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 Posted:   Sep 25, 2013 - 8:14 AM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

We were discussing how wrong the Oscars are on the music side so I made my own should have won the Best Picture Oscar list just since the start of the blockbuster era, 1977.

I only looked at the nominated pictures here. It looks like the Academy got it wrong 29 times out of 36, at least that is how I feel. I knew they were wrong a lot but they are wrong more often than I thought.

Won - Should Have Won
2012 - "Argo" - Life of Pi / Lincoln Toss up
2011 - "The Artist" - Hugo / Money Ball Toss up
2010 - "The King's Speech" - Toy Story 3 / Inception Toss up
2009 - "The Hurt Locker" - UP
2008 - "Slumdog Millionaire" - Frost Nixon
2007 - "No Country for Old Men" - Michael Clayton
2006 - "The Departed"- The Queen
2005 - "Crash" - Goodnight and Goodluck
2004 - "Million Dollar Baby" - The Aviator
2003 - "The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King"
2002 - "Chicago" - Lord of the Rings Two Towers
2001 - "A Beautiful Mind" - Moulin Rouge
2000 - "Gladiator" - Erin Brockovich
1999 - "American Beauty" - The Insider
1998 - "Shakespeare in Love" - Saving Private Ryan
1997 - "Titanic" - La Confidential
1996 - "The English Patient" - Jerry MaGuire / Fargo Toss up
1995 - "Braveheart" - Babe
1994 - "Forrest Gump"- Quiz Show / Pulp Fiction Toss up
1993 - "Schindler’s List" - The Fuigitve
1992 - "Unforgiven"
1991 - "The Silence of the Lambs" - Beauty and the Beast
1990 - "Dances With Wolves" - Goodfellas
1989 - "Driving Miss Daisy"
1988 - "Rain Man"
1987 - "The Last Emperor" -Hope and Glory /Broadcast News Tossup
1986 - "Platoon" - The Mission
1985 - "Out of Africa" - The Color Purple
1984 - "Amadeus"
1983 - "Terms of Endearment"
1982 - "Gandhi" - The Verdict / ET - Toss up
1981 - "Chariots of Fire" - Raiders of the Lost Ark
1980 - "Ordinary People" - Elephant Man
1979 - "Kramer vs. Kramer" - Apocalypse Now
1978 - "The Deer Hunter"
1977 - "Annie Hall" - Star Wars

 
 Posted:   Sep 25, 2013 - 9:01 AM   
 By:   Jim Phelps   (Member)

Nah, the Academy chose wisely when they selected Annie Hall over Star Wars for Best Picture. One of the few times they truly got it RIGHT.

http://filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=94617&forumID=7&archive=0

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 25, 2013 - 9:10 AM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

Nah, the Academy chose wisely when they selected Annie Hall over Star Wars for Best Picture. One of the few times they truly got it RIGHT.

http://filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=94617&forumID=7&archive=0


I understand what you are saying Jim, I think it is just that I am not very tolerant of Woody Allen's style, the talky neurotic thing just wears thin on me really quick. I know he is a remarkable writer and film maker though.

 
 Posted:   Sep 25, 2013 - 3:53 PM   
 By:   Mark R. Y.   (Member)

Oscar winner - nominee that I prefer - my best of the year irregardless of Oscar nom.

