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 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 2:18 AM   
 By:   Jerome Piroue   (Member)

ENDLESS NIGHT is the most pressing need. It is just about the only Herrmann score to have never been available on LP or CD, not even in suite form. Ditto COMPANIONS IN NIGHTMARE.

The latter should come at some point, tapes sound great.


Where do you know this from? It's te 1st time I ever read/hear of COMPANIONS IN NIGHTMARE.

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 5:30 AM   
 By:   TerraEpon   (Member)


... and orchestrated. That's the reconstruction part.
In most cases, only the composers sheet music is preserved. Someone like Leigh Phillips of Tadlow wll do a better job at explaining this, since this is how he makes some of his living with.



Right, but the blurb says it's already fully orchestrated, which is where the question is arrived in the first place. I'm fully aware that usually what's laying around is a short score, but going by what's said, it's already in full score.
In other words, did the person who did the 'reconstruction' have to do the work normally associated with this (i.e. go back to the movie and painstakingly try and figure out what the original orchestration actually was) or is it a simple matter of editing things to fix errors, tidy it up, etc?

 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 5:49 AM   
 By:   Frank DeWald   (Member)


... and orchestrated. That's the reconstruction part.
In most cases, only the composers sheet music is preserved. Someone like Leigh Phillips of Tadlow wll do a better job at explaining this, since this is how he makes some of his living with.



Right, but the blurb says it's already fully orchestrated, which is where the question is arrived in the first place. I'm fully aware that usually what's laying around is a short score, but going by what's said, it's already in full score.
In other words, did the person who did the 'reconstruction' have to do the work normally associated with this (i.e. go back to the movie and painstakingly try and figure out what the original orchestration actually was) or is it a simple matter of editing things to fix errors, tidy it up, etc?


Yes, sometimes it is a matter of taking something down by ear (an incredible skill if someone--like Nic Raine and Leigh Phillips--has it) and/or a "matter of editing things to fix errors" (often the case with Tiomkin, who's manuscript is notoriously hard to decipher!), but in this case it was primarily a matter of reconstructing the score in a different medium: digital. Not as in digital audio, but as in a computer notation program such as Finale or Sibelius (to be honest, I don't know which was used in this case) from which a full score and a set of parts can be generated with a keystroke.

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 6:39 AM   
 By:   waxmanman35   (Member)


Yes, sometimes it is a matter of taking something down by ear (an incredible skill if someone--like Nic Raine and Leigh Phillips--has it) and/or a "matter of editing things to fix errors" (often the case with Tiomkin, who's manuscript is notoriously hard to decipher!), but in this case it was primarily a matter of reconstructing the score in a different medium: digital. Not as in digital audio, but as in a computer notation program such as Finale or Sibelius (to be honest, I don't know which was used in this case) from which a full score and a set of parts can be generated with a keystroke.


"Reconstructing" usually implies recreating something that no longer fully exists. What you describe would be described as the ordinary work of a copyist - creating parts and fair copy from the full score, whether done by computer software "digitally" or with pen and ink.

 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 7:59 AM   
 By:   robertmro   (Member)

For my money I’d rather see a new recording of “On Dangerous Ground” than “Endless Night”.
While I’ve never seen “Endless Night”, “On Dangerous Ground” is a very rich score where Herrmann experimented with many new motifs.

“On Dangerous Ground” is also a great film.

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 8:05 AM   
 By:   paul rossen   (Member)

For my money I’d rather see a new recording of “On Deadly Ground” than “Endless Night”.
While I’ve never seen “Endless Night”, “On Deadly Ground” is a very rich score where Herrmann experimented with many new motifs.

“On Deadly Ground” is also a great film.



Believe you are referring to On Dangerous Ground...

 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 8:15 AM   
 By:   robertmro   (Member)

For my money I’d rather see a new recording of “On Deadly Ground” than “Endless Night”.
While I’ve never seen “Endless Night”, “On Deadly Ground” is a very rich score where Herrmann experimented with many new motifs.

“On Deadly Ground” is also a great film.



Believe you are referring to On Dangerous Ground...


Oops, a senior moment. Will fix.

Thanks

 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 8:32 AM   
 By:   Guenther K   (Member)

ENDLESS NIGHT is the most pressing need. It is just about the only Herrmann score to have never been available on LP or CD, not even in suite form. Ditto COMPANIONS IN NIGHTMARE.

