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 Posted:   Mar 12, 2019 - 8:04 AM   
 By:   joan hue   (Member)

I need to explain “do it all.” I can’t fit all the criteria in the title.

What I mean is are there any composers left who do the following:

Is there a composer who composes the whole score with out other composers adding new material?

This very same composer should orchestrate the whole score and not use any outside orchestrators.

This same composer ALSO conducts or is the conductor for this score.

Are there any composers still alive who do the above three parts of film scores? I’m thinking Morricone may still do the above three if he still is composing. I do realize the short time schedules often lead a composer to using outside resources. Still, it is hard to not admire composers who can do it all, and I can’t help wondering if doing all aspects of a film score is now a lost art form because of the pressures of time and scheduling.

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 12, 2019 - 8:14 AM   
 By:   Kev McGann   (Member)

Zimmer!!!

(sorry Joan, couldn't resist) wink

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 12, 2019 - 8:15 AM   
 By:   joan hue   (Member)

LOL, Kev. I can see Bill's influence is rubbing off on you. Beware.

 
 Posted:   Mar 12, 2019 - 8:53 AM   
 By:   Nicolai P. Zwar   (Member)

All classically trained composers (of course, not all composers are "classically trained") can do orchestration, so if they don't actually do it, it's more often time constraints and other practical considerations that prevent them from doing so.
Basically, composers like Jerry Goldsmith or John Williams did all their orchestration too. Yeah, I know they had Herb Spencer, Arthur Morten and Alexander Courage, but usually, they just fleshed out the detailed sketches, they did not decide on instrumentation or any other aspect. (With some notable exceptions, of course; as Goldsmith mentioning Morton's contribution on some of the choral parts for THE OMEN.)

I know Ennio Morricone never uses orchestrators, and Howard Shore or Thomas Newman usually do their own orchestration and conduct their scores as well.

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 12, 2019 - 9:04 AM   
 By:   Kev McGann   (Member)

Thomas Newman did use Thomas Pasatieri as orchestrator for many years and may? use JAC Redford? presently.
Howard Shore is the one who generally does all his own stuff, Nic.

 
 Posted:   Mar 12, 2019 - 9:35 AM   
 By:   Yavar Moradi   (Member)

Howard Shore is who immediately came to mind for me, though occasionally he has used orchestrators, like on Hobbit 2 & 3. (But all LotR and Hobbit 1 were orchestrated by him alone).

Yavar

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 12, 2019 - 9:35 AM   
 By:   Paul MacLean   (Member)

Well, "orchestrating" is a fluid term, and varies from composer to composer.

As others mentioned above, there are composers who work with orchestrators, but they write sketches with complete "shorthand" instructions, in which case the orchestrator is essentially a secretary / proofreader / copyist. Their role is merely to save the composer time (which is precious when facing the kind of schedules imposed by a film production). Even Aaron Copland used an orchestrator in this way. Mahler also worked this way writing his concert works.

I don't know of any one composer who has "done it all" throughout their whole career. Herrmann prided himself on doing all his own orchestration, but Alexander Courage assisted him on North By Northwest (while Andre Previn wrote some source music for one scene). On Taxi Driver, Christopher Palmer did a good deal or arranging (owing to Herrmann's health and inexperience in jazz).

John Scott has rarely worked with an orchestrator, though he employed John Fiddy on White Water Summer (presumable because time was short -- sadly the score was not used).

Morricone also writes in full score, but enlisted one of his children as co-composer on Cinema Paradiso, so he didn't do everything himself all the time either.

Rachel Portman does all her own orchestrating -- but does not conduct.

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 12, 2019 - 10:15 AM   
 By:   joan hue   (Member)

Sounds like we do have a few composers who have died that usually did it all but now and then had to rely on at least an orchestrator. I hadn't realized that Shore and Newman did "almost" all of the aspects I mentioned.

Also, I have heard of what Paul mentioned. Certain composers flesh out orchestrations but there is some kind of a proof reader orchestrator that helps.

 
 Posted:   Mar 12, 2019 - 10:52 AM   
 By:   Nicolai P. Zwar   (Member)

Again, if it's a classically trained composer, they know orchestration, they just don't always have the time to do it themselves. Sketches by composers like Jerry Goldsmith were more like LEGO assembly instructions: it's layed out for the orchestrator what goes where, he just has to "put the bricks together". Not much room for interpretation.

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 12, 2019 - 11:30 AM   
 By:   joan hue   (Member)

"Put the bricks together" seems like a perfect image. "Classically trained" also makes sense, Nicolai.

 
 Posted:   Mar 12, 2019 - 12:34 PM   
 By:   Yavar Moradi   (Member)

It's also worth pointing out that when Jerry Goldsmith began (early TV as well as his early scores for low budget films), he was doing 100% of his own orchestration, no one even "putting the bricks together" in the way he instructed. I wonder actually what the first time was that he used an orchestrator...

Yavar

 
 Posted:   Mar 12, 2019 - 1:14 PM   
 By:   WagnerAlmighty   (Member)

I'm not even in the same universe as the composers mentioned, but I do it all myself.

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 12, 2019 - 3:58 PM   
 By:   Tall Guy   (Member)

I don't know of any one composer who has "done it all" throughout their whole career.

..............

Morricone also writes in full score, but enlisted one of his children as co-composer on Cinema Paradiso, so he didn't do everything himself all the time either.



Wow - tough crowd! One score out of almost 500!

Actually, if you’re going to accuse Morricone of appalling lassitude smile you could mention that Nicolai conducted many of his works up to the point where they parted ways, and that Gillo Pontecorvo whistled the simple yet haunting hook in Ali’s Theme from The Battle of Algiers.

That lazy old Ennio - always sozzled on Barolo while an army of assistants try to decipher his shaky scrawl!

 
 Posted:   Mar 12, 2019 - 4:03 PM   
 By:   Mr. Marshall   (Member)

Morricone he a phoney
Let others do the work
But he take all de money

 
 Posted:   Mar 13, 2019 - 3:02 AM   
 By:   Nicolai P. Zwar   (Member)

I understood the question more along the lines of "film composers that do it all", so those who not only compose their music, but also orchestrate and conduct it. Of course, hardly any film composer does ALL of it ALL the time. Bruno Nicolai collaborated with Morricone, Conrad Pope conducted parts 2 & 3 of Shore's music for THE HOBBIT. Bernard Herrmann co-composed with Alfred Newman, and so on. Just about every film composer of rank has worked and works at times with other composers, orchestrators, conductors, etc.

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 13, 2019 - 3:11 AM   
 By:   jb1234   (Member)

Don Davis did all three for The Matrix. I believe he brought in orchestrators for the sequels though (likely due to time constraints).

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 13, 2019 - 4:57 AM   
 By:   governor   (Member)

Pierre Adenot
Frederic Talgorn
Justin Hurwitz
Philippe Rombi
Ennio Morricone

 
 
 Posted:   Mar 13, 2019 - 5:28 AM   
 By:   Tall Guy   (Member)

Morricone he a phoney
Let others do the work
But he take all de money



That rhymes visually but not audibly.

 
 Posted:   Mar 13, 2019 - 7:06 AM   
 By:   DavidCoscina   (Member)

I'm not even in the same universe as the composers mentioned, but I do it all myself.

Me too. smile

 
 Posted:   Mar 13, 2019 - 7:11 AM   
 By:   WagnerAlmighty   (Member)

I'm not even in the same universe as the composers mentioned, but I do it all myself.

Me too. smile


All but the conducting (which I probably should have mentioned earlier); the arranging, composition, orchestration, performance notes, keeping on certain instrumentalists about the way I want the music played...all me.

 
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