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Posted: |
Jul 29, 2019 - 6:29 AM
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By: |
Ado
(Member)
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The Directors Cut, nice guy that Wise is, is just not the better film. It was a good effort, and I am glad that it made Wise feel better. But in almost every case the first theatrical cut of a picture, even hurried, is the best one. When directors start second guessing and adding and subtracting, it is always worse.
To this day I don't know why ppl prefer director cuts over the theatrical versions. I've yet to see a better film come from all this noodling around.
Even the longer version of The Abyss? 
The longer cut has some interesting material, but, yes, it is the inferior cut because it goes on longer spelling out what was implicit or hinted at or more subtle in the theatrical cut. The longer cut is like; The Abyss for Dummies.
The only revised cut that is clearly superior that I can think of is Blade Runner The Final Cut. Even our beloved Nicholas Meyer did two somewhat different versions of his Trek movies, Wrath of Khan and Undiscovered Country, and both of them were inferior to the first cuts.
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The Directors Cut, nice guy that Wise is, is just not the better film. It was a good effort, and I am glad that it made Wise feel better. But in almost every case the first theatrical cut of a picture, even hurried, is the best one. When directors start second guessing and adding and subtracting, it is always worse. It is really unlikely that Paramount will be paying big bucks to redo the new visual effects for 4k director cut. Hence, unlikely the 4k will be a directors cut, just the original cut.
I felt the DC is actually a very nice, tighter version. However, certain things should have been left alone. The computer alert system was fine as is and we didn't need the TV Series sound effects added. I loved the films new sounds until they started adding them in later movies. Editing out Shatner's "chest thrust" when he moves off the transporter makes it look like he's floating off the pad. Uhura needing a second prodding to shut off the viewer after watching the destruction of Epsilon 9 showed just how dire the emergency was, so cutting that wasn't necessary. Adding a "swoosh" sound to the transporter accident fade actually softened the horror (as did removing Kirk's "oh my god"). Where it worked was in most of the new effects, which really matched nicely and improved those sequences: the asteroid explosion, the abort of the V'Ger bolt, the "orifice" movement as Spock entered (there was no clean way to write that), actually giving us a clear vide of V'Ger (which never really registered in the theatrical) and the amazing "light bridge." Even the San Francisco and Vulcan scenes were very well done and I really wish this FX were rendered in HD. A new version would be great, with re-rendered effects and keeping it closer to the feel of the original film and less like the TV Series.
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STAR TREK - THE MOTION PICTURE is by far my favorite of the STAR TREK movies, I love that it is "more Kubrick" and "less Hornblower", I love its scope and vastness. It's the only STAR TREK movie that really feels like a theatrical epic science-fiction movie.
I understand STAR TREK II is generally the more beloved movie, it had more action, more drive, and was generally more "down to Earth" (ok, please excuse the pun). I like it, but not nearly as much as I love the first one. Some scenes, like Kirk getting reading glasses, were excellent though.
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Posted: |
Jul 29, 2019 - 9:52 AM
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By: |
Solium
(Member)
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STAR TREK - THE MOTION PICTURE is by far my favorite of the STAR TREK movies, I love that it is "more Kubrick" and "less Hornblower", I love its scope and vastness. It's the only STAR TREK movie that really feels like a theatrical epic science-fiction movie.
I understand STAR TREK II is generally the more beloved movie, it had more action, more drive, and was generally more "down to Earth" (ok, please excuse the pun). I like it, but not nearly as much as I love the first one. Some scenes, like Kirk getting reading glasses, were excellent though.
For me TMP and WOK are like my children. I can't choose one over the other. I acknowledge both are very different but I love both equally.
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For me TMP and WOK are like my children. I can't choose one over the other. I acknowledge both are very different but I love both equally.
Same. Two great experiences, I'm sure colored by nostalgia a bit. Being a fan who waited impatiently for Star Trek to return, I was just thrilled to see everyone back. The Enterprise was a legit character to many of us, that tour around it was worth sitting there. The music ain't so bad either. 
Back then, Star Trek films were an event. The temporary end of a drought and the return of old friends.
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Posted: |
Jul 29, 2019 - 12:48 PM
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By: |
Ado
(Member)
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The Directors Cut, nice guy that Wise is, is just not the better film. It was a good effort, and I am glad that it made Wise feel better. But in almost every case the first theatrical cut of a picture, even hurried, is the best one. When directors start second guessing and adding and subtracting, it is always worse. It is really unlikely that Paramount will be paying big bucks to redo the new visual effects for 4k director cut. Hence, unlikely the 4k will be a directors cut, just the original cut.
I felt the DC is actually a very nice, tighter version. However, certain things should have been left alone. The computer alert system was fine as is and we didn't need the TV Series sound effects added. I loved the films new sounds until they started adding them in later movies. Editing out Shatner's "chest thrust" when he moves off the transporter makes it look like he's floating off the pad. Uhura needing a second prodding to shut off the viewer after watching the destruction of Epsilon 9 showed just how dire the emergency was, so cutting that wasn't necessary. Adding a "swoosh" sound to the transporter accident fade actually softened the horror (as did removing Kirk's "oh my god"). Where it worked was in most of the new effects, which really matched nicely and improved those sequences: the asteroid explosion, the abort of the V'Ger bolt, the "orifice" movement as Spock entered (there was no clean way to write that), actually giving us a clear vide of V'Ger (which never really registered in the theatrical) and the amazing "light bridge." Even the San Francisco and Vulcan scenes were very well done and I really wish this FX were rendered in HD. A new version would be great, with re-rendered effects and keeping it closer to the feel of the original film and less like the TV Series.
I like the cleaned up matte lines, that needed to be done, and some finishing out of the SF station, but all of that work to expand or explain Vger's corridors were big mistake, explaining and showing things that our minds wondered about for years.
If I could have my way I would have the theatrical cut -exactly the same, but with a few visual effects cleanups. The pacing on the original cut is actually better
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Actually, I appreciated seeing the full V'Ger ship because I never got a good feeling of where they were or what they were traveling over.
And I really love the "Spock tears" moment, it's a key scene for his arc and losing that was a mistake.
The self destruct order was actually not necessary since it's never mentioned or cancelled. But overall, the characters got some more fleshing out in the expanded versions, which I really enjoyed. I would love a blu-ray of all three versions.
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The Directors Cut, nice guy that Wise is, is just not the better film. It was a good effort, and I am glad that it made Wise feel better. But in almost every case the first theatrical cut of a picture, even hurried, is the best one. When directors start second guessing and adding and subtracting, it is always worse.
To this day I don't know why ppl prefer director cuts over the theatrical versions. I've yet to see a better film come from all this noodling around.
Without a doubt, both the directors cut of "Kingdom of Heaven" and "Once Upon a Time in America" not only are better films than their theatrical cut counterparts, some even dare say they are near classics if not outright.. The theatrical cuts don't carry a candle compared to their "restored" versions.
Lots of director's cuts clearly improved on the theatrical cut... BLADE RUNNER was WAY better in both its later cuts ("director's"/"final"), likewise KINGDOM OF HEAVEN was in a completely different league. "Director's Cuts" tend to be then particularly of value, if the director's original vision was meddled with by the studio.
I prefer the STAR TREK - THE MOTION PICTURE director's cut to the theatrical cut simply because it seems a more polished affair.
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