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 Posted:   Aug 1, 2014 - 6:14 AM   
 By:   jackfu   (Member)

Heard part of an interview on (state-run) NPR and how poor most folks’ grammar skills are these days. Going thru school in the 60s & 70s, proper grammar was practically beaten into you. In fact, back then we even had “Grammar Schools”. Not that I’m an expert, but stuff like that sticks with you. “Your” = “You’re” is so common nowadays, you just wonder. Is grammar taught in school now? Does it matter?

Student: “Where is it at?”
Teach: “Behind the ‘at’.”
Student: “Huh?”
Teach: “’It’ is behind the ‘at’. Never end a sentence with a preposition.”
Student: “Okay; where is it at, jerk!?”

Curious if anyone else here qualifies as a grammar nerd.

 
 Posted:   Aug 1, 2014 - 8:01 AM   
 By:   Grecchus   (Member)

I will go back and edit something I wrote earlier when errors are spotted later. There is a threshold of contempt held against slop. The only problem is anything written for general exposure will more than likely be riddled with all sorts of mistakes that may or may not be spotted after reappraisal. I'm more concerned about determination of whether what I may have written will be comprehended as intended without raising the spectre of misunderstanding. A certain level of grammatic inclusion is necessary, however, I've long since forgotten the full extent of grammatical expression required for formal presentation of correct english, as you may have noticed here and there.

 
 Posted:   Aug 1, 2014 - 8:20 AM   
 By:   jackfu   (Member)

I will go back and edit something I wrote earlier when errors are spotted later. There is a threshold of contempt held against slop. The only problem is anything written for general exposure will more than likely be riddled with all sorts of mistakes that may or may not be spotted after reappraisal. I'm more concerned about determination of whether what I may have written will be comprehended as intended without raising the spectre of misunderstanding. A certain level of grammatic inclusion is necessary at that level, however, I've long since forgotten the full extent of grammatical expression required for formal presentation of correct english, as you may have noticed here and there.

Thanks, I agree. I'm not a grammar storm trooper but like I said, some of what is written and spoken just rattles inside my skull-not speaking of this forum, but in general.

My rule-of-thumb is what someone wiser than me wrote: "Grammar - The difference between knowing your crap and knowing you're crap."

 
 Posted:   Aug 1, 2014 - 8:25 AM   
 By:   Grecchus   (Member)

The former is objectively literal while the latter is, I guess, temporally subjective. smile

 
 Posted:   Aug 1, 2014 - 8:35 AM   
 By:   jackfu   (Member)

The former is objectively literal while the latter is, I guess, temporally subjective. smile

big grin

 
 Posted:   Aug 1, 2014 - 11:42 AM   
 By:   DavidinBerkeley   (Member)

Being cool now has come to include poor grammar and mispronunciations so often that I've gone into the closet with my grammar nerdiness.

 
 Posted:   Aug 1, 2014 - 11:43 AM   
 By:   DavidinBerkeley   (Member)

Is grammar taught in school now? Does it matter?



I've gotta wonder. Someone once told me his son wasn't being taught multiplication tables. Grammar could be next.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 1, 2014 - 12:13 PM   
 By:   joan hue   (Member)

I’m in schools many times each year, and schools do teach grammar which is the study of how to put words together to form sentences. They also teach the ancillary skills of punctuation, spelling, and capitalization rules. Students don’t seem very thrilled to learn these writing tools, but they are taught. I’ve heard students compare such studies to root canals.

When they are learning to talk, children basically learn grammar from their parents. Parents may say, “Me and him are going down town.” “He don’t know nothing.” Those speech patterns are pretty well ingrained in children during their language formative years. My husband is well-educated, but he learned very poor grammar from his parents and had to work hard to change his speaking patterns.

If I have to write something quickly and don’t have time for revisions and editing, I find that I do make errors. The best way to avoid this is to leave your written piece for a few hours and then revisit it with fresh eyes, but we don’t always have time to do revisits.

I agree with Grecchus. I don’t really care if someone makes a few errors as long as I can comprehend the message. No one is perfect. On the other hand, significant egregious errors diminishes communication.

I think too many people rely on the spelling and grammar check to fix their problems. Those grammar checks are not accurate. Many times I’ve ignored some of those suggestions because I know they’re wrong.

I worry about how texting language or abbreviations may harm written language. U no wot I meen?







 
 
 Posted:   Aug 1, 2014 - 2:53 PM   
 By:   Rozsaphile   (Member)

Heard part of an interview on (state-run) NPR and how poor most folks’ grammar skills are these days. Going thru school in the 60s & 70s, proper grammar was practically beaten into you. . . . Is grammar taught in school now? Does it matter? . . . Never end a sentence with a preposition.”

