kick Starter? At least the company will know upfront if the demand will cover expenses.

 
 Posted:   Mar 25, 2014 - 2:50 PM   
 By:   Justin Boggan   (Member)

I e-mailed either Rucker or Chase once to ask, and the reply was they scored the pilot.

Now, the pilot credits Ron Jones. Looking back, they scored a nubmer of shows for Disney, perhaps the score was rejected and some was left in.

But of the score they did, it was tracked into episodes for the rest of the show's run. You may see them credited as "additional", but it's tracked.



Folks, I want this just as much as any of you, but Intrada has a full plate. They have many things they want to do, many things that have been in the works for years, etc., and they've already said this wasnt' a priority. A petition isn't going to change their minds. They know how we feel -- there's at least two threads over at the Intrada forum, with one really obsessed fan who's made a listing of all the cues used in the show (and, as I recall, when they were re-used); they've replied to the thread(s).


What needs to happen is somebody needs to do is ask (politely, and not be a dick about it), that since they aren't looking to do that any time soon, that maybe they can arrange for Disney to work with another label on it, since they have the ties, and they find a label that wants to do such an under taking.

And even then, it's a crapshoot.


By the way, if anybody here doesn't know, you can to to Jones' website and here a handful of cues:
http://www.ronjonesproductions.com

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 31, 2014 - 4:03 PM   
 By:   kenisu3000   (Member)

Never hurts to try, but I think the data is in and petitions just don't work when it comes to soundtracks. I thought the new thing was Kick Starter? At least the company will know upfront if the demand will cover expenses.

I've thought about Kickstarter, but I'm not so sure a lot of people would contribute to it since I'm only a fan, not someone who physically has it in their own power to release the score. So even reaching whatever amount of money producing such a set would cost wouldn't necessarily guarantee a release.

When I started up this petition, the one thing that really gave me reservations was finding out that the decision-makers would be emailed every single time somebody signed it. Believe me, a pest is the last thing I want to be. It's just not in my nature.

But anyway, if anyone wants to have a look at my fan-made cue sheets for the first 75 episodes of DuckTales (I'm the "really obsessed fan" Justin Boggan mentioned), here's the link: http://kenisu.webs.com/ducktalesbgm.htm

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 31, 2014 - 4:54 PM   
 By:   TerraEpon   (Member)

Never hurts to try, but I think the data is in and petitions just don't work when it comes to soundtracks. I thought the new thing was Kick Starter? At least the company will know upfront if the demand will cover expenses.

No, a KickStarter has to be done by the one fronting the money in the first place. One certainly could NOT put one up for "see how much money people want to pay!" before anything was actually signed.
Also, given this is a licensing situation, it may not fall within KS's remit -- though a rerecording would be a different story as it'd be a 'creation'.

 
 Posted:   Apr 1, 2014 - 8:49 AM   
 By:   CrazyQuark   (Member)

But anyway, if anyone wants to have a look at my fan-made cue sheets for the first 75 episodes of DuckTales (I'm the "really obsessed fan" Justin Boggan mentioned), here's the link: http://kenisu.webs.com/ducktalesbgm.htm

That is pretty amazing what you did there, and must have needed a lot of time. I found it amazing how you went through the show figuring out which cue was originally composed for which episode etc. (Although "Armstrong" and "Dinosaur Ducks" are pretty obvious in that regard because you really notice that these scores are composed for these episodes. Most other episodes sound pretty much tracked to my ears at least, so again I find it amazing that you tried to figure out what was composed for what because I'm not really sure how much episode order helped there. Anyway, great job.

Any specific reason you stopped after the two 5-parters for the second season? (If I would have to guess I'd say because the second season sucks unlike the first one, but of course others might think different about that... in any case the second season featured quite a bunch of new great tracks, as already seen on your list for the 5-parters.

