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 Posted:   Oct 2, 2013 - 4:17 PM   
 By:   Joe Caps   (Member)


two things - dones anyone know if the "Carrol Baker" vocals are included.
Has Intrada mentioned who is singing for her ?

UK fans who mentined seeing the film-

was this film stereo when you saw it?

 
 Posted:   Oct 3, 2013 - 6:19 PM   
 By:   CH-CD   (Member)

two things - dones anyone know if the "Carrol Baker" vocals are included.
Has Intrada mentioned who is singing for her ?

UK fans who mentined seeing the film-

was this film stereo when you saw it?



Too long ago to remember....but, it probably wasn't. Not in the local theatre I saw it in anyway.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 4, 2013 - 9:29 PM   
 By:   philiperic   (Member)

two things - dones anyone know if the "Carrol Baker" vocals are included.
Has Intrada mentioned who is singing for her ?

UK fans who mentined seeing the film-

was this film stereo when you saw it?


Joe, the songs are included but the singer is not identified.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 6, 2013 - 2:05 AM   
 By:   manderley   (Member)

Latest news from Warner Archive about THE MIRACLE DVD release:

"Restoration has been stalled due to technical issues that have yet to be resolved. Very frustrating, but we're not giving up...."




I have just come across a piece of information that might be our answer to the unresolved "technical issues" problem relating to THE MIRACLE.

But let's go backward a few moments.

As we all know, in the late 1940s, and throughout the 1950s, many creative people were blacklisted in Hollywood. Many of the behind-the-camera people managed to get work either by assigning their projects to surrogate friends who would stand in for them on the screen credit listings or by using pseudonyms on the screens for themselves.

In the 1990s and into the early 2000s, a Committee of the Writer's Guild of America sought to correct the screen credits of the pictures which had these false credits assigned at the time of their original release, to give the authors proper credit in history. There were 100 + films, many of them major efforts, which fell into this category.

In addition to correcting the credits for the historical record, the Guild also demanded that if the film in question were to have a further financial life, the credit must be corrected on the screen itself.

In the intervening years, I'm not sure how well the WGA has been monitoring these films for this issue, but I am aware of a number of films which have, in fact, had their onscreen credits changed. Some of them have been really excellent, totally undetectable jobs of recreating the original type fonts, layout, and backgrounds, and a few have not:

Corrected---and done extremely well: THE ROBE, ROMAN HOLIDAY, FRIENDLY PERSUASION, THE BRIDGE ON THE RIVER KWAI, LAWRENCE OF ARABIA.

Corrected---but done not-so-well: BROKEN ARROW (1950)

THE MIRACLE is one of the films that needs to have its writing credits changed.

The WGA lists this change as follows:

THE MIRACLE (WB)

Original Credit: Screenplay by Frank Butler. Based on the play by Karl Vollmoeller as produced on the stage by Max Reinhardt.
(1959)

Corrected Credit: Screenplay by Frank Butler & Jean Rouverol. Based on the play by Karl Vollmoeller as produced on the stage by Max Reinhardt.
(07/27/98)



I'm guessing that the possible delay in re-mastering THE MIRACLE is budgetary (and creative), and specifically, the extra money it will cost to---depending on the situation---recreate the title backgrounds, find a type font to match into what exists, and do the final corrections, matching color and lettering size and image quality---likely all in the CGI/digital realm.

This is no mean feat. You must find the original negative rolls of textless title backgrounds in the vault (if you can), or create an overall new background, and then re-lay all of the titles from their separate title rolls, adding in the new sections required in their proper positions, or draw new art and re-shoot the whole darn thing from scratch.

This kind of thing is costly and time consuming, and you then have to decide whether THE MIRACLE is worth investing additional money into it for a very limited financial income.


Of course, I'm just speculating that this is the reason for the delay. It may be, on the other hand, that there is a giant scratch in the center of the negative from beginning to end of each alternate reel! But, since Technirama is a horizontal negative process, the scratch would naturally be from right to left across the center of the frame in the projected print---and plenty annoying! smile

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 6, 2013 - 3:49 AM   
 By:   CinemaScope   (Member)

I think the main problem with restoring The Miracle is that Warner have just so many movies to work on, thousands in fact. All those Errol Flynn, Marx Brothers, Busby Berkeley movies, & so many films that people have actually heard of, Yankee Doodle Dandy, Bad Day At Black Rock, Mister Roberts, They Were Expendable, She Wore A Yellow Ribbon, all those MGM swashbucklers...The Great Race. The list goes on forever. The Miracle is not going to happen, & if I'm honest I'm not that bothered.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 6, 2013 - 12:17 PM   
 By:   philiperic   (Member)

I think the main problem with restoring The Miracle is that Warner have just so many movies to work on, thousands in fact. All those Errol Flynn, Marx Brothers, Busby Berkeley movies, & so many films that people have actually heard of, Yankee Doodle Dandy, Bad Day At Black Rock, Mister Roberts, They Were Expendable, She Wore A Yellow Ribbon, all those MGM swashbucklers...The Great Race. The list goes on forever. The Miracle is not going to happen, & if I'm honest I'm not that bothered.