2012: Argo - Les Miserables - The Master
2011: The Artist - The Tree of Life - The Tree of Life
2010: The King's Speech - Inception - Inception
2009: The Hurt Locker - A Serious Man - A Serious Man
2008: Slumdog Millionaire - The Curious Case of Benjamin Button - The Curious Case...
2007: No Country for Old Men - Atonement - Atonement
2006: The Departed - The Departed - The Lives of Others
2005: Crash - Munich - Munich
2004: Million Dollar Baby - Sideways - The Passion of the Christ
2003: The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King - Master and Commander - House of Sand and Fog
2002: Chicago - The Pianist - Russian Ark
2001: A Beautiful Mind - A Beautiful Mind - The Royal Tenenbaums
2000: Gladiator - Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon - Almost Famous
1999: American Beauty - The Green Mile - Magnolia
1998: Shakespeare in Love - The Thin Red Line - The Red Violin
1997: Titanic - L.A. Confidential - L.A. Confidential or The Ice Storm
1996: The English Patient - Jerry Maguire - Jerry Maguire
1995: Braveheart - Braveheart - Braveheart
1994: Forrest Gump - Pulp Fiction or The Shawshank Redemption - The Hudsucker Proxy
1993: Schindler's List - Schindler's List - Schindler's List
1992: Unforgiven - Unforgiven - Chaplin
1991: The Silence of the Lambs - The Prince of Tides - Barton Fink
1990: Dances with Wolves - Goodfellas - Goodfellas
1989: Driving Miss Daisy - Field of Dreams - Field of Dreams
1988: Rain Man - The Accidental Tourist - The Unbearable Lightness of Being
1987: The Last Emperor - Hope and Glory - Au revoir les enfants or Babette's Feast
1986: Platoon - The Mission - Down by Law
1985: Out of Africa - Prizzi's Honor - Brazil
1984: Amadeus - A Passage to India - A Passage to India
1983: Terms of Endearment - The Right Stuff - Nostalghia or The Right Stuff
1982: Gandhi - Tootsie - The Night of the Shooting Stars
1981: Chariots of Fire - Atlantic City - Excalibur
1980: Ordinary People - Raging Bull - Altererd States
1979: Kramer vs. Kramer - Breaking Away - Breaking Away
1978: The Deer Hunter - The Deer Hunter - The Deer Hunter
1977: Annie Hall - Star Wars - Star Wars (sorry, Jim!)
1976: Rocky - Rocky - Rocky
1975: One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest - Dog Day Afternoon - Dog Day Afternoon
1974: The Godfather Part II - The Conversation/The Godfather Part II - same two
1973: The Sting - American Graffiti - American Graffiti or Day for Night
1972: The Godfather - The Godfather - Savage Messiah
1971: The French Connection - The French Connection - Solaris
1970: Patton - Five Easy Pieces - The Conformist

I could go back to the beginning, but my fingers are getting too tired!

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 25, 2013 - 5:05 PM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

Nice list Mark, yeah, that is a lot of work.

 
 Posted:   Sep 25, 2013 - 8:05 PM   
 By:   PhiladelphiaSon   (Member)

How did 1977 become the start of the "blockbuster" era. Never heard of GONE WITH THE WIND, THE TEN COMMANDMENTS, THE SOUND OF MUSIC, etc., etc., etc.?

 
 Posted:   Sep 25, 2013 - 11:47 PM   
 By:   Ron Hardcastle   (Member)

Re: Oscar winner - nominee that I prefer - my best of the year irregardless of Oscar nom.

2012: Argo - Les Miserables - The Master
2011: The Artist - The Tree of Life - The Tree of Life
2010: The King's Speech - Inception - Inception
2009: The Hurt Locker - A Serious Man - A Serious Man
2008: Slumdog Millionaire - The Curious Case of Benjamin Button - The Curious Case...
2007: No Country for Old Men - Atonement - Atonement
2006: The Departed - The Departed - The Lives of Others
2005: Crash - Munich - Munich
2004: Million Dollar Baby - Sideways - The Passion of the Christ
2003: The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King - Master and Commander - House of Sand and Fog
2002: Chicago - The Pianist - Russian Ark
2001: A Beautiful Mind - A Beautiful Mind - The Royal Tenenbaums
2000: Gladiator - Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon - Almost Famous
1999: American Beauty - The Green Mile - Magnolia
1998: Shakespeare in Love - The Thin Red Line - The Red Violin
1997: Titanic - L.A. Confidential - L.A. Confidential or The Ice Storm
1996: The English Patient - Jerry Maguire - Jerry Maguire
1995: Braveheart - Braveheart - Braveheart
1994: Forrest Gump - Pulp Fiction or The Shawshank Redemption - The Hudsucker Proxy
1993: Schindler's List - Schindler's List - Schindler's List
1992: Unforgiven - Unforgiven - Chaplin
1991: The Silence of the Lambs - The Prince of Tides - Barton Fink
1990: Dances with Wolves - Goodfellas - Goodfellas
1989: Driving Miss Daisy - Field of Dreams - Field of Dreams
1988: Rain Man - The Accidental Tourist - The Unbearable Lightness of Being
1987: The Last Emperor - Hope and Glory - Au revoir les enfants or Babette's Feast
1986: Platoon - The Mission - Down by Law
1985: Out of Africa - Prizzi's Honor - Brazil
1984: Amadeus - A Passage to India - A Passage to India
1983: Terms of Endearment - The Right Stuff - Nostalghia or The Right Stuff
1982: Gandhi - Tootsie - The Night of the Shooting Stars
1981: Chariots of Fire - Atlantic City - Excalibur
1980: Ordinary People - Raging Bull - Altererd States
1979: Kramer vs. Kramer - Breaking Away - Breaking Away
1978: The Deer Hunter - The Deer Hunter - The Deer Hunter
1977: Annie Hall - Star Wars - Star Wars (sorry, Jim!)
1976: Rocky - Rocky - Rocky
1975: One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest - Dog Day Afternoon - Dog Day Afternoon
1974: The Godfather Part II - The Conversation/The Godfather Part II - same two
1973: The Sting - American Graffiti - American Graffiti or Day for Night
1972: The Godfather - The Godfather - Savage Messiah
1971: The French Connection - The French Connection - Solaris
1970: Patton - Five Easy Pieces - The Conformist