I could be wrong but I'm guessing that the second season also have a few more cues featuring the beagle boys theme, as they appeared quite a lot in this season. There is also this treasure-hunt episode (one of the very few with no Bubba or Fenton) - I forgot it's name and what exactly happened but it was something love-related and I might remember wrong but I think this whole episode also pretty much had an original score, although I'm not really sure it was done by Ron Jones. I think it was done by one/some of his ghost writers he mentioned in previous interviews. It definitely wasn't Tom Chase and Steve Rucker, that much I'm sure of at least. Just wondering what you might think about it. smile

(And in case it isn't obvious I'd love a release of this music. Absolutely amazing stuff, The Ron Jones-stuff at least. Personally I'm not the biggest fan of the style of the Chase/Rucker-contributions as they sound like more typical us-kids-cartoon-stuff, much unlike the music Ron Jones composed.)

 
 Posted:   Apr 1, 2014 - 9:56 AM   
 By:   General Kael   (Member)

I would buy DuckTales in a heartbeat!

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 1, 2014 - 2:33 PM   
 By:   kenisu3000   (Member)

That is pretty amazing what you did there, and must have needed a lot of time. I found it amazing how you went through the show figuring out which cue was originally composed for which episode etc. (Although "Armstrong" and "Dinosaur Ducks" are pretty obvious in that regard because you really notice that these scores are composed for these episodes. Most other episodes sound pretty much tracked to my ears at least, so again I find it amazing that you tried to figure out what was composed for what because I'm not really sure how much episode order helped there. Anyway, great job.

Well, the documentation itself still has a few bugs and inaccuracies in it. It wasn't until I was nearly finished with the first draft that I realized some of the cues I was having massive trouble figuring out the origin of - especially the ones that had alternate takes - were actually part of the stock library Jones wrote and weren't composed for any *specific* scene. So there will be a few of those mystery cues floating around until I can get that sorted out.

And very true, episode order was practically no help at all. For instance, cues from "Dinosaur Ducks" and "Curse of Castle McDuck" start showing up in episodes long prior to those.

Any specific reason you stopped after the two 5-parters for the second season? (If I would have to guess I'd say because the second season sucks unlike the first one, but of course others might think different about that... in any case the second season featured quite a bunch of new great tracks, as already seen on your list for the 5-parters.

There's a few reasons it currently stops at 75:

1. Disney hasn't released the last 25 episodes on DVD yet (and we fans still have a big fight ahead of us until they do). When this project's complete, I want to be very open with Disney about my site, and I figured documenting episodes that aren't even legally available might put a damper on things. The way things are going, though, I'm starting to think it's not that big a deal.

2. To be completely honest, I have indeed gone through the last 25 episodes and documented them, I just haven't put them up on my site yet. But considering the audio quality of these episodes (making the music sometimes hard to hear), and the fact that most of them come from Toon Disney recordings which contain cuts, this portion of my project desperately needs polishing.

3. Webs is a weird site, and will sometimes fail to update pages if there's a particularly large amount of HTML in them. That's why my DragonBall Z BGM cue sheets are divided into two pages: just before episode 200, the site decided it couldn't handle that much HTML in one page. I don't think other domains even have this problem. In the case of DuckTales, I've tested it and it looks like it'll accept one more episode ("The Land of Tralla La") and then call it quits. I've been considering moving it all over to a blog, but I don't know yet.

I could be wrong but I'm guessing that the second season also have a few more cues featuring the beagle boys theme, as they appeared quite a lot in this season. There is also this treasure-hunt episode (one of the very few with no Bubba or Fenton) - I forgot it's name and what exactly happened but it was something love-related and I might remember wrong but I think this whole episode also pretty much had an original score, although I'm not really sure it was done by Ron Jones. I think it was done by one/some of his ghost writers he mentioned in previous interviews. It definitely wasn't Tom Chase and Steve Rucker, that much I'm sure of at least. Just wondering what you might think about it. smile

You're thinking of "A DuckTales Valentine", and yeah, it has its own original score. I exchanged a few emails with Ron Jones last year, and he mentioned having scored that one personally, so I don't think there's any ghost-writing in it. From what I gleaned while documenting the last few episodes, it was very likely the last set of cues Jones wrote for DuckTales before the series ended. (There were only seven episodes and the movie left after "Valentine", but IIRC the former consisted of nothing but tracked music from earlier episodes - including "Valentine" - and the movie was handled by David Newman.)

