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 Posted:   Dec 25, 2017 - 11:06 AM   
 By:   Kylo Ren   (Member)

Hi guys! I posted about this initially in The Last Jedi thread but as it’s very busy in there I’ve decided to post what I found here too so it’s easier to see and discuss.

What do you guys think about the similarities?

I still am not having a conclusive opinion on this score.... but the moment I heard “Rose’s theme” for the first time I instantly thought "that’s the first part of one of the themes from James Newton Howard’s music from My Girl" and was instantly distracted but also intrigued. I love that score and it’s a holy grail of mine amongst JNH early 90s scores. Go figure.

I honestly never thought that part of that wonderful theme would end up in a Star Wars movie scored by John Williams. The temp track of doom strikes again it seems. Still not sure how I feel about it.

Here's a suite, the theme in question is Vada's theme 0:55 onwards.



The melody from Rose’s theme appears at 1:52-2:12

 
 Posted:   Dec 25, 2017 - 7:02 PM   
 By:   Scott M (Oldsmith)   (Member)

Darth Vada....

But yes, very close indeed.

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 25, 2017 - 7:16 PM   
 By:   Avatarded   (Member)

It's Williams. No one will bat an eye.

Horner on the other hand...there would be 15 threads about it.

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 26, 2017 - 3:55 AM   
 By:   Adam S   (Member)

So I think this thing can happen all the time. The initial part of the melodic phrase is the same but resolves itself differently. The orchestration is completely different.

We have confirmation from the director of Last Jedi that it was temp tracked with Star Wars music so the similarities are coincidental. And even without the confirmation, the likelihood that a composer would deliberately borrow from My Girl of all films, seems extremely remote.

More likely that Rose was temp tracked with Anakin's theme or that Williams wrote a theme that just happened to be somewhat similar. Both character themes project an innocence and heroism with Rose's theme resolving around the major third giving the theme a more feminine personality compared to Anakin's theme IMO. Both themes feel kind of grounded with the melody working its way upward, projecting a sense of "rising up from humble roots" as opposed to a hero's theme that seems larger than life. These are the kinds of things that determine where Williams goes with a theme IMO and if it happens to sound like something else in certain respects so be it. At least that's my take.

- Adam

 
 Posted:   Dec 27, 2017 - 3:55 PM   
 By:   Kylo Ren   (Member)

It's Williams. No one will bat an eye.

Horner on the other hand...there would be 15 threads about it.


Haha! You took the words right out of my mouth.

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 27, 2017 - 4:03 PM   
 By:   haineshisway   (Member)

You know what - if you want opinions, post BOTH tracks so we all can hear them back-to-back.

 
 Posted:   Dec 27, 2017 - 4:07 PM   
 By:   Kylo Ren   (Member)

You know what - if you want opinions, post BOTH tracks so we all can hear them back-to-back.

Good idea, I shall do just that right now. I tried initially but for some reason the link wouldn’t add correctly alongside the first one so I just left it alone. I’ll add Williams’ music to my original post.

 
 Posted:   Dec 27, 2017 - 7:49 PM   
 By:   Jeff Eldridge   (Member)

Here are the first few bars of each theme, transposed to C major for comparison:



If those first four notes sound familiar ...



See also: https://goo.gl/R35RSb

 
 Posted:   Dec 27, 2017 - 10:46 PM   
 By:   digitalfreaknyc   (Member)

I thought it sounded like Jurassic Park.

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 27, 2017 - 11:00 PM   
 By:   haineshisway   (Member)

There are just so many notes - and many, many songs and themes share the same notes used in different ways. How can it not be? It has been thus from the beginning of time. You think Stephen Sondheim was thinking about The Candy Man when he wrote No One Is Alone from Into the Woods? Of course not. They share the exact same first six notes but are used in completely different ways. Who honestly cares? And there are thousands more examples. I could say Cy Coleman stole two melodies from me - they are exactly the same for seven or eight notes each and mine were written many years before his - well, since I know Cy and I know for certain that there was no way he could have known my songs, well, just a coincidence and since each song in question is completely different in feel it doesn't matter a whit. Back in 1971 I wrote a song that ended up as the end credits song of my film, The First Nudie Musical. Some years later the opening vamp was used note for note in an Eric Carmen song, and then after that in a Barry Manilow song, which basically takes the main melody of my song and uses it almost exactly, but not quite and with quite a different feel and of course it goes to completely different places. Those are my personal experiences with this kind of thing. But there are similarities in thousands upon thousands of songs. Why? Twelve notes. Think about that. Twelve notes for all of Western music. Think about it again.

 
 Posted:   Dec 27, 2017 - 11:11 PM   
 By:   Loren   (Member)

What do you guys think about the similarities?


I like your diplomacy ("similarities"), yes there's a big similarity!

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 28, 2017 - 1:33 AM   
 By:   Thor   (Member)

If anything, the Rose theme sounds very Harry Potter-ish. Any similarities to MY GIRL is -- obviously! -- purely coincidental. Come on!

 
 Posted:   Dec 28, 2017 - 1:52 AM   
 By:   WagnerAlmighty   (Member)

Well, I'd definitely rather watch My Girl than anything Star Wars (not a fan...I even far prefer other Williams scores over anything from that franchise, but that's just me).

No offense to fans of SW...I know you are legion.

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 28, 2017 - 1:55 AM   
 By:   Thor   (Member)

Oh, I understand. Williams' STAR WARS music is part of my backbone; my musical DNA (ROTJ is my second favourite score of all time), but in later years I've also found myself veering more towards Williams' lesser known material, especially the stuff that is not big and boisterous action music.

 
 Posted:   Dec 28, 2017 - 3:44 AM   
 By:   WagnerAlmighty   (Member)

Oh, I understand. Williams' STAR WARS music is part of my backbone; my musical DNA (ROTJ is my second favourite score of all time), but in later years I've also found myself veering more towards Williams' lesser known material, especially the stuff that is not big and boisterous action music.

I love his music like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xqo3ZApCJt0

I think Close Encounters is an incredible masterpiece of a score, hard to beat that one in his catalogue imo.

But hey, I also love Superman. Want to hear sacrilege? As much as I admire John's Supes, I actually love the score to Man of Steel more (ducking).

Star Wars...I remember being thrilled by the trailer for Empire Strikes Back when it first came out, and Williams' collage for the trailer was absolutely thrilling. None of that music has aged well for me at all, for some reason it just floats in one ear and out the other.

That said, it's quite probable Williams is the greatest living film composer....and possibly the world's greatest living composer, period.

All my opinion, no disrespect to anyone else's meant.

 
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