 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
 |
Posted: |
Mar 24, 2010 - 3:03 PM
|
|
|
|
By: |
Bob DiMucci
(Member)
|
Over the years, when discussions are held on this board about what scores can be released and by whom, the question often arises about who owns the actual music elements for a film and any associated LP recordings of the soundtrack that may have been issued over the years.
In general, the studio that produced the film owns the actual music tracks, and the record company that released the soundtrack owns the LP recording. However, since many studios and record labels have changed hands over the years, figuring out who currently owns what takes a little research. To aid in easy identification, I’ve compiled the following two lists:
Record Label Ownership
TV, Film, and Music Element Ownership
These lists can be accessed in the future by doing a Board topic search on the keywords in the thread title.
(The search term "ownership" works best.)
Naturally all additions and corrections are welcome.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Isn't Varese technically owned by UMG? Or just distributed by them?
One to add to your list I think. I was just listening to Bridge at Remagen and the back says it's copyright The Wolper Organization (nothing else) though it's paired with The Train which says copyright M-G-M...so I assume Wolper = MGM for both scores to be included on one disc. By the way (and I guess I should probably start a new thread for this) do any of Bernstein's other (ie. documentary) scores for Wolper survive, perhaps in his personal tapes, which could be released? (Or maybe that's a silly question because they probably would've been paired with Bridge at Remagen instead of Jarre's The Train in that case.)
I think this is a great idea for you to post this information -- very helpful for those who want to know if a release is possible/likely.
Yavar
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Isn't Varese technically owned by UMG? Or just distributed by them?
One to add to your list I think. I was just listening to Bridge at Remagen and the back says it's copyright The Wolper Organization (nothing else) though it's paired with The Train which says copyright M-G-M...so I assume Wolper = MGM for both scores to be included on one disc. By the way (and I guess I should probably start a new thread for this) do any of Bernstein's other (ie. documentary) scores for Wolper survive, perhaps in his personal tapes, which could be released? (Or maybe that's a silly question because they probably would've been paired with Bridge at Remagen instead of Jarre's The Train in that case.)
I think this is a great idea for you to post this information -- very helpful for those who want to know if a release is possible/likely.
Yavar
UMG distributes Varese.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: |
Apr 4, 2010 - 11:22 AM
|
|
|
|
By: |
Bob DiMucci
(Member)
|
One to add to your list I think. I was just listening to Bridge at Remagen and the back says it's copyright The Wolper Organization (nothing else) though it's paired with The Train which says copyright M-G-M...so I assume Wolper = MGM for both scores to be included on one disc. By the way (and I guess I should probably start a new thread for this) do any of Bernstein's other (ie. documentary) scores for Wolper survive, perhaps in his personal tapes, which could be released? (Or maybe that's a silly question because they probably would've been paired with Bridge at Remagen instead of Jarre's The Train in that case.)
Yavar
I mistakenly had Wolper Productions on the list as "Volper." It's now corrected. In any case, the Wolper library is (in general) currently owned by Warner Bros. However, "The Bridge at Remagen" was originally distributed by United Artists, whose assets are generally with the current MGM. The LP soundtrack for "The Train," which is on the FSM CD with "Remagen," was originally on the United Artists record label, now also owned by the current MGM. So, I suspect that's how "Remagen" and "The Train" came to be on the same CD, through common ownership by MGM.
The ownership of the Wolper theatrical films seems mixed. For example, the Wolper production of "Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory," although originally released by Paramount, has been issued on DVD by Warner Bros., not Paramount. That would follow the "Wolper = Warner Bros." rule. But "The Devil's Brigade," "The Bridge at Remagen," and "If It's Tuesday, This Must Be Belgium," also Wolper productions but originally released by United Artists, were released on DVD by MGM, which follows the "United Artists = MGM" rule.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: |
Apr 4, 2010 - 12:16 PM
|
|
|
|
By: |
manderley
(Member)
|
.....