All those films have already been released on dvd - Im not aware any of them are in need of restoration. In fact, some of these may soon be issued on BR - such as GREAT RACE or SHE WORE A YELLOW RIBBON.

THE MIRACLE has not been issued on dvd ever but WB archives is trying to do just that , your negative comments not withstanding.

I think, Manderley, that you may be right .

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 6, 2013 - 4:05 PM   
 By:   CinemaScope   (Member)

I think the main problem with restoring The Miracle is that Warner have just so many movies to work on, thousands in fact. All those Errol Flynn, Marx Brothers, Busby Berkeley movies, & so many films that people have actually heard of, Yankee Doodle Dandy, Bad Day At Black Rock, Mister Roberts, They Were Expendable, She Wore A Yellow Ribbon, all those MGM swashbucklers...The Great Race. The list goes on forever. The Miracle is not going to happen, & if I'm honest I'm not that bothered.

All those films have already been released on dvd - Im not aware any of them are in need of restoration. IN fact, some of these may soon be issued on BR - such as GREAT RACE or SHE WORE A YELLOW RIBBON.

TH MIRACLE has not been issued on dvd ever but WB archives is trying to do just that , your negative comments not withstanding.

I think, Manderley, that you may be right .


Oh that's just silly, I'm not being negative, that's just the way it is. I suppose The Miracle may just have a chance as a Warner DVD archive release, & if so I hope you buy it & enjoy it. I'd jump for joy if The Great Race & She Wore A Yellow Ribbon were released on Blu-ray, & I'm sure it will happen, but soon? Do you know something I don't?

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 6, 2013 - 5:13 PM   
 By:   philiperic   (Member)

I think the main problem with restoring The Miracle is that Warner have just so many movies to work on, thousands in fact. All those Errol Flynn, Marx Brothers, Busby Berkeley movies, & so many films that people have actually heard of, Yankee Doodle Dandy, Bad Day At Black Rock, Mister Roberts, They Were Expendable, She Wore A Yellow Ribbon, all those MGM swashbucklers...The Great Race. The list goes on forever. The Miracle is not going to happen, & if I'm honest I'm not that bothered.

All those films have already been released on dvd - Im not aware any of them are in need of restoration. IN fact, some of these may soon be issued on BR - such as GREAT RACE or SHE WORE A YELLOW RIBBON.

TH MIRACLE has not been issued on dvd ever but WB archives is trying to do just that , your negative comments not withstanding.

I think, Manderley, that you may be right .


Oh that's just silly, I'm not being negative, that's just the way it is. I suppose The Miracle may just have a chance as a Warner DVD archive release, & if so I hope you buy it & enjoy it. I'd jump for joy if The Great Race & She Wore A Yellow Ribbon were released on Blu-ray, & I'm sure it will happen, but soon? Do you know something I don't?


Cinemascope - "THE MIRACLE is not going to happen and if I'm being honest, I'm not that bothered." "That's just the way it is."

How would you characterize your comments? Positive? what is the source of your information?

I get it - you dont care about it being released - fine . But do you actually have any insider info on its release ? If not , I stand by my charcterization of "negative".

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 7, 2013 - 1:56 AM   
 By:   CinemaScope   (Member)


I get it - you dont care about it being released - fine . But do you actually have any insider info on its release ? If not , I stand by my charcterization of "negative".


Ha, I'm reminded why I don't visit here very often these days.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 7, 2013 - 6:20 AM   
 By:   Joe Caps   (Member)


I got the CD on Saturday - marvelous !!!!!

The liner notes name every person playing in the orchestra, but don't tell us who is singing for Carroll Baker. I would love to know.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 22, 2013 - 12:32 PM   
 By:   philiperic   (Member)

Latest news from Warner Archive about THE MIRACLE DVD release:

"Restoration has been stalled due to technical issues that have yet to be resolved. Very frustrating, but we're not giving up...."




I have just come across a piece of information that might be our answer to the unresolved "technical issues" problem relating to THE MIRACLE.

But let's go backward a few moments.

As we all know, in the late 1940s, and throughout the 1950s, many creative people were blacklisted in Hollywood. Many of the behind-the-camera people managed to get work either by assigning their projects to surrogate friends who would stand in for them on the screen credit listings or by using pseudonyms on the screens for themselves.

In the 1990s and into the early 2000s, a Committee of the Writer's Guild of America sought to correct the screen credits of the pictures which had these false credits assigned at the time of their original release, to give the authors proper credit in history. There were 100 + films, many of them major efforts, which fell into this category.

In addition to correcting the credits for the historical record, the Guild also demanded that if the film in question were to have a further financial life, the credit must be corrected on the screen itself.