(And in case it isn't obvious I'd love a release of this music. Absolutely amazing stuff, The Ron Jones-stuff at least. Personally I'm not the biggest fan of the style of the Chase/Rucker-contributions as they sound like more typical us-kids-cartoon-stuff, much unlike the music Ron Jones composed.)

Jones's work on DuckTales continues to amaze me with how incredible and unique it was. His action cues really get you pumped, and his "mysterious" cues are genuinely creepy and unsettling, like something out of a dream.

And though "Dinosaur Ducks" wasn't marvelous, I'd be lying if I said the Chase/Rucker score didn't grow on me after a while, as I documented each episode. I hated it at first, not only because it was kiddified, but because it was all over the place (in the sense that it seemed to have no real direction), which made it super-difficult to figure out which part of the episode each cue came from. I was certainly relieved that they stopped using it after the first season, but it eventually got into my head anyway, so I do want it on CD as well. I doubt it would make it onto any set that contained Jones's score (due to issues like licensing and, well, Ron's pride), but maybe as a single-disc supplemental? Possibly also including the other two episode scores Chase and Rucker are rumored to have made for DuckTales but which went unused?

 
 Posted:   Apr 3, 2014 - 8:52 AM   
 By:   CrazyQuark   (Member)

1. Disney hasn't released the last 25 episodes on DVD yet (and we fans still have a big fight ahead of us until they do). When this project's complete, I want to be very open with Disney about my site, and I figured documenting episodes that aren't even legally available might put a damper on things. The way things are going, though, I'm starting to think it's not that big a deal.

Yeah, sadly it's quite obvious that there's not much love from Disney for this project. The DVD's we got here in Germany are even worse, not because of quality, but we have to deal with even more missing episodes. When the first US-Box was released, they had 3(?) discs with a bunch of episodes in it - but when the first Box for the EU popped up they had to make room for more language tracks and therefore 7 episodes in total had to go. Years later, when they ressurected the project, they most likely forgot or didn't cared about the episodes and simply skipped them, continuing with the second box with the same content as the US-box. The skipped episodes weren't on the third box either, so I doubt they would appear on a forth box (if that ever happens...) So far I buyed the first box, importing it from the UK (in Germany we got three single disc-releases and each of them was almost as expensive as the UK-box) mostly because at the time I thought we would see the whole thing on DVD. I only buyed the second box because of too many favourites on there (like the two five-parters) but overall I'm not too fond of incomplete collections, especially when they are put together without any love. But maybe I'm spoiled by all the great soundtrack-releases from the labels here who put so much care into a project it's almost unbelievable.

You're thinking of "A DuckTales Valentine", and yeah, it has its own original score. I exchanged a few emails with Ron Jones last year, and he mentioned having scored that one personally, so I don't think there's any ghost-writing in it.

Interesting. I know that Jones mentioned some ghost writers and this episode would have been my best guess. It's been a while since I last watched it but from what I remember I don't recollect hearing any of his familiar themes in there. In any case, it's still interesting that this episode got a complete score at all, while some of the "bigger" ones got a mix of tracked stuff as well as new.

Jones's work on DuckTales continues to amaze me with how incredible and unique it was. His action cues really get you pumped, and his "mysterious" cues are genuinely creepy and unsettling, like something out of a dream.

Yes, I agree completely. His music made me care for the characters and the situations they are in, unlike many other shows I watched as a kid.

And though "Dinosaur Ducks" wasn't marvelous, I'd be lying if I said the Chase/Rucker score didn't grow on me after a while, as I documented each episode. I hated it at first, not only because it was kiddified, but because it was all over the place (in the sense that it seemed to have no real direction), which made it super-difficult to figure out which part of the episode each cue came from.

Yeah, I was surprised that you didn't call the cues "Dinosaur Ducks Act 1", Act 2" and so forth. I don't think I would have been able to figure out starting and ending points for cues in this. wink Other than that, I can't say I hate it, but it leaves me relatively cold, which results in the fact that I find the episodes featuring this music much more boring to watch despite them still being as well-written as most others from the first season.