One problem is that some well-meaning but ignorant teachers keep passing on silly shibboleths instead of real sensitivity to language. The one quoted above is a classic bit of nonsense. Good writers have always ended sentences with prepositions. The "rule" against doing this has been passed down for centuries by people who were unknowingly taking their cue from Classical (Greek and Latin) grammar. But English has its own grammar, and good English writers can be counted on to know better. Some examples:

Thou hast no speculation in those eyes / Which thou dost glare with. (Shakespeare)

Fanny could with difficulty give the smile that was asked for. (Austen)

The university is one most people have heard of. (Frost)

He had enough money to settle down on. (Joyce)

. . . the race of men she's had to deal with. (Doctorow)

Another good writer, Winston Churchill, should have hammered the final nail into this myth's coffin years ago. But like Dracula, the notion seems to belong to the undead.

This is the type of errant pedantry up with which I will not put. (Churchill)

 
 Posted:   Aug 1, 2014 - 6:07 PM   
 By:   edwzoomom   (Member)

Proud member of the grammar nerd herd here. Having gone all the way up to college in parochial schools, it was drilled into us, literally. I don't police my counterparts at work. However, I do have a rather loud co-worker who beseeches customers to hold "cuz alls I have to do is look it up. My teeth hurt each time I hear it. The emails from said co-worker are equally as painful. Singular pronouns and plural verbs are rampant. Another co-worker jokingly said "English must be her second language." Anyway, I never hold it against anyone who uses poor or incorrect grammar. Likewise, they never hold it against me when they see my illegible penmanship. I absorbed the grammar lessons but not the cursive drills.

If you can diagram a sentence, does this make you are hard core grammar nerd? smile

 
 Posted:   Aug 1, 2014 - 6:21 PM   
 By:   Mr Greg   (Member)

I can overlook the occasional mistake...it happens...but wilful ignorance bothers me. At that point, I'm quite happy to become a Grammar Nazi.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 1, 2014 - 9:05 PM   
 By:   dan the man   (Member)

DELETED

 
 Posted:   Aug 1, 2014 - 11:58 PM   
 By:   Mr Greg   (Member)

Abeoerteioen ies Emuerdeer tehae pedelies ha elea deeeres,aere peeroude teo esteaende upe ageaieneste ite.

Oh for heaven's sake...."Abortion is murder....are proud to stand up against it"...that's this thread gone then...nice one dan the spam....

 
 Posted:   Aug 2, 2014 - 7:59 AM   
 By:   edwzoomom   (Member)


Just happened upon this earlier. smile

http://time.com/3051761/why-weird-als-word-crimes-is-english-for-dummies/

 
 Posted:   Aug 2, 2014 - 8:13 AM   
 By:   solium   (Member)

I always felt the English language was rather convoluted and bloated. At the end of the day, understanding what someone writes or says is far more important than following all the stuffy rules.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 2, 2014 - 9:00 AM   
 By:   CinemaScope   (Member)

I left school at fifteen (1966), so can be no grammar nerd, but it does bug me when people leave out apostrophes from contractions. And the old, there-their-they're & to-too-two, & a few others. I did once point out that someone had used the wrong "to" in a thread heading (it made the title nonsense), & got a lot of flak for that. I don't see a problem ending a sentence in a proposition, sometimes it's awkward not to, & I see no problem in splitting an infinitive. There's probable a few grammar errors in this post (should I start a sentence with...And?), but at least I'm trying.

And I have to say, I still don't see a problem in...five items or less. That's five items, or less than five items, all very clear to me, & less is a nice hard word, whereas fewer is a bit of a nothing word, sounds like a quiet fart.

 
 Posted:   Aug 2, 2014 - 9:05 AM   
 By:   Grecchus   (Member)

I think your "flac" should be "flak," which would be the WWII stuff the Dam Busters would be flying into while over enemy territory.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 2, 2014 - 9:15 AM   
 By:   CinemaScope   (Member)

I think your "flac" should be "flak," which would be the WWII stuff the Dam Busters would be flying into while over enemy territory.

Ha, thanks. I wondered why I got that wavy red line under it.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 2, 2014 - 9:19 AM   
 By:   BillCarson   (Member)

wavy lines are bad. And should be shot.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 2, 2014 - 9:25 AM   
 By:   OnyaBirri   (Member)

I am a grammar nerd. I should of known their are others.

 
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