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 Posted:   Mar 26, 2021 - 7:11 PM   
 By:   Jurassic T. Park   (Member)

Whether Goldsmith or any film composer can be classified as "genius" is endlessly debatable. Ask around in composer circles and you will find higher regard for Goldsmith than almost any other composer of his generation (Gabriel Yared and Wendy Carlos specifically mention him in interviews- Williams' name is absent- why is that you think?). Even in that video from Yavar, with the roundtable of esteemed musicians/engineers/historians, there is an acknowledgment that, while Williams was/is a consummate musician, Jerry was the more daring and innovative of the two.

Musicians and composers are in awe of Williams' prowess, don't get me wrong. But they also recognize the indelible contribution Goldsmith had on the art of film music and are suitably reverent to his brilliance.


I’m curious what you mean by composer’s circles as I haven’t really seen anything disparaging about Williams. I find a lot of respect for Williams but I can see how the absence of comments can say something too.

The difference between the two actually is something that I think is probably widely accepted and might explain what you’re saying - and it’s that I do think Goldsmith is hands down the more experimental composer while Williams is kind of the more technical/polished orchestrator and instrument composer. Not sure how to explain this, but I see the compositional/orchestrational brilliance of Friedhofer and some of the classical composers like Ravel and Walton in Williams.

I wouldn’t be surprised that Yared and Carlos found Goldsmith particularly inspirational because they themselves were experimental. For one thing, Goldsmith’s highly unusual embrace of synthesizer and INTELLIGENT use of synthesizers really set him apart from other composers, especially when scores like “The Forbidden Planet” were the benchmark of “electronic music”. Also keep in mind that Goldsmith was around before Williams.

Anyway, when I think of listening to them and studying, I go for Williams for emotional writing and studying how he balances the orchestra and uses specific instruments. I think his orchestration is much more complex than Goldsmith. But I go for Goldsmith when I want to study interesting techniques, meters, experimental theories.

And I think the ultimate difference is that Williams consistently presents highly buttoned-down works that are extremely smooth and precise, and he honed and honed and honed this consistently in the classical space. Whereas Goldsmith did almost too many things at once and his experimentation covered so much ground yet the only consistency was synths and meters. There’s a lot to be said for that - Don Davis was very experimental with the first Matrix film, but came nowhere close to Goldsmith’s level of decades of consistent experimentation. I just think Goldsmith’s constant experimentation makes him a fascinating composer to study but a little harder to access when the experimentation wasn’t well-integrated into the larger score.

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 26, 2021 - 8:42 PM   
 By:   Morricone   (Member)

Want to correct a notion brought up here, that Jerry would score anything put in front of him. His problem was the opposite. Literally he would turn down a guaranteed commercial success if he could score something he had never done before. He accepted scoring PLAYERS partially because the head of the studio asked him to but he was most excited about doing a film about tennis. Oddball choices early on like SECONDS, THE TRAVELING EXECUTIONER, THE MEPHISTO WALTZ, THE FLIM-FLAM MAN, SEBASTIAN, THE CHAIRMAN, THE LAST RUN and even PLANET OF THE APES had more to do with the challenge of something new he had never done. This and his loyalty to many filmmakers he had a track record with may have contributed to many less than stellar assignments. And he could be bribed with big bucks for sequels "to pay for his house". But he was successful enough not to have to take any of them. He just preferred the ones that interested him the most that had some element that was different from his previous endeavors.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 3, 2021 - 12:34 PM   
 By:   Moonlight   (Member)

.

 
 Posted:   Aug 3, 2021 - 1:03 PM   
 By:   Advise & Consent   (Member)

I hold this truth to be self-evident.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 4, 2021 - 2:53 PM   
 By:   The Shadow   (Member)

deleted

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 4, 2021 - 3:34 PM   
 By:   .   (Member)

He took far more risks at every level, delivered new orchestration package every 3 years.
A true musical chameleon.
Never equaled in the past....nor in the future I am afraid.
There were other true geniuses, Herrmann and Rozsa come to mind, but not offering so much diversity.




For me, that's his weakness, not his strength.
He diversified from marvelous orchestral scores that never get old, to synth-laden fluff that already sounded old years and years ago.
In my opinion, the first third of Goldsmith's scores generally sound far fresher and less dated today than his last third of scores. "The Blue Max" or "Planet of the Apes" or "The Wind and the Lion" sound like timeless masterpieces that have stood the test of time. What a pity he diversified to stuff like "Runaway" or "Link" or "Criminal Law" that now sound like the corniest of corn. I'm glad Rozsa and Herrmann stuck to what they were best at.

 
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