Possibly also including the other two episode scores Chase and Rucker are rumored to have made for DuckTales but which went unused?

Interesting again, this is also the first time I hear about that. So if they mentioned to have scored the pilot episode, maybe they did and just mixed up which of their scores got used in the show? Seems a bit unlikely, but it's also unlikely that "Dinosaur Ducks" was the first produced episode or something like that. Maybe it was the first that went into music-production?

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 4, 2014 - 4:38 PM   
 By:   kenisu3000   (Member)

Yeah, sadly it's quite obvious that there's not much love from Disney for this project. The DVD's we got here in Germany are even worse, not because of quality, but we have to deal with even more missing episodes. When the first US-Box was released, they had 3(?) discs with a bunch of episodes in it - but when the first Box for the EU popped up they had to make room for more language tracks and therefore 7 episodes in total had to go. Years later, when they ressurected the project, they most likely forgot or didn't cared about the episodes and simply skipped them, continuing with the second box with the same content as the US-box. The skipped episodes weren't on the third box either, so I doubt they would appear on a forth box (if that ever happens...)

Yeah, I remember reading about that. As if it weren't enough of a shame that no fans get the whole series on DVD, it's just ridiculous that countries outside of the US get even less. This is a series that deserves to be seen by all, in its entirety.

Interesting. I know that Jones mentioned some ghost writers and this episode would have been my best guess. It's been a while since I last watched it but from what I remember I don't recollect hearing any of his familiar themes in there. In any case, it's still interesting that this episode got a complete score at all, while some of the "bigger" ones got a mix of tracked stuff as well as new.

I think a lot of the ghost-writing comes from random episodes, for some of those moments when they needed him "on-call". I remember looking through a huge list of ghostwritten DuckTales music somewhere (ASCAP?), but unfortunately, only a couple of them had cue names, and those names weren't particularly helpful.

In any case, the cue that wraps up "Valentine" (probably the last cue Jones ever composed for DuckTales) was featured in the DT suite he had on his old site. The episode may sound a little different, but there are clues here and there that indicate it's him. The way the music picks up in intensity as the Ducks are exploring the underwater temple comes to mind, and there's a tiny hint of Fenton's theme when Launchpad comes down the steps ready to "run away from home" and go live in the ocean with that shark he fell in love with (don't ask). I don't know why Fenton's theme was used in an episode that doesn't feature him at all, but there it is. Although use of themes aren't a great indicator, as when Jones employed ghost-writers, he had them use his leitmotifs.

Yeah, I was surprised that you didn't call the cues "Dinosaur Ducks Act 1", Act 2" and so forth. I don't think I would have been able to figure out starting and ending points for cues in this. wink

I was going to when I first started. But it was its usage in other episodes that helped me out there. As I was going through the series, I eventually picked up on where each cue began and ended.

Other than that, I can't say I hate it, but it leaves me relatively cold, which results in the fact that I find the episodes featuring this music much more boring to watch despite them still being as well-written as most others from the first season.

That's true. "Horse Scents" has never been one of my favorites (though I'd probably hate it even if it wasn't "Dinosaur Ducks"-heavy, score-wise), and "Micro-Ducks from Outer Space" would have been a whole lot better if not for so much focus on the Chase/Rucker music.

Interesting again, this is also the first time I hear about that. So if they mentioned to have scored the pilot episode, maybe they did and just mixed up which of their scores got used in the show? Seems a bit unlikely, but it's also unlikely that "Dinosaur Ducks" was the first produced episode or something like that. Maybe it was the first that went into music-production?

It's really just a rumor. I read it in a post on some forum somewhere (maybe here?) that they actually scored three episodes but "Dinosaur Ducks" was the only one that made the cut. I also know from reading interviews with Jones that Disney auditioned a few different composers before settling on him, and it makes sense that Chase/Rucker would have been one of the auditions, since they were already the composers of choice for Adventures of the Gummi Bears.

 
 
 Posted:   Apr 4, 2014 - 4:39 PM   
 By:   kenisu3000   (Member)

EDIT: Double post.

 
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