I mistakenly had Wolper Productions on the list as "Volper." It's now corrected. In any case, the Wolper library is currently owned by Warner Bros. I assume that this includes the film "The Bridge at Remagen," even though the film was originally released by United Artists, whose assets generally are with the current MGM. So, the ownership of "Remagen" by Warners would be an exception to the "United Artists = MGM" rule. As for "The Train," all MGM films through 1986 are also now controlled by Warner Bros. Thus, both "The Bridge at Remagen" and "The Train" are both currently under the control of Warner Bros., and that is why they could be combined on the same FSM CD.....
I'm sorry, Bob, but I believe you're confused about THE BRIDGE AT REMAGEN and THE TRAIN. They were NEVER "MGM" film releases, they were originally United Artists releases, and they are controlled by MGM Entertainment, not Warner Bros. The DVDs of these films are on MGM Entertainment Home Video.
The reason the scores are on FSM together is because the "MGM" that Lukas was dealing with is MGM Entertainment MGM Entertainment owns the "new MGM" post-1986 product and the MGM corporate structure as well as the United Artists corporate structure and the UA library. Lukas dealt with MGM Entertainment for its releases of this sort of material---that's why it's called "MGM Music" (even though the music comes from United Artists films---or MGM post-1986 films.)
With the borderline bankruptcy of MGM Entertainment, however, and various bids currently in contention for ownership of the corporation and its assets, particularly one from Warner Bros., it's possible that in the future the "new MGM"---post 1986 product---as well as the old United Artists library will end up at Warner Bros., alongside the "old" MGM, Warner Bros., RKO, Monogram/Allied Artists, Lorimar, etc. libraries which they now own.
Let's say it all together again:
Ted Turner/Turner Entertainment owned MGM Corporation, United Artists Corporation and the libraries of MGM (pre-1986), Warner Bros. (pre-1948), RKO, United Artists, and the studio complex.
Eventually the studio complex went to Lorimar, then Warner Bros, then Sony Entertainment.
The MGM and UA corporate structures eventually ended up at/as "MGM Entertainment"
The MGM post-1986 films library is in MGM Entertainment (once known as MGM/UA).
The United Artists pictures library is in MGM Entertainment.
The MGM pre-1986 films, the RKO films, and the Warner Bros pre-1948 films are at Warner Bros.
MGM Entertainment has greatly confused the issue for us because it's slapped the "MGM" name on product, including films AND scores, which it didn't originally make or release---because, of course, the MGM name is historically and commercially very valuable as a corporate commodity, and a strong selling point for whoever owns the name and can apply it to product. With its history and connections to culture, the MGM name is probably the most valuable asset that MGM Entertainment owns---possibly even more valuable than the UA library of films.
PS.....Bob, I see you've now corrected your post so much of what I've just said is redundant. I suspect any Wolper productions---either David L. Wolper Productions or Wolper Productions product---which were released originally by UA or UA Television remain with UA. I would assume that the Wolper corporate structure was either brought to Warners by Wolper, or bought by them, and therefore, any other unassigned Wolper product is free to be moved to the corporate structure held by Warner Bros---thus "Willie Wonka" at Warner Bros. from Paramount.
Some years ago there was talk of issuing the wonderful TV series "Hollywood and the Stars" on Lasers or DVDs, but it was impossible to do because of the rights problems with the various studios' footage. This show was originally produced by Wolper for UA Television and later, apparently, held by UA in the UA film library. I imagine it still resides there, unable to be released on the new formats.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
.....
I mistakenly had Wolper Productions on the list as "Volper." It's now corrected. In any case, the Wolper library is currently owned by Warner Bros. I assume that this includes the film "The Bridge at Remagen," even though the film was originally released by United Artists, whose assets generally are with the current MGM. So, the ownership of "Remagen" by Warners would be an exception to the "United Artists = MGM" rule. As for "The Train," all MGM films through 1986 are also now controlled by Warner Bros. Thus, both "The Bridge at Remagen" and "The Train" are both currently under the control of Warner Bros., and that is why they could be combined on the same FSM CD.....