I could go back to the beginning, but my fingers are getting too tired!


Mark R.Y.:

I thought that ado's list was bad enough, but your's is even worse. Les Miserables? The Master? I simply hated both. The Tree of Life? What a pretentious piece of unwatchable and boring garbage. Benjamin Button? One of the worst movies that Brad Pitt ever made. Atonement? I agree that No Country For Old Men shouldn't have won, but Atonement??? Borrrrrrrinnnnnnnng! Solaris in '71? Probably one of the worst movies I have ever seen in my life. The Passion of the Christ? Jesus! Excaliber? When I saw that one in the theatre, more than halfway through it I turned to a friend and quietly muttered "What a stupid movie," and he snapped "Really!!!" in agreement. Jerry McGuire? Enough with the show me the money!!! Star Wars over Annie Hall? Absolutely not (although I did love Star Wars but Annie Hall is simply amazing). And nothing over "Shakespeare In Love," which, after 15 years, remains my favorite movie of all time.

That isn't to say that I don't disagree with all your preferences. Thought The Pianist deserved better. Have always loved Field of Dreams and can't watch the ending without bawling. And I was horrified that The Silence Of The Lambs won -- detested Jodie Foster's dreadful southern accent and cringed whenever she opened her mouth. And we also agree on Schindler's List, which was monumental, and I've always loved The Shawshank Redemption.

But let's not forget that movies are an art and in the end it's all in the eye of each beholder, and none of us are ever going to agree on which movies or plays or paintings or singers or composers are the best. So, in the end, such postings as the above merely reinforce the truism that it's all in the eye (and ear) of the beholder.

 
 Posted:   Sep 26, 2013 - 12:51 AM   
 By:   Mark R. Y.   (Member)

Ron Hardcastle:

I enjoyed your reaction to my post. You made my some good points, I'd be interested in your comments on my favorite films blog: http://markrussyoung.wordpress.com/

 
 Posted:   Sep 26, 2013 - 1:21 AM   
 By:   Ron Hardcastle   (Member)

Re: Ron Hardcastle:

I enjoyed your reaction to my post. You made my some good points, I'd be interested in your comments on my favorite films blog: http://markrussyoung.wordpress.com/


Will take a look at it ... but it's 1:20 in the morning and I better jump into bed. But that'll be one of the first things I do tomorrow AFTER I listen to a few of my wish list CDs I received today, a couple because of my connection to this great site! So let me look at it when I'm NOT about to fall asleep!

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 26, 2013 - 4:05 AM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

1

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 26, 2013 - 4:05 AM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 26, 2013 - 4:08 AM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

How did 1977 become the start of the "blockbuster" era. Never heard of GONE WITH THE WIND, THE TEN COMMANDMENTS, THE SOUND OF MUSIC, etc., etc., etc.?

Usually the start of the blockbuster era is either Jaws or Star Wars. Those other films you are talking about are nice though. They were blockbusters, but not in the modern era, and besides that, I did not want to type my list back that far. smile

Wikipedia:
" Jaws is regarded as the first film of New Hollywood's "blockbuster era" with its current meaning, implying a film genre.[5] It also consolidated the "summer blockbuster" trend, through which major film studios and distributors planned their entire annual marketing strategy around a big release by July 4.[6]

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 26, 2013 - 4:22 AM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

I think when Shakespeare in Love won everyone was like, huh? That was engineered by Harvey Weinstein. It is the quintessential example of the Academy picking the wrong picture. Saving Private Ryan is the superior picture.

