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 Posted:   Aug 10, 2013 - 8:14 AM   
 By:   Joe Caps   (Member)


On the Waterfront is a masterpiece of a score, the only film score by Leonard Bernstein.
A couple of years ago, I posted that Sony was searching for the complete stereo score.

Apparently,it has been found. the new dvd and Blu-ray from criterion, has been remixed for 5.1 using those stereo music tracks. It sounds wonderful.

Now I hope someone will clear the rights to release the entire score, in stereo on cd.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 10, 2013 - 8:53 AM   
 By:   haineshisway   (Member)

On the Waterfront is a masterpiece of a score, the only film score by Leonard Bernstein.
A couple of years ago, I posted that Sony was searching for the complete stereo score.

Apparently,it has been found. the new dvd and Blu-ray from criterion, has been remixed for 5.1 using those stereo music tracks. It sounds wonderful.

Now I hope someone will clear the rights to release the entire score, in stereo on cd.


It's coming - why it's taking this long is anyone's guess but one of the labels definitely has it.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 10, 2013 - 9:49 AM   
 By:   PFK   (Member)

On the Waterfront is a masterpiece of a score, the only film score by Leonard Bernstein.
A couple of years ago, I posted that Sony was searching for the complete stereo score.

Apparently,it has been found. the new dvd and Blu-ray from criterion, has been remixed for 5.1 using those stereo music tracks. It sounds wonderful.

Now I hope someone will clear the rights to release the entire score, in stereo on cd.


It's coming - why it's taking this long is anyone's guess but one of the labels definitely has it.




Great news Bruce. I'll buy one! smile

 
 Posted:   Aug 10, 2013 - 6:45 PM   
 By:   Wedge   (Member)

Interested parties may want to pay a visit to the Intrada forum. The notion that a "stereo" source was found for the new Criterion release is apparently false, but there IS some good news...

http://www.intrada.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=5709

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 10, 2013 - 6:56 PM   
 By:   haineshisway   (Member)

I just have to sit and scratch my head when I read this stuff - leaving ticks and pops that can easily be taken care of is a GOOD thing and desirable? Because it isn't. There is no need to sacrifice ANYTHING harmonically or aurally when transferring from acetates. We've all done it and if it's done properly by experts it's great - the proof is in the hearing. - any surface noise these days can be taken care of without sacrificing anything. The technology in just the last year has yielded unbelievable results - a simple listen to A Place in the Sun, a score that was unreleasable a year ago, will tell you all you need to know. Chris Malone did that work without sacrificing ANYTHING in terms of tonality on the strings or any other instrument.

We made a vinyl transfer of Casino Royale that audiophiles were over the moon about - should we have left in some ticks and pops because that would have made it sound - like what? In that transfer there was not one SHRED of anything lost by removing, on a CASE BY CASE basis, the unwanted and occasional ticks and pops.

 
 Posted:   Aug 10, 2013 - 7:11 PM   
 By:   Wedge   (Member)

I think you may be misreading Doug's comments. Here's the full paragraph (emphasis mine):

These original session discs have been cleaned up as much as is practical without any attempts to pretend they are from anything but discs. An overuse of noise reduction and other gimmicks that remove not only the clicks but also the very life of the music itself have not been employed. Some may prefer the noise to be completely squished, no matter that important string harmonics and other instrumental timbres are heavily damaged, while others prefer to hear the orchestral colors as genuine as is possible with requisite de-noising kept to a minimum. That is our camp. Some restoration, of course, is necessary with 1950's acetates, including using state-of-the-art Sonic Solutions software to reduce clicks and pops, but digitizing everything into the 21st century CD sonic realm, while perhaps quieter, is not particularly musical in our opinion.

Sounds to me like Doug is saying that clicks and pops CAN be removed without damage to the music, and without the overuse of de-noising techniques.

 
 Posted:   Aug 10, 2013 - 7:29 PM   
 By:   Sirusjr   (Member)

Great film and beautiful score. I am excited to see it finally released!

 
 Posted:   Aug 10, 2013 - 7:31 PM   
 By:   Ray Faiola   (Member)

Many kudos to Intrada.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 10, 2013 - 7:57 PM   
 By:   haineshisway   (Member)

I think you may be misreading Doug's comments. Here's the full paragraph (emphasis mine):

These original session discs have been cleaned up as much as is practical without any attempts to pretend they are from anything but discs. An overuse of noise reduction and other gimmicks that remove not only the clicks but also the very life of the music itself have not been employed. Some may prefer the noise to be completely squished, no matter that important string harmonics and other instrumental timbres are heavily damaged, while others prefer to hear the orchestral colors as genuine as is possible with requisite de-noising kept to a minimum. That is our camp. Some restoration, of course, is necessary with 1950's acetates, including using state-of-the-art Sonic Solutions software to reduce clicks and pops, but digitizing everything into the 21st century CD sonic realm, while perhaps quieter, is not particularly musical in our opinion.

Sounds to me like Doug is saying that clicks and pops CAN be removed without damage to the music, and without the overuse of de-noising techniques.