I'm sorry, Bob, but I believe you're confused about THE BRIDGE AT REMAGEN and THE TRAIN. They were NEVER "MGM" film releases, they were originally United Artists releases, and they are controlled by MGM Entertainment, not Warner Bros. The DVDs of these films are on MGM Entertainment Home Video.
The reason the scores are on FSM together is because the "MGM" that Lukas was dealing with is MGM Entertainment MGM Entertainment owns the "new MGM" post-1986 product and the MGM corporate structure as well as the United Artists corporate structure and the UA library. Lukas dealt with MGM Entertainment for its releases of this sort of material---that's why it's called "MGM Music" (even though the music comes from United Artists films---or MGM post-1986 films.)
With the borderline bankruptcy of MGM Entertainment, however, and various bids currently in contention for ownership of the corporation and its assets, particularly one from Warner Bros., it's possible that in the future the "new MGM"---post 1986 product---as well as the old United Artists library will end up at Warner Bros., alongside the "old" MGM, Warner Bros., RKO, Monogram/Allied Artists, Lorimar, etc. libraries which they now own.
Let's say it all together again:
Ted Turner/Turner Entertainment owned MGM Corporation, United Artists Corporation and the libraries of MGM (pre-1986), Warner Bros. (pre-1948), RKO, United Artists, and the studio complex.
Eventually the studio complex went to Lorimar, then Warner Bros, then Sony Entertainment.
The MGM and UA corporate structures eventually ended up at/as "MGM Entertainment"
The MGM post-1986 films library is in MGM Entertainment (once known as MGM/UA).
The United Artists pictures library is in MGM Entertainment.
The MGM pre-1986 films, the RKO films, and the Warner Bros pre-1948 films are at Warner Bros.
MGM Entertainment has greatly confused the issue for us because it's slapped the "MGM" name on product, including films AND scores, which it didn't originally make or release---because, of course, the MGM name is historically and commercially very valuable as a corporate commodity, and a strong selling point for whoever owns the name and can apply it to product. With its history and connections to culture, the MGM name is probably the most valuable asset that MGM Entertainment owns---possibly even more valuable than the UA library of films.
PS.....Bob, I see you've now corrected your post so much of what I've just said is redundant. I suspect any Wolper productions---either David L. Wolper Productions or Wolper Productions product---which were released originally by UA or UA Television remain with UA. I would assume that the Wolper corporate structure was either brought to Warners by Wolper, or bought by them, and therefore, any other unassigned Wolper product is free to be moved to the corporate structure held by Warner Bros---thus "Willie Wonka" at Warner Bros. from Paramount.
Some years ago there was talk of issuing the wonderful TV series "Hollywood and the Stars" on Lasers or DVDs, but it was impossible to do because of the rights problems with the various studios' footage. This show was originally produced by Wolper for UA Television and later, apparently, held by UA in the UA film library. I imagine it still resides there, unable to be released on the new formats.
This is a valuable message manderley, many thanks, I wish it could be bookmarked here at FSM for future reference.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
PS.....Bob, I see you've now corrected your post so much of what I've just said is redundant. I suspect any Wolper productions---either David L. Wolper Productions or Wolper Productions product---which were released originally by UA or UA Television remain with UA. I would assume that the Wolper corporate structure was either brought to Warners by Wolper, or bought by them, and therefore, any other unassigned Wolper product is free to be moved to the corporate structure held by Warner Bros---thus "Willie Wonka" at Warner Bros. from Paramount.
Thanks. As soon as I put in my original post, I realized that "The Train" soundtrack was on UA and not MGM records, so that my correlation had to be wrong. FSM has done so many Warner compilations, it just surprised me that they had stuck a (new) MGM one in there. I tried to change my post ASAP, but you were johnny-on-the-spot with your correction. I think my lists in the first posts reflect your chronology.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