Solaris is a great film. Granted it is not for everyone, but it is a head trip.
Excalibur is easily the best film of Arthurian legends. It was magnificently produced. Again, it is not everyone's cup of tea, what with the nudity, sex and violence, but a remarkable picture as compared to say First Knight or some other soundstage overlit drivel.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 26, 2013 - 7:54 AM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

Re: Oscar winner - nominee that I prefer - my best of the year irregardless of Oscar nom.


1991: The Silence of the Lambs - The Prince of Tides - Barton Fink
I could go back to the beginning, but my fingers are getting too tired!


Mark R.Y.:

I thought that ado's list was bad enough, but your's is even worse. Les Miserables? The Master? I simply hated both. The Tree of Life? What a pretentious piece of unwatchable and boring garbage. Benjamin Button? One of the worst movies that Brad Pitt ever made. Atonement? I agree that No Country For Old Men shouldn't have won, but Atonement??? Borrrrrrrinnnnnnnng! Solaris in '71? Probably one of the worst movies I have ever seen in my life. The Passion of the Christ? Jesus! Excaliber? When I saw that one in the theatre, more than halfway through it I turned to a friend and quietly muttered "What a stupid movie," and he snapped "Really!!!" in agreement. Jerry McGuire? Enough with the show me the money!!! Star Wars over Annie Hall? Absolutely not (although I did love Star Wars but Annie Hall is simply amazing). And nothing over "Shakespeare In Love," which, after 15 years, remains my favorite movie of all time.

That isn't to say that I don't disagree with all your preferences. Thought The Pianist deserved better. Have always loved Field of Dreams and can't watch the ending without bawling. And I was horrified that The Silence Of The Lambs won -- detested Jodie Foster's dreadful southern accent and cringed whenever she opened her mouth. And we also agree on Schindler's List, which was monumental, and I've always loved The Shawshank Redemption.

But let's not forget that movies are an art and in the end it's all in the eye of each beholder, and none of us are ever going to agree on which movies or plays or paintings or singers or composers are the best. So, in the end, such postings as the above merely reinforce the truism that it's all in the eye (and ear) of the beholder.


Beauty and the Beast was far and away the best film, and the most delightful and artful piece of film craft of 1991. Something was very very wrong when they gave the award to Silence of the Lambs. This year and the Shakespeare in Love year were big flashing light indications that the Academy voters were not really engaged in thought any more, but were selling votes based on social pressures or something else. The Oscars are just not relevant any more.

 
 Posted:   Sep 26, 2013 - 8:23 AM   
 By:   OnlyGoodMusic   (Member)

"1977 - "Annie Hall" - Star Wars"

And, right there, any credibility you might have had goes out the window. Star Wars wasn't a best picture of that, or indeed ANY, year.

 
 Posted:   Sep 26, 2013 - 8:39 AM   
 By:   Ron Hardcastle   (Member)

Re: Ron Hardcastle: I enjoyed your reaction to my post. You made my some good points, I'd be interested in your comments on my favorite films blog: http://markrussyoung.wordpress.com/

Mark: As I said I would, one of the first things I did when I got up this morning was to follow your http://markrussyoung.wordpress.com/ link -- my goodness -- you are far more into movies of the 30s than me! For me, the 30s don't exist much beyond THE WIZARD OF OZ and GONE WITH THE WIND, both of which I have their big boxed sets of Blu-rays. Movies are a bigger part of your life than mine. That said, I do have over 4,000 DVDs and approaching 200 Blu-rays, but if I had it to do again, there are lots of DVDs I never would have bought! (But movies -- obviously! l-- used to play a bigger part in y life than they do now.) Thanks!

 
 Posted:   Sep 26, 2013 - 10:02 AM   
 By:   Mark R. Y.   (Member)

Re: Ron Hardcastle: I enjoyed your reaction to my post. You made my some good points, I'd be interested in your comments on my favorite films blog: http://markrussyoung.wordpress.com/

Mark: As I said I would, one of the first things I did when I got up this morning was to follow your http://markrussyoung.wordpress.com/ link -- my goodness -- you are far more into movies of the 30s than me! For me, the 30s don't exist much beyond THE WIZARD OF OZ and GONE WITH THE WIND, both of which I have their big boxed sets of Blu-rays. Movies are a bigger part of your life than mine. That said, I do have over 4,000 DVDs and approaching 200 Blu-rays, but if I had it to do again, there are lots of DVDs I never would have bought! (But movies -- obviously! l-- used to play a bigger part in y life than they do now.) Thanks!