In the intervening years, I'm not sure how well the WGA has been monitoring these films for this issue, but I am aware of a number of films which have, in fact, had their onscreen credits changed. Some of them have been really excellent, totally undetectable jobs of recreating the original type fonts, layout, and backgrounds, and a few have not:

Corrected---and done extremely well: THE ROBE, ROMAN HOLIDAY, FRIENDLY PERSUASION, THE BRIDGE ON THE RIVER KWAI, LAWRENCE OF ARABIA.

Corrected---but done not-so-well: BROKEN ARROW (1950)

THE MIRACLE is one of the films that needs to have its writing credits changed.

The WGA lists this change as follows:

THE MIRACLE (WB)

Original Credit: Screenplay by Frank Butler. Based on the play by Karl Vollmoeller as produced on the stage by Max Reinhardt.
(1959)

Corrected Credit: Screenplay by Frank Butler & Jean Rouverol. Based on the play by Karl Vollmoeller as produced on the stage by Max Reinhardt.
(07/27/98)



I'm guessing that the possible delay in re-mastering THE MIRACLE is budgetary (and creative), and specifically, the extra money it will cost to---depending on the situation---recreate the title backgrounds, find a type font to match into what exists, and do the final corrections, matching color and lettering size and image quality---likely all in the CGI/digital realm.

This is no mean feat. You must find the original negative rolls of textless title backgrounds in the vault (if you can), or create an overall new background, and then re-lay all of the titles from their separate title rolls, adding in the new sections required in their proper positions, or draw new art and re-shoot the whole darn thing from scratch.

This kind of thing is costly and time consuming, and you then have to decide whether THE MIRACLE is worth investing additional money into it for a very limited financial income.


Of course, I'm just speculating that this is the reason for the delay. It may be, on the other hand, that there is a giant scratch in the center of the negative from beginning to end of each alternate reel! But, since Technirama is a horizontal negative process, the scratch would naturally be from right to left across the center of the frame in the projected print---and plenty annoying! smile


Manderley , you are correct - I had this confirmed by a representative at Warner Archive that this film and 4 -5 others have this technical issue -- a change in the credits - and this is what is preventing their release. They said that one such film - they did not mention the title ( perhaps THE CONSTANT NYMPH) -was just recently released. And the offered encouragement that THE MIRACLE would be eventually released.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 22, 2013 - 4:42 PM   
 By:   Rozsaphile   (Member)

I thought that THE CONSTANT NYMPH was a different case. The adaptation rights for Margaret Kennedy's novel had not been secured in perpetuity and had to be renegotiated. Broadcast premiere was just last year.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 22, 2013 - 9:19 PM   
 By:   philiperic   (Member)

I thought that THE CONSTANT NYMPH was a different case. The adaptation rights for Margaret Kennedy's novel had not been secured in perpetuity and had to be renegotiated. Broadcast premiere was just last year.

I said "perhaps". Here is the exact message --

"....We have five films that have been stalled for several years due these kind of issues. One that was in that state of paralysis finally just got released, so be assured we don't give up on these problem projects. Thanks. "

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 26, 2013 - 2:34 AM   
 By:   DavidRayner1947   (Member)

This is a strange reason on Warner's part for holding back the release of the DVD, because about 20 years ago, they released a pan and scan transfer of the film on VHS video and that had the original credits on it. So why not issue the film on DVD as originally released, but with ammended credits on the back cover of the DVD insert card?

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 26, 2013 - 5:38 AM   
 By:   OnyaBirri   (Member)

Late to the party.

Is "Tocata for Toy Trains" included, as it is on the LP?

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 26, 2013 - 8:09 AM   
 By:   Joe Caps   (Member)

Late to the party and confused.

We are talking here the first release of the actual soundtrack to the Miracle.
Not eh Bernstein club truncated recording with Toccatta as filler.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 26, 2013 - 8:10 AM   
 By:   DavidRayner1947   (Member)

No, just the score for "The Miracle", the original soundtrack score this time.

 
 Posted:   Oct 26, 2013 - 8:16 AM   
 By:   orbital   (Member)

=> http://store.intrada.com/s.nl/it.A/id.8094/.f

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 26, 2013 - 2:18 PM   
 By:   OnyaBirri   (Member)

Late to the party and confused.

We are talking here the first release of the actual soundtrack to the Miracle.
Not eh Bernstein club truncated recording with Toccatta as filler.


A score to a Charles and Ray Eames film is never filler in my book, Joey.

I'll hunt down the LP.

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 26, 2013 - 8:26 PM   
 By:   philiperic   (Member)

This is a strange reason on Warner's part for holding back the release of the DVD, because about 20 years ago, they released a pan and scan transfer of the film on VHS video and that had the original credits on it. So why not issue the film on DVD as originally released, but with ammended credits on the back cover of the DVD insert card?

I am sure that it isnt that simple - I do not think that your suggestion is feasible -- the actual credits need correcting on the film.

If the reason is indeed this credits correction, then there is nothing strange going on - read Manderley's explanation. Warners is not deliberately holding off the DVD release - a legal technicality is.

 
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