I didn't read it as you did, but I hope you're right. In any case, it's a very necessary release and I would hope it sells extremely well.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 10, 2013 - 9:51 PM   
 By:   cody1949   (Member)

ON THE WATERFRONT will make a fantastic CD release. I wish Sony [ Columbia Pictures] would be as willing to work with Kritzerland as they are with Intrada.

 
 Posted:   Aug 11, 2013 - 9:41 AM   
 By:   Ray Faiola   (Member)

Pops and clicks are seldom a problem, as long as they're done individually and not with "processing". Groove wear is the real villain when dealing with acetates.

 
 Posted:   Aug 11, 2013 - 9:53 AM   
 By:   Stefan Huber   (Member)

Pops and clicks are seldom a problem, as long as they're done individually and not with "processing". Groove wear is the real villain when dealing with acetates.

That is the exact problem with "modern" restorations: people don't take the time to remove each click and pop indvidually, but run them through a no-noise filter. The results are shoddy - and risk the existence of our musical heritage...

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 11, 2013 - 10:08 AM   
 By:   haineshisway   (Member)

Pops and clicks are seldom a problem, as long as they're done individually and not with "processing". Groove wear is the real villain when dealing with acetates.

That is the exact problem with "modern" restorations: people don't take the time to remove each click and pop indvidually, but run them through a no-noise filter. The results are shoddy - and risk the existence of our musical heritage...


Anyone who would do that should be run out of town on a rail. Restoring from acetate, LP, or even tape is an exacting, exhausting job. What has happened in the last year is new technology that is very helpful with certain types of problems and used properly the results are nothing short of miraculous, as can be heard in the work of Chris Malone. There are many people who do great work, and there are many who don't - not just in the world of soundtracks. It's like the idiots who just turn on "auto tune" for singers. Unbelievable. But that, at least, is a choice for some, a style, if you will (I won't). When we decided to remix Promises, Promises, a recording plagued with off-pitch singing by its leading man, we could have taken the easy way and just turned on auto tune and it would have been a travesty and crap. First of all, we used a much more sophisticated and "real" program, and most importantly I did it on a note by note basis and very carefully and the result is if you hadn't heard the original you'd never know that anyone was singing off pitch - it sounds natural and real and perfect.

I am very much looking forward to On the Waterfront whenever it gets to us.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 11, 2013 - 11:03 AM   
 By:   PFK   (Member)

Back in 1971 I spent a lot of time searching small record stores in New England looking for out-of-print soundtrack LPs. I found "You Can't Run Away From It" Decca DL 8396 issued in 1956.

Side B says: " Highlights from the SOUNDTRACKS of Columbia Pictures."

Side B has: From Here To Eternity, Eddie Duchin Story, On the Waterfront.

Morris Stoloff conducting the Columbia Pictures Orchestra

I think the On The Waterfront music is 5 - 7 mins.

Is the On The Waterfront music the actual soundtrack or re-recorded?

In any event, after 42 years (!), I will now get the complete score! smile

 
 Posted:   Aug 11, 2013 - 11:22 AM   
 By:   Stefan Huber   (Member)

Pops and clicks are seldom a problem, as long as they're done individually and not with "processing". Groove wear is the real villain when dealing with acetates.

That is the exact problem with "modern" restorations: people don't take the time to remove each click and pop indvidually, but run them through a no-noise filter. The results are shoddy - and risk the existence of our musical heritage...


There are many people who do great work, and there are many who don't - not just in the world of soundtracks.


So true. I'm getting a headache thinking of all the disastrous Nat King Cole and Peggy Lee re-issues. It's really a "who does the job?" matter. Steve Hoffman's Bing Crosby compilations sound great to me - better than anything put out more recently - and those disks are nearly thirty years old.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 11, 2013 - 2:28 PM   
 By:   Last Child   (Member)

On the what? I thought this was the music to "Screaming Mimi."
[just venting my pet peeve about its later reuse wink]
Cant wait to hear the original music in its original uncut form. That'll be interesting!

 
 Posted:   Aug 11, 2013 - 3:52 PM   
 By:   Ray Faiola   (Member)



Side B has: From Here To Eternity, Eddie Duchin Story, On the Waterfront.

Morris Stoloff conducting the Columbia Pictures Orchestra

I think the On The Waterfront music is 5 - 7 mins.

Is the On The Waterfront music the actual soundtrack or re-recorded?


Original soundtracks.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 11, 2013 - 4:32 PM   
 By:   FredF   (Member)

Did I miss something? You are all talking like the release is imminent but the Intrada article about the source material being available was written in 2007.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 11, 2013 - 4:35 PM   
 By:   TerraEpon   (Member)

Naxos released that same little bit on CD.
http://www.naxos.com/catalogue/item.asp?item_code=8.120887

Of course given some of the other threads here that should be a 'bootleg', despite it being legal in the countries they sell it in....

 
 Posted:   Aug 11, 2013 - 4:44 PM   
 By:   Wedge   (Member)

Did I miss something? You are all talking like the release is imminent but the Intrada article about the source material being available was written in 2007.

Doug's post on the Intrada forum dates to yesterday. Are you claiming it's a re-post? Because it specifically mentions the 2013 Criterion Blu-Ray.

 
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