Wow - 4,000 DVDs and almost 200 Blu-rays! Maybe the scope of my interest in films is more than yours, but your media collection is vaster than mine! big grin

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 26, 2013 - 10:15 AM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

"1977 - "Annie Hall" - Star Wars"

And, right there, any credibility you might have had goes out the window. Star Wars wasn't a best picture of that, or indeed ANY, year.


I am not a Star Wars fan, but Star Wars is immensely more entertaining than Annie Hall, and Star Wars has had a much larger impact on movies ever since 1977 than any picture that Woody Allen ever made.

 
 Posted:   Sep 27, 2013 - 8:08 AM   
 By:   Ron Hardcastle   (Member)

Re: "I am not a Star Wars fan, but Star Wars is immensely more entertaining than Annie Hall, and Star Wars has had a much larger impact on movies ever since 1977 than any picture that Woody Allen ever made"

While I, personally, loved STAR WARS, I recognize that there are a lot of people out thee who have no interest in science fiction, and so such films would be on the bottom of their lists (and I adored ANNIE HALL). Others may love (or hate) slasher movies, and the same for film noir, musicals, historical drama, comedy, or any other genre you can name. So, as I've written elsewhere, it's all quite subjective and comes down to what turns you on as a watcher of films. I happen to have loved "Shakespeare In Love," but recognize that a lot of people were bored to death by it. And the same could be written about "Annie Hall" or any other movie one could cite. Some on this stream loved SAVING PRIVATE RYAN and cite various reasons why SHAKESPEARE IN LOVE beat it, but here's my own personal experience with those two movies: I bought the DVD of RYAN the week it was released and never got past the first 20 minutes of the landing at Normandy -- just couldn't take it and shut it off and have never gotten past that point, even when I've come across it during a broadcast. And, for me, I count SHAKESPARE as my favorite movie of all time (recognizing that I love hundreds of other movies). So whether it was Harvey Weinstein buying votes or voters who were actually charmed by it (like me), SHAKESPEARE won that year and I suspect that people will still be watching it a hundred years from now. Someone here cited SOLARIS (the original) as his choice for best picture that year, while I happen to count it among the worst movies I've ever seen. And I'll write this again too: Cinema is an art form and so it's all quite subjective and in the eye of the beholder, and it's pointless to cite conspiracies or to obsess over why one film may receive more votes than another. I believe that Emmanuelle Riva (from AMOUR) had the Oscar stolen from her by voters who probably never watched much of her staggering performance as a once vital woman dying from Alzheimer's, which I feel is up there with Meryl Streep's wins for SOPHIE'S CHOICE and THE IRON LADY. That said, I recognize that there are also people who can't stand Meryl Streep. So, as art, the genre of cinema and its awards comes down to the eye of the beholder. And so it serves little purpose to search for blame for why one film may succeed over another beyond the vagaries of art and how we react to it in our own way.

 
 
 Posted:   Sep 27, 2013 - 8:24 AM   
 By:   Ado   (Member)

@ Ron

Oh, I see where you are coming from. I have a lot of respect for Woody, typing his own scripts, shooting his own films that are really very low cost. He is surely more an idea / relationship film maker that George Lucas ever could be. It comes down to our idea of what 'best picture' might mean I think. When I want a "best picture" I want it to be entertaining and well crafted and transport me into a story.

On a lot of occasions the Academy was tossing best picture award to movies that were, at least to me, very well crafted, well shot with gorgeous production design, probably with some exotic locations and great stars and some A-list director. The problem to me is that a picture can have everything I have just listed and still be a bad picture that is not entertaining, and that will be largely forgotten in 10 years etc. There have been better and worse years for the Academy, but there are years where they are clearly voting for some isolated idea of artistic merit, detached from what people want to see.

Some examples;
The Artist
English Patient
Gandhi
Out of Africa

Of these I think the worse offender year was the English Patient, I mean, what a beautiful film, that is utterly boring and self important. All the rapturously perfect craftsmanship at work, I could not care less.

I have mixed feelings about Lucas, part of me thinks he is a total hack, pasting together, more than creating. But I would say that Star Wars was perhaps successful at changing the idea of what a modern movie was becoming. And it is very entertaining, and it was made with innovation and craft.

 
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