The latter should come at some point, tapes sound great.


Where do you know this from? It's te 1st time I ever read/hear of COMPANIONS IN NIGHTMARE.


Heard them, no I don't have them. Can't say more.

 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 9:14 AM   
 By:   Last Child   (Member)

ENDLESS NIGHT is the most pressing need. It is just about the only Herrmann score to have never been available on LP or CD, not even in suite form. Ditto COMPANIONS IN NIGHTMARE.

The latter should come at some point, tapes sound great.


Where do you know this from? It's te 1st time I ever read/hear of COMPANIONS IN NIGHTMARE.


Heard them, no I don't have them. Can't say more.


So you're saying someone whom you trust (since you wouldnt spread rumors) says they sound great. Is this going to be another Stylotone vinyl deluxe package with possibly a bonus cd?

 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 9:16 AM   
 By:   SchiffyM   (Member)

I think he pretty clearly said he heard them.

 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 9:18 AM   
 By:   Last Child   (Member)

Not that clear - his statements sounds like Yoda, " Heard them, no..." But thanks for the kick in the teeth as usual.

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 9:36 AM   
 By:   Jim Cleveland   (Member)

I second that... I hope to hell it's not going to be a "styrofoam" release!

 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 9:53 AM   
 By:   SchiffyM   (Member)

Not that clear - his statements sounds like Yoda, " Heard them, no..." But thanks for the kick in the teeth as usual.

Oh, please stop acting like I've attacked you. If you lop off half of his sentence, yes, it makes the meaning confusing. But his full sentence is clear: "Heard them, no I don't have them." The comma separates the hearing from the having.

I mean, you could lop off the first five words and say "So you admit you have them!" But that's creative editing, and not what he said.

 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 10:42 AM   
 By:   Sirusjr   (Member)

I'm excited for this. Velazquez did some amazing work on the previous recordings. I hope this sells well and leads to other Herrmann releases.

 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 11:00 AM   
 By:   Frank DeWald   (Member)



"Reconstructing" usually implies recreating something that no longer fully exists. What you describe would be described as the ordinary work of a copyist - creating parts and fair copy from the full score, whether done by computer software "digitally" or with pen and ink.


Ruben Villar and Fernando Velazquez spent many hours painstakingly reconstructing the score using not only Herrmann's manuscript (which was not always easy to decipher), but also the film and the M&E track. It no doubt involved adding articulations, dynamics, tempo and expression markings in order to ensure that the performance closely resembled that in the film. Where there were differences between the film recording and the manuscript (including a few orchestration changes that were probably made on the fly during the original sessions), the decision of what to record lay with Fernando. It was far more than the "ordinary work of a copyist."

Who would have thought that a simple word in ad copy could prove so ... interesting!

 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 11:20 AM   
 By:   Doug Raynes   (Member)

For those who don't read the Herrmann Forum, by a remarkable coincidence, William Stromberg was due to record THE BRIDE WORE BLACK. He posted today to say that:

"I just found out about this recording yesterday and, although I'm happy for this team, I was a bit depressed because I wanted to record it next year. I think it would be foolish to do another one now. I'm sorry. I will be thinking of some other Herrmann scores, including Endless Night. No promises though.
Bill"

 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 12:02 PM   
 By:   Stephen Woolston   (Member)

I am also really, really excited for this and am totally supporting this with my wallet.

Cheers

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 12:12 PM   
 By:   Jim Cleveland   (Member)

Someone on the Herrmann messageboard stated that Bill Stromberg announced on HIS facebook page a few days ago that HE was getting ready to rerecord The Bride Wore Black! Now THAT'S an interesting development!!!

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 12:15 PM   
 By:   Jim Cleveland   (Member)

Just checked that thread, and Bill chimed in... here's what he wrote:

"Hi Everyone,
Yes, I'm afraid Jim is right. I just found out about this recording yesterday and, although I'm happy for this team, I was a bit depressed because I wanted to record it next year. I think it would be foolish to do another one now. I'm sorry. I will be thinking of some other Herrmann scores, including Endless Night. No promises though.
Bill"


 
 
 Posted:   Dec 11, 2018 - 12:29 PM   
 By:   ROBERT Z   (Member)

Ouch ! That's sad for him